March 11th, 2016, 15:44
(This post was last modified: March 11th, 2016, 15:46 by Seravy.)
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When a ship would enter combat in a city, it is set to "not involved" and does not participate.
However, if the same ship would enter combat on land OUTSIDE the city, it can fight.
This is inconsistent, and I'm not sure if it should fight in both cases (it cannot move anyway, but I see no reason why the cannons can't fire at the enemy) or not fight in either case (probably closer to the original game).
The problem with the former is, although it makes more sense, it would be possible to garrison cities with ships as long as they don't leave for sea and they aren't meant for doing that. The latter would be a better option for gameplay, and it's a rare situation (ships won't be able to enter land outside the city unless they had a flight or wraithform buff which got dispelled).
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I don't think ships should be able to fight on land, period. If you care about realism, cannons and ballistas on the ships are meant to use the maneuverability of the ship to help aim. I'd go as far as to say that a ship that finds itself on land at the end of a turn ought to die the same as land units in water.
That behavior would require some AI adjustments, though. I've occasionally seen AI cities garrisoned with ships for multiple turns in 1.5.
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I think my ideal would be to have battles in a near-water area (possibly including rivers) have an area (perhaps a row of tiles along the left or right edge) that is water and can contain ships. That seems likely to be difficult, though.
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Fixed this one, ships on land cannot fight, regardless of cities, unless flying or noncorporeal.
While testing, I also noticed that noncorporeal ships cannot move together with other walking units on land, they leave them behind. I will need to somehow fix that, too.
March 13th, 2016, 11:33
(This post was last modified: March 13th, 2016, 11:35 by Seravy.)
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Managed to make ships grant their noncorporeal, or flying ability to the entire stack, which allows them to not only move together with land units (on, onto, or out of land), but effectively makes the ship carry said units even on land. (this pretty much means a ship with noncorporeal is as good as a windwalker)
There is one exception. When leaving a city, the ship always moves alone. This is an implicit assumption that you do not want the garrison to leave, since ships do pick up patrolling units as well as others. Not sure what to do with this.
Furthermore, the ship WILL pick up any of your patrolling stacks it is moving across, from nodes and such, and there is no way to prevent that, you have to move the units back where they came from after the ship moved away.
Again, not sure what to do with it.
The entire way ship movement is handled in the game is stupid.
Speaking of which, I'm not entirely sure if a flying or noncorporeal ship being as good as a windwalker is a good idea?
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Is there something you're trying to fix by letting flying/non-corporeal ships carry passengers over land? I agree the feature makes sense, but it doesn't seem to fix any specific bug. Is it necessary to fix the "ships on land can participate in a fight" bug?
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(March 13th, 2016, 14:43)spottedshroom Wrote: Is there something you're trying to fix by letting flying/non-corporeal ships carry passengers over land? I agree the feature makes sense, but it doesn't seem to fix any specific bug. Is it necessary to fix the "ships on land can participate in a fight" bug? Yes it is.
Otherwise a stack of 1 walking unit and a noncorporeal/flying ship would not be able to move on land together at all, because their combined movement would be sailing. Since ships can't move without the other unit being carried, so they can't even leave the stack alone, they would be unable to move at all, unless the walking units leave on their own.
Even worse, such a stack would not be able to move onto land from sea.
If I make the combined movement walking, the bug gets "reversed", the ship becomes unable to move onto sea from land, but cna move properly on land.
The only solution is to make the combined movement into flying/noncorporeal for the entire stack, otherwise the stack can't move in either land, or sea.
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I see. In that case, yes, I think the behavior you described above is more preferable than the alternative.
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So, is it now possible to give air ships transport?
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(March 14th, 2016, 11:55)Anthony Wrote: So, is it now possible to give air ships transport?
No.
Most game mechanics consider transport = ship, and AI specifically would never use them on land ever. I rather not mess with that now that I finally got it to at least understand how to use a ship on water. However, there might be some places in code where "sailing = ship' that I do not know about, so I rather not create units that do not have both regardless of AI problems.
On the other hand, giving them Wind Walking is safe and achieves the same thing, the CoM mod does that. This is modding, though, not a bug patch, so it's not for 1.50.
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