Civ6 Epic 1: Ranamar's gets his hand stuck in the cookie jar

[Ranamar]

Quick tl;dr: I was last in everything and underexpanded at T115, so I gave up because I was pretty sure I was not going to ever finish anything.  Final wonder score was Pyramids.

I'm going to try to do better reporting this time: take a picture whenever I found a city or significantly change civics, and not report what I'm building unless it's score-relevant (i.e. a wonder).  Building strategies I'll try to report on.

This is also my first game with the new patch, I have to admit, but I've been warned that the AI is a lot more intelligent in its building choices, so I'm going to have to be aggressive about settling, since I'm not allowed to start wars to get land.

We're not allowed to do a lot of the usual culture stuff, which I've always been a little slow about anyway.  I only belatedly realized how good monuments actually are, but I do often lean on culture civic cards.  Building chateus sounds like a good middle ground to me.  I'll need to figure out a good strategy for that.  Also, we may want to take advantage of some of the weirder sources of GPP and art slots, given that we can't use the typical culture strategy of Theater Squares.  The early one that stands out to me is that the Great Library actually has writing slots.  If we can fill that up early, it could be good.  I'd also like to go for a religion and may particularly prioritize that, but I'm not sure which building I'll take with that.  There's some argument for the art slot in the cathedral, for a change.  However, without the usual GPP sources, filling any of those slots will be difficult.

Turn 1: I decided to settle in place.  This land is pretty lush, and I want to get started ASAP.  I haven't been punished for a farmer's gambit yet, so I'm starting with a worker.  We'll farm wheat and probably quarry rock for the rest.  I need to look at the chateu more, though.


A quick look at the chateu reveals that it gives +1 culture, +1 gold if next to a luxury resource, and another culture if next to a wonder.  I'm not quite sure what wonders I'll be dropping where, but I'm definitely going to want a couple of chateaux next to our incense.  We probably also want a campus near the mountains with The Great Library next to it, which should boost our chateaux as well.  That, or just a holy site to start with.  I think we may want to harvest the stone between the mountains in any event.

Based on the resources we have around, the early targets are Irrigation for that tobacco and mining for the zillion quarries we have around here.  I think I'll start with mining.  I don't immediately see a desert for the pyramids, but we're going to start looking immediately.  I will try for it to be city 2.

Turn 4: Ooh; first city state to be met: Buenos Aires.  They're industrial, which is great for us, they were first met by us, which gets us that wonderful free envoy, and they want a trade route, which is definitely something we can do.

T7: A barbarian scout found us, and my warrior is far away.  I'm going to build a slinger before finishing my worker after all, I think... especially because a second camp spawned here:

I just wish that camp weren't there luring my warrior away.  I'd go see what it is, but it's on a swamp and therefore will take a long time to get to anyway.

T10: Mining completes; starting on Pottery or Irrigation next.

Interturn, we meet Cleopatra, boosting writing.  (handy!)  Her scout came from the southwest.

T14: Buenos Aires helped soften up that barbarian camp to the northeast, and we destroy it, netting us gold and boosting military tradition.  I have no idea where the barbarian scout is from, but I never saw a scout from this one.  It also seems to have wandered in circles, so I guess it's time to intercept, maybe after some healing.

T15: Code of Laws comes in.  Civics:

I picked God King over Urban Planning because we have a choice between 2Food1Production tiles and 2Food1Faith tiles, right now.  This makes faith and production kind of fungible.  Next civic target is Craftsmanship, which I'm going to make sure to boost before getting.

T16: We go back to that first builder, now that we have some more units.

We also discover Hong Kong, which wants us to get a Great Prophet.  Egypt got to them first, unfortunately, so we don't get the starting envoy.


T18: Pottery completes; start on Irrigation, which we will be boosting in a couple turns.  I have a plan to boost it, so I'm having my warrior rest next to a village until I have done it.

T20: the builder finally finishes.  No barbarians ever showed up, and Hong Kong finally dispatched that scout.  However, we do have 2 units exploring now, at least.  We farma wheat, boosting Irrigation (4 turns now), and greet a village, which gives us gold.  (Next build is a scout for more exploration.  We need to look to our south a lot, as the north is a frozen waste.)  I decide to use some of it to send a delegation to Cleopatra.  She has City State Protector, which shouldn't be a problem for us.

Interturn, I learn that, while she won't mind our usual city state foreign policy, oh right, she's going to hate our military weakness all game.

T21: we explored another village... and this one gave us faith.  We now have enough for a pantheon.  Monument To The Gods and Stone Circles are tempting because of our start, but I'm unconvinced that the early faith bonus from Circles is worth it, and I don't like the fact that Monument phases out.  On the other hand, I do intend to build ancient wonders, and Monument phases out to our own civ's bonus.  Let's do it.  Founding the pantheon also boosts Mysticism.

T24: Irrigation comes in.  We're going to try to get Astrology to close to 50% next.  There's a barbarian scout to the south, which is hardly surprising.  I need to decide what I'm going to do about it.  Also, there's a bunch of desert to the south.  I'm sure it's good for the pyramids and I wonder if it will be good for Petra, given that I think I see desert sheep there.

T26: Craftsmanshp comes in.  Next civic is foreign trade,e ven though we haven't found a new continent yet.

In the west, we find Yerevan, that most awkward of city states, and it boosts Political Philosophy.  Someone got to this one, too.  In the south, a scout detected our city.  Good thing I have a garrison prepped.  There are also several units from Cleopatra.  I'm going to need to land-grab this quickly, so my next build, in a couple turns is going to be a settler.  I take advantage of the free civic swap I just got to put the +1 production card in.

T28: I'd taken a look at the continent lens when I met Yerevan and noticed it was on a continental divide.  Walking my slinger into its borders finally got us the boost for Foreign Trade.


T30: I found Cleopatra's capital:

Also, notice that road, particularly in the fog.  Cleopatra is sending us a trade route, which, incidentally, builds a road right into where I want to build that city.  I need to decide exactly where I'm putting it, but check out that monster petra city location there.  The only question is which desert tile I want to found it on, given that growth will be rough before we atually have Petra.

I also just noticed I'm past 50% on Astrology, so I switch over to Animal Husbandry for our upcoming city.

T31, I meet Arabia and exchange capital information.  He's way over here, but I hope Arabia doesn't know how to use Yerevan very well:


Also, this barbarian camp will need to be cleared out before we found our second city, it looks like:


Interturn, we meet Harald of Norway, too.  Capital trade reveals he is all the way to the south.

T35: I'm 1 turn from animal Husbandry, and my tile-buying costs are going to go up when I get it.  I have 396 gold.  I'm going to go on a tile-buying spree, especially now that I've figured out I can build the Pyramids at Paris where I already have good production.  Here's Paris after my buying spree:

There's one questionable spot near the mountains which might get a holy site or a campus.  The flatland to the northwest is for Stonehenge.  The desert tile in the southeast is for the Pyramids.  The cattle to the southwest is for our desert city, but it'll be cheaper to buy it now given wehre I'm thinking of placing that city.

T36: Animal Husbandry and Foreign Trade come in.  We're going to start on State Workforce, which I need to watch like a hawk and go for writing to get campuses.  My civic development is super slow anyway, though, so I should be able to get one up in time to boost it.

T38: We meet Lisbon, or rather they find us.  They want us to recruit a great writer.


Interturn, a barbarian warrior suicides on my Slinger.  Apparently, this doesn't qualify as "kill a unit with a slinger".

T40: We found Bordeaux in the middle of the desert:

Food is about the only thing it reliably has, so I'm going to start sinking production into a slinger.  Later, it's going to need serious worker support, and, next turn, we're going to buy a tile somewhere before the price goes up again.  Now I need to rush for Mathematics and Petra... and kill that barbarian camp.

Cleopatra complains I'm too close.  That's fair.  I'll go another direction next anyway.

T42: Well, I forgot to buy the district, but it also appears that costs haven't gone up for ring 2, at least.  It looks like we're expanding border in useful directions anyway.  Writing comes in, and I set Masonry to research for now.  I'm still holding out hope on that natural wonder, and it's 7 turns to complete this campus to boost State Workforce to get at the wonder accelerator.  We also got our first rade route and sent it to Buenos Aires for production, gold, and a quest completion.

T48: Cleopatra built Stonehenge this turn.  That's annoying, because I'm going to have to get a prophet the hard way if I want one, and I'm pretty far behind in the race now.  There are 8 players, which means 4 prophets.  One went to Egypt and one will go to Arabia.  3 other players have GPP cooking right now, and they're all around 20/60 for the first prophet.  The later ones cost more, though, so I might be able to race for a middle one, even now, especially if I put the card in.  I start building a worker, because I'm going to need one, and I get going on finishing Astrology.

Interturn, Cleopatra denounces me for being weak.  This could get super annoying.

The next turn, Harald wants me to join him in war with Cleopatra for pocket change.  I decline.  After all, I'm not too honorable to declare war.  That's good news, though, because it means we might not get declared on quite yet.

T51: State Workforce comes in.  The next civic is Early Empire.  It's time to push for governments.

Bordeaux also needs amenities.  Good thing we have a worker coming in 2 turns so we can finally put a plantation on one of those incenses.  I also pay 95 gold for a tile I'd like to use for my holy site.

T52: Astrology comes in.  Next tech is Currency.  I set up the holy site as well, but I'm more than a little worried about the fact that one of Cleopatra's warriers has the city-targeted exclamation point over its head.  I still don't know if that's a bug.

T55: Cleopatra has two or three warriors walked up to my land.  I'm getting kind of worried here, I have to admit.  (interturn, it's 4 visible)  She's also in Oligarchy, to make matters worse.

T57: I finally find a natural wonder!  It was practically next to Egypt's capital.  Would have been nice to find earlier...

T59: Currency completes.  Welcome to the Classical Era!  Next tech is archery because uh, Cleopatra has walked 3 units up to Paris.  Paris is going to start on the Pyramids soon, but first a brief interlude for a slinger while we line up a civic swap.  (because uh; cleopatra is wandering units around me)

T61: Archery comes in.  Next tech is Bronze working to find out if there is iron nearby.  Our slinger turned into an archer (2T remain), so I switch build to the Pyramids this turn.

We also find one of China's units.  Capital trade puts them in the east.

Interturn, Egypt starts converting my cities.  It does make me question my decision to contest religions.  (It's not like I need to own the religion, anyway.  I just want access to religious tourism stuff.

T62: New policies, hedging against attack by my neighbor:


Early Empire had finished, so my next civic is Political Philosophy.

Exploring, I meet the Kongo people.  They're east of Egypt.  At least they aren't completing for a prophet...

T64: Cleopatra declares war on us.  It's nice to get the defensive tactics bonus for a change. I switch back to the archer I'd been working on in Paris; it finishes in one turn.  I also blow away one of Cleopatras units this turn.  It's not clear to me she's actually ready to go wo war with me.  Let's see if I can snipe any workers with my scout, assuming there are any.

T65: Iron Working comes in.  I set the tech to Mathematics, which I'm going to need to remember to stop early.

T68: An unmet player built the Hanging Gardens.  That would have been nice, but it's not like it was critical.

T70: Total units killed by barbarians: 1  Total units killed by Egypt: 0  I put a warrior in a poor position and he got rekt.

Interturn, though, I lost a very damaged scout that I had left healing to a slinger.  Not sure who killed it.

Amusingly, despite our war, I have no kept my promise not to settle near Egypt.

T73: Having wiped out most of Cleopatra's expeditionary force, I think it's time to go pillage some tiles, soon.

T75: Mathematics is past 50%, so research switches to Horseback Riding.  I'll boost it either with the Great Library or by building a commercial district.

T76: Pyramids complete!  China thinks I should be looking at them for wonders, though.  Sucks to be China.  This got me an inspiration on Drama and Poetry, which got me an envoy to Buenos Aires, which set them at war with Hong Kong, which is apparently under the sway of Egypt.  I'll need to do something about that.

We also got governments this turn.  I'll want Autocracy later, but for now I guess I'll go for Oligarchy, since we've got units that are being shot at.  Next civic is Mysticism so I can soon get the great prophet card.  It's the only way I'll win a prophet race, and I probably need the Oracle on top of that.  (Realistically, I won't get it, and I'll take whatever religion someone else spreads.  Looking, total religions is 5, so I might get the last one.)
Policies for now:


Interturn, Cleopatra offers me salt for peace.  (Snark: Yeah, I'd be salty if my war went like that...)

T80: Mysticism comes in.  I need to pick something for my next civic.  The default is going to be Games And Recreation.

If I'm going to make a run for a religion, I'll get the last one, but I need a plan, and it's going to be a demanding one for sure.  So, here we go...
There are three great prophets left, and four civs going for them:

China has 4 points per turn, and Arabia is guaranteed one while getting 2 points.  The unmet player has 3 points.
Arabia gets the last great prophet if it doesn't win a prophet race before that, so we have to assume we need to get one of the 120-point prophets.  They're 39 points out, which is 20 turns.  The unmet player is 49 points out, but will get there in 17 turns.  Hoping Arabia gets another GPP in the pipe to give us extra time seems like a sucker's bet.
We need 98 great prophet points in 17 turns, which comes out to 5.7 average GPP per turn from now until the end.

We can bump our thing up to 4 points per turn right now if we put the great prophet card in, and we have a civic swap this turn for it.
If we finish the Oracle, we can get to 6 great prophet points per turn.  However, before construction bonuses, it takes 15 turns to build.  That means we'll only get a couple of turns of usefulness out of it, but it does mean we might be able to get away with using the purchase discount.
Depending on how the bonuses stack, putting the wonder card in while in Classical Republic will shave one or two turns off, getting it down to 13 or 14 turns to build.  With Autocracy, we should be able to get it down another turn, to 12 or 13.  Similarly, if we canibalize our growth, we can squeeze another two production out of our city.
Working backwards, if we're going to average 5.7 GPP per turn with the Autocracy approach, we will need to finish the Oracle in 2 turns, if we're not using its purchase ability to grab the last bit.  Meanwhile, if we are in Classical Republic, with it's 15% GPP bonus, we need to complete it in 5 turns.  Only one of these is remotely doable.
I know I have a certain amount of sunk-cost fallacy going on here, but holy cities are a tourism source, and the Oracle is going to be useful, especially since I think I can make Paris into a traditional monster city, with its several grain tiles.

I ended up setting the next civic to Military Tradition (4 turns) because we're getting some envoys right now and I want to use the doubling card and then switch back.  After that, we're going to put some civics research into Games And Recreation before lining up Drama And Poetry to arrive just as we're getting our great prophet.  China has a theater district, and I intend to grab at least one great writer.
Here's Paris in all-hands-on-deck build mode:

The base hammers of a forest are 48 right now, but I'm hoping I've got enough multipliers on that to make this somewhat competitive.  I'm not going to hit 5 turns, but I might hit 7 or 8, and then I'll have to save my pennies to buy the prophet.  There's a strong chance that we'll miss and can't afford it, at this point.

Interturn, Cleopatra sends a delegation.

T81: Horseback Riding comes in.  Apprenticeship is unlocked, so we're going to start researching towards it.  I still need to build the mines.

T82: I had actually forgotten to place envoys last turn.  I place them in Hong Kong and Lisbon, both doubled because it's the first.  This gives me +2 production and +4 gold in the capital compared to what it was before.

It's been 2 turns since we started on the Oracle, and already we're down to only 10 turns to complete.  This turn, I chop a forest.  It's rated at 48 production, but it takes us from 51/290 to 113/290, so we actualy got 62 or so.  (Production is a float, so it's more complicated than the display shows.)  We're gettin 22 listed production, and it's more like 25.5 after all bonuses are applied, based on that 51 number.  It's 7 turns to build normally, and it's closer to 4 or 5 if we chop in the meantime.  I have one more chop on this worker, and it will be delivered in 4 turns.  Hopefully it completes then, but I'll live with it completing the next turn.  Our unmet player went up to 4 points per turn, however, which means we're not getting a prophet unless we do it with patronage, unfortunately.  Arabia is still at 2 points per turn.
At 4 points per turn and 43 points remaining, the clock for the prophet is 11 turns, and we know we can't make that unless there is only one medieval prophet.

T83: Prophet report: 4.6 points of GPP reduces required faith from 1040 to 1000 and required gold from 1525 to 1475.  At this rate, we wouldn't be able to even afford the base markup, and I'm abandoning the great prophet race.  The worker whose last charge I was going to use to chop is going to mine silver, instead.  We'll need more workers soon, too.  I'll leave us in classical republic until the next wonder I want to build, probably, and then it's over to Autocracy.

T84: Another round of prophet timing, just for interest: this time, it dropped by 50 faith and 75 gold.  So, it looks like each point reduces things by 10 faith or 15 gold.  At 4.6 per turn for 10 turns (which we don't have, but), that'd be 46 points for 460 faith, dropping the patronage cost to 500 faith.  On the gold side, it'd be 690 gold, dropping that cost to 900 or so.  No, I was never going to be able to afford it.  Military tradition comes in, so our next civic is Drama And Poetry.

Confirming my drop out of the prophet race, here's my new civics:


T85: I have another harebrained plan, too: I'm going to chop a forest into a worker in Bordeaux, built a commercial district on the former site of the forest, and use that to boost mathematics to build Petra.  The builder is then going to mine some land around Bordeaux so we can actually build the thing in a reasonable amount of time.

T87: I go check the prophets again, just because I'm curious.  I'm surprised to discover that Arabia got theirs a couple turns ago, when they had been losing the race to the unmet player.  However, it turns out that the next prophet is also medieval, so I wouldn't have caught the unmet player anyway.

To add insult to injury, China finishes the Oracle one turn before me, so I have nothing to show for 10 turns of work and a chop.  If I hadn't stopped rushing for it, I'd have gotten it, too!

T88: I throw a builder on because I have the builder card in.  After that, it'll finally be time to build a library, like I had started before I tried to grab a prophet at the last minute.

T92: Three mines boosts Apprenticeship, only one turn before it is now due to complete.  Perfect timing!  Also, Drama and Poetry will be in next turn.

T93: Apprenticeship comes in.  Welcome to the Medieval Era!  Hong Kong wants a trade route, and Buenos Aires wants us to train a crossbow.  Our next research is the wheel, while our next civic is Recorded History.

Exploring, we meet Mohenjo-Daro, which also wants a trade route.  We're going to need to research some seafaring for that one.  OUr exploration for new city sites is not going amazing, either, given that we seem to have boxed ourselves in on this coastline:


T94: ... and this turn I notice that I forgot to change civics last turn.  I'm stuck with a wonder card that I'm not using right now where I meant to have a writer card.

T96: The Wheel comes in.  Next tech is Construction.  Also, I buy a tile and reserve an industrial zone for Bordeaux, because it's size 5 and we should get that out of the way.  It's an amazing +4 zone, once all the mines get up and running.

T100: Paris finishes its industrial district before Bordeaux even manages to finish its commercial district.  I'll let it finish, but then we're going to get started on Petra.

Taking a look at the score screen, I'm now behind everyone in basically everything.  That's awkward.  I need to build more settlers and go back to other stuff later.

T102: I start on Petra in Bordeaux.  30 turns.  Hopefully nobody else has a juicy spot to try for.

Interturn, Cleopatra declares war on me again, surprise this time, with open borders.  I just want to be left alone!
She's got a bigger army this time:


T103: It occurs to me that finishing an industrial district will give a huge boost in Bordeaux to building Petra because of industrial city-states.  I switch building to that.  We're going to need to mine around it sooner rather than later, too, which I had neglected before.

T109: I learn that Kongo has built the Great Library.  Well, that's annoying.  I guess the spot I saved for it can go to Oxford, if nothing else.
By this time, I have destroyed Egypt's invading army.

T110: Scouting, I discover that Cleopatra is building Petra and is not far from completing it.  This sucks.

Somewhere in here, Egypt offers peace again, and, being honorable, I accept.

T115: Egypt built Petra.

At this point, I was last in every subsection of score on the score board, from civics to empire to tech.  I had missed most of the early wonders my pantheon was supposed to accelerate, and I had lost my big bet on Petra.
("This sucks; I quit.")

Looking back, my big problem was that I did not expand appropriately fast.  Until about halfway through the civics tree, the only culture that you can get is from population, and that means you need a lot of it.  Bordeaux was not a bad city, I'd say, but it was not a good second city.  I should have dropped a second one somewhere else and put my third one there... and really, I should have done all that in the time that it took me to put those two down.  I'm not quite sure how I would have done that, but I think that's what would have been needed to keep on track.  I've always been weak at expanding in a timely manner, so this failure mode is, at some level, not a surprise, but this particular game also locked out the usual ways to mitigate that problem early.  Similarly, while there were ways to mitigate poor science output, and I even got a campus and library built eventually, having enough population to provide even remotely acceptable culture output would have provided much more science to keep up in tech as well as not fall completely behind in civics.

I also have to admit that the farmer's gambit also failed me this game.  I would have been significantly better off if I had had my warrior closer to home and had built a scout first to do the scouting my warrior was doing, as that would have spared me some time to finish the worker I was building without dropping everything for extra military.

My tendency to make plans 2-3 turns in advance that required precise timing, write them down, and then still somehow forget them was a problem, but a much bigger problem was that I simply did the fundamentals poorly.

[Sullla]

Thanks for reporting a game where things didn't go as expected. This is a really nice report, even if it's a report of a frustrating game.

With regards to what went wrong... I think the tile-buying spree early in the game was a significant mistake. Purchasing tiles is typically one of the weaker ways to spend gold in Civ6, useful for getting a key resource at the capital or something similar, but not where you want to be investing a lot of precious early game resources. For 400 gold, you could have had a free settler instead, and that would have been a lot more useful than some bare grassland tiles in Paris' second or third ring. In most cases, it's better to get a +1 district bonus rather than spend 150 gold to get a +3 district bonus.

It seems like chasing after a religion also was a bit of a waste of resources. To land one of them, you usually need to invest heavily into faith/Holy Sites right from the outset, or go all-out for Stonehenge. By the time that you began pursuing a religion, it was already too late. I'd also point to Oligarchy government as a curious choice for a non-war game. I think it's the weakest of the three initial governments by a wide margin, and it didn't seem to fit this scenario very well.

I think your postmortem at the end was a nice summary. More expansion definitely would have helped, and a stronger second city also could have made a difference. Losing out on Petra sucked, no doubt about it. If it makes you feel any better, Egypt built the wonder on Turn 91 in my game, over 20 turns earlier than in your game. It could have been worse.

For what it's worth, I would encourage you to stick it out next time. I always learn more from games where things don't go well than games where everything works out perfectly. My favorite games of Civ are the ones where I persevered from terrible circumstances and managed to pull out a win. Food for thought for future games. Thanks!

[Ranamar]

Thanks for the advice about tile-buying. The point about 400 gold for a settler is really stark. (Is it really that cheap? I don't really have a good eye for rush buying, I admit.)

The religion was something I wanted to go for and then kept getting side-tracked on. I think I would have been fine if I'd started 10 or 15 turns earlier, and I've consistently ended up complacent about it, at least after my first game where I basically durdled into religion #1 on Prince.

I have to admit I kept thinking, "y'know, I should see what I can salvage from this, starting with a settler-building spree" since I still had about two weeks, but I never felt motivated enough compared to the marginal thing I could do at the time.

[timmy827]

It's a straight 4 gold per hammer cost (much simpler than civ5's .75 exponent and multipliers on so many early things!), so yes 400 gold is the 2nd settler you build.

I often buy things besides settlers (as the 50% from colonization is the biggest hammer boost around) but yes concur on the general point Sullla's advice.  It is nice to get some tiles before the cost goes up but only if you plan to lay a district down right away or work it right away.  (So I think it would make sense to buy either Pyramids tile or Stonehenge tile not both, you can't chase them both simultaneously; use the gold for something else and be ok with paying 10 more say 15 turns later when you try the other wonder)

My other advice is that Bordeaux is too far away from the capital.  I put it on your Petra tile, there are some specifics to the terrain that made it work better but in general since cultural expansion is slow (especially this variant!) and cities rarely get above size 10-12 for a long time, it really helps to usually have cities the minimum 4 tiles or maybe 5 apart.  Easier to share good tiles, able to buy 3rd ring tile for cap at 2nd ring price at city #2 etc.