Adventure 48: Fishtropolis

[uberfish]

In the original adventure thread I joked about 20 grassland fish being the best setup. As it turns out grassland fish don't work because you can't get fishing boats on land... but lake fish do:



Now I could squeeze more fish in, and I suspect there will be people running max-food setups like 18 corn, but such a setup will not only have trouble converting food to hammers in the endgame but hit extremely serious diminishing returns on GPP (it's hardly worth generating them past #20.) Another tempting setup would be to max out on Bureaucratic gold mines and rely primarily on wonder GPP. However, because of my name and that post I feel compelled to use a more fishy strategy.

Note I do have one clam/crab and one silver/gems sacrificing a bit of late game output in return for raising the health and happiness caps in the early game and getting wonders done faster. Also stone on the starting hill for 3 hammer output and wonder acceleration.

Now, for national wonders it's completely impossible to do without: Oxford, Ironworks, Globe Theatre, National Park. Most players will build national epic in OCC, I often avoid it because of its great artist pollution as great artists are by far the worst GP type to get saddled with and taking the GP multiplier from +200% to +300% just hits diminishing returns very quickly. Instead I'm going with Moai Statues as my 5th for obvious reasons. This will give me 7-1-2 Lake Fish, the best food tiles possible in the game. Why are we not playing Elizabeth for 7-1-3 Protective is a useless trait, and the Native American UU and UB are equally worthless.

For world wonders I mainly want GE and GS point contributors because these are the best GP types. I don't want to rush Oracle because the prophet points could interfere with getting an Academy up. 1-2 prophets/merchants would be ok since I have to pay for military upkeep under Pacifism, but any more would just be generating too much useless gold.

t0: Work gold hill (0/3/1)
t5: Fishing boat, work lake fish (6/0/2)
t6: Contact from Isabella
t8: Mining, contact from Suryavarman
t10: Isabella founds and converts to Buddhism
t12: Fishing boat
t15: Contact from Shaka
t18: Fishing boat
t19: Bronzeworking
t22: Worker
t25: Worker
t26: Masonry
t30: Mysticism
t35: Polytheism
t37: Priesthood
t41: Pyramids (2360BC)
t42: Writing, Dog Soldier for anti-barbarian duty, Revolt Representation
t46: Sailing, Library
t50: Lighthouse, Judaism FIADL
t51: #1 GP engineer
t52: Fishing boat
t53: Aesthetics
t54: Fishing boat
t55: Fishing boat
t56: Literature, fishing boat
t61: Drama
t65: Code of Laws (found Confucianism)
t66: Meditation
t68: Great Library (1320 BC)
t70: Mathematics, Theatre
t71: #2 GP, Academy
t77: Civil Service
t80: Globe Theatre
t81: Fishing boat
t82: Philosophy (found Taoism), Fishing boat, Revolt Bureaucracy/Pacifism. Pacifism isn't doing anything for now
t84: Fishing boat (10/10)
t85: Music, free artist, #3 GP artist so I get to settle two of them this turn
t88: Alphabet, Moai Statues, Trade for The Wheel
t89: Isabella: Trade CoL, Aesthetics, Mathematics for Monarchy, Pottery, Iron, Monotheism
t90: Aqueduct
t91: Paper, Granary. Surya converted to Judaism and declared war on Isabella. I'm stuck in no state religion at the moment as the other two neighbours are Buddhist
t94: Oracle -> Nationalism (550 BC... seriously. I had education 1/3 of the way done because I really wasn't expecting to get this wonder at this point in time... so I took nationalism, the other 3k beaker tech available)
t97: The Hanging Gardens (475 BC)
t98: Revolt to Judaism, I really need the pacifism bonus and Surya appears to be winning the war. Isabella is annoyed, Shaka doesn't really care.
t100: Education
t101: #4 GP Scientist
t103: Metal Casting, University
t104: Currency
t105: Compass
t106: Oxford (research = 630bpt)
t107: Machinery
t108: Forge
t109: Optics, University of Sankore, #5 GP Engineer
t110: Calendar, Caravel
t111: Harbour
t112: Monastery
t113: Monastery
t114: Astronomy, Monastery
t115: Feudalism, Observatory, #6 GP Engineer
t116: Jewish Temple
t117: Guilds, Market, Shaka declares war vs Surya
t118: Banking, Meet Cyrus and Charlemagne, Trade for Cyrus' map and construction, trade for Cyrus' rice and open borders. All the other continent is Hindu and Cyrus is the clear leader. Surya is getting the upper hand on Isabella.
t119: Grocer
t120: Economics, free Merchant saved, revolt Caste System/Free Market, meet Hannibal and open borders
t122: #7 GP Engineer
t123: Gunpowder, Customs House
t124: Synagogue
t126: Constitution, Bank
t127: Jail
t128: Corporation, Barracks
t129: #8 GP scientist, Courthouse, Zulus are making progress against Khmer, capturing a city
t130: Printing Press, Musket - Bribe Zulus to convert to Judaism and give us 50 gold with Drama, sold it to Isabella and Shaka for more gold too
t131: Engineering, Musket
t132: Spy (defensive duty only)
t133: Musket
t134: Chemistry, Musket (4 total, plus 1 dog and 1 warrior that can be upgraded)
t135: Privateer
t136: Scientific Method (research drops from 1040 to 913), Privateer, #9 GP Engineer
t137: Privateer (these are going to the other continent to harrass Cyrus and Hannibal)
t138: Privateer, Circumnavigation
t139: Privateer
t140: Privateer
t141: Biology, Privateer (7 total). 3 privateers are on Cyrus, 1 on Hannibal, and 3 on Shaka since he's winning the wars on my continent so I might as well slow him down
t143: Liberalism -> Medicine, National Park, Sid's Sushi, train some Executives - 5 or so. Sent these to Khmer/Zulu to offset my corporation costs
t145: #10 GP scientist
t146: Steel
t147: Physics, free scientist
t153: Ironworks
t154: #11 gp scientist, Drydock, Peace breaks out on my continent
t155: Rep Parts, start building Research when there's nothing better to do
t158: Steam Power
t159: Levee
t162: Isabella declares war... her invasion stack is a few longbow/cat/axes


Needless to say this isn't going to accomplish anything, I'll even fight outside the city to stop pillaging and easily beat this attack off

t163: Assembly Line, #12 GP scientist
t164: Lose one musket at 88% odds, kill 3 units
t165: Factory, Surya declares on Isabella
t166: Coal Plant, Great General (military instructor)
t167: Musket
t168: Railroad, Isabella pays 60g for peace, lose one privateer
t170: Rifling
t172: #13 GP scientist
t174: Electricity
t178: Combustion
t179: Second privateer sunk by Cyrus
t182: #14 GP scientist
t183: Industrialism
t184: Industrial Park
t189: Radio, Cyrus clears out the last of the privateers finally
t192: Artillery, #15 GP engineer
t197: Rocketry
t200: Apollo Program
t203: Plastics, #16 GP scientist
t209: Computers. Zulus clear out their privateers.
t214: Superconductor
t215: Laboratory, switch 8 scientist specialists to engineers and start building thrusters, #17 GP scientist
t220: Satellites
t227: Robotics, Hannibal declares war, #18 GP scientist



Ok, this appears to be a slightly more serious threat than the last invasion but:

t228: Missile Cruiser, upgrade defenders to 6x Mech Inf, put the Cruiser on Sea Patrol
t229: Kill invading units with Mechs, let the 8 or so frigates suicide themselves trying to pillage vs the 40 strength cruiser...
t230: Same as t229, the total losses here were 1 pillaged gem mine and a couple of turns of overseas trade routes
t233: Space Elevator, another Hannibal frigate suicides
t234: Composites, Thrusters 5/5
t238: Paid Hannibal some small amount of gold for peace, unfortunately I can't get my open borders back for trade routes since I'm his worst enemy now
t240: #19 GP engineer
t241: Fibre Optics. Library sabotaged by AI spies
t242: Library rebuilt
t245: Casing 5/5
t246: Fission
t247: Cockpit 1/1
t251: Docking Bay 1/1
t253: Fusion, free engineer -> Golden Age, also had to trade Liberalism to Cyrus to get him into free market to get traderoutes back due to the annoying Mercantilism plague
t257: #20 GP scientist



t259: Genetics
t260: Engine 2/2
t261: Library blown up again (at least it's not the factory)
t262: Stasis Chamber 1/1
t263: Ecology
t265: Life Support 1/1 - Launch Spaceship (1775 AD)
t266: Mass Media, The Internet -> Theology, Divine Right, Military Tradition, Democracy, Communism, Hunting, Archery, Animal Husbandry, Horseback Riding, Military Science
t267: Library rebuilt, #21 GP = engineer
t268: Fascism, Great General, research = 1962 bpt
t271: Refrigeration
t275: Flight, Space Victory (1810 AD) Also Shaka killed off the Khmer this turn.



MONOPOLY TECHS

Industrialism, Plastics, Composites, Ecology
Satellites
Computers, Fibre Optics, Fusion, Robotics, Superconductor, Genetics
Biology, Medicine, Refrigeration

Event score: 14 victory points

This one was a lot of fun, thanks T-hawk. I might have to replay it and try the bureaucracy-gold approach sometime.

[regoarrarr]

Why are we not playing Elizabeth for 7-1-3

Or Willem for 7-2-3!!

Amazing report - I can't believe some of you guys with your late Oracles!

I don't know how I managed to have more points than you - it seems like we had similar games both involving privateers and you had a better Oracle plus from your screenies you passed me in beakers fairly early on (gold is always going to be better early but food / GPs will pass it up in the late game).

I'd have to check my game for exact dates on some of my techs but the only thing I can think of is that I had shaka and izzy and myself on the same religious bloc

[uberfish]

Yeah but if we were playing Willem we'd just complain about Creative being useless instead! I wasn't even planning to build the Oracle originally, but I saw it was still available at 550 BC so couldn't resist trying

To be honest, the score for this one (if you didn't go on the warpath as it seems most players didn't) is going to involve quite a bit of random luck with the AI-AI relations determining their tech rate.

[Thoth]

Nicely done.


It's interesting to see the variety of different (and highly successful) approaches to this game.

[Bruindane]

Yeah but if we were playing Willem we'd just complain about Creative being useless instead!

Elizabeth of the Netherlands.

Might be time to try diety

[T-hawk]

This will give me 7-1-2 Lake Fish, the best food tiles possible in the game. Why are we not playing Elizabeth for 7-1-3 Protective is a useless trait, and the Native American UU and UB are equally worthless.

You weren't Elizabeth for exactly that reason, to keep lake fish from getting even farther out of balance with land food. The UU was to defend against barbs without needing to pick a metal/horses resource. And Protective did come in handy for those that had Shaka declare at an inconvenient time. Sitting Bull was chosen for the overall health and balance of the scenario, to help even out any bad luck factors re barbs and war, not as the most powerful leader.

No National Epic? I understand the frustration when you get an Artist, but the NE always produces far more "good" GPP than bad. If you have 50 base GPP and +200% (Philo/Pacifism), then it's producing 50 good GPP and 3 Artist GPP. It will always produce more good Great People than bad, unless you get tremendously unlucky (literally like 1 in 5000) with something like three straight artists. Still, I can understand the logic of freeing up the national wonder slot for Moai; I took NE and Moai but had to give up Ironworks.

1-2 prophets/merchants would be ok since I have to pay for military upkeep under Pacifism, but any more would just be generating too much useless gold.

Actually, I found cash to be in shortage. Civic upkeep hit over 20 gold per turn, and also 30 for Sushi. Prophets and merchants were OK by me.

This one was a lot of fun, thanks T-hawk. I might have to replay it and try the bureaucracy-gold approach sometime.

Me too, though I gotta finish my first report first, except that I keep spending all my time reading everybody else's.

[uberfish]

I didn't build NE because I figured that there's a lot of diminishing returns on stacking all those GPP multipliers, I hit 20 GPs generated without National Epic and after that the GPP threshold multiplier goes from 2x to 3x. Whereas the hammer bonus from Moai+Ironworks is reliable and can't screw you over by spawning the wrong GP type.

My Sushi corp expenses were paid off and then some by spreading it to about 5 AI cities. I also had 50 or so turns of piracy. Between these and 2 settled artists I had enough gold to upgrade 6 Mech Inf without turning the science slider down or selling much tech to the AI.

[luddite]

This looks like a really good setup. Very appropriate with your name, too