Sisu
Hey
I just wanted to run a quick thought by you; since our west and south are looking pretty bleak from a food perspective, I was thinking of going for Iron Working as a relatively high priority (after Pottery and hopefully slinging MC with Oracle). The jungle region seems like it could be prime land. Thoughts?
Ceiliazul
hmm, generally not the best idea
Sisu
Right.
Ceiliazul
early IW is a lot of beakers, but more importantly jungle is a ton of worker turns
Sisu
Stuff like Writing->Math->Currency is generally a higher priority
Ceiliazul
well, the payoff is faster math/currency/calendar
Sisu
I'm just kind of despondent of finding food nearby.
Ceiliazul
until you have the worker turns to spare, it's not a good idea to go into the jungle.
Sisu
*nod*
Ceiliazul
Despondent? Geez, you have a rocking 2nd city
Sisu
That's very true.
And my third is strong too.
Ceiliazul
3rd city on the desert hill SE is pretty good too
by the time you need a 4th, you'll have a better picture of the surroundings
Sisu
Fair enough.
Ceiliazul
By the way, don't leave 3 workers covered by only 4 muskets next to a guy with railroads
Sisu
I guess I just have visions of everyone else having irrigated grain or lots of seafood as their second ring :P
Ceiliazul
(BPEM42)
Sisu
aw
Ceiliazul
no, I'm the guy with the railroad. "Aw" for the other guy :-p
Sisu
Oh.
*fistbump*
Well done.
Ceiliazul
don't worry about others' land. Do the best you can with yours
in these big pitbosses, it's a long race... opportunities will come
did you follow Serdoa in PB8? He had crap land, but focused long term
Sisu
I read the archives of his thread, but it was pretty sparse.
Ceiliazul
reporting not so good, but you can see the results
Sisu
Yeah
I feel like, given the lack of food bonuses to my immediate southwest, once I finish healing and looking at the river valley I want to cut back and look at my eastern coastline
Especially if I'm thinking of slinging MC
Ceiliazul
scouting: so the scout will continue a spiral around to 3clock and then move East? Sounds good
Sisu
Yeah.
Assuming we continue to avoid bears.
Ceiliazul
Oracle: sounds like a plan. One thing I love to do is set a good city with forests and chop it there. Take 4 forests generally.
...but that's sitautional
Sisu
Yeah, I already counted for probably 2nd city
If we manage to land religion there, it will have 5 forests in its borders, which is exactly enough for Oracle.
Ceiliazul
Sounds good, and you can stack prophet points with the eventual shrine
I like it
what religion will you go for?
Sisu
I mean, Hinduism is obviously a better tech
if neither have fallen by the time I finish Mysticism... I guess I'll flip a coin?
Ceiliazul
haha
Sisu
I mean, I expect Byzantium is also going to want religion, since they're likely going for Stonehenge and want something to do with that GPr
So maybe they'll grab one first and settle the question for me :P
Ceiliazul
Henge and religion are cross purposes
each are a big early investment
and you only need one (at first)
Sisu
I suppose that's true
Ceiliazul
Byz (if they land 'henge) would be better off with Confu or Christianity
Sisu
*nod*
Ceiliazul
I like the KISS method. Do NOW what you need NOW. I therefore would take Meditation
it's faster for your needs NOW.
...but that's just me :-)
Sisu
Also very reasonable.
Luckily we don't have to worry about that for a while.
Ceiliazul
remember you're putting off pottery and writing for this. So a faster relgion gets those techs faster too
right, no decision needed now
Sisu
Rough tech path for now is Ag->AH->Myst->religion->wheel->priesthood->pottery
Ceiliazul
I like it
if and IND civ pops a relgion on ~t30, others will just give up on oracle
Sisu
this is normal speed, not quick
Ceiliazul
right, I keep forgetting that
Sisu
t50ish is about when I'd land religion following that path
Ceiliazul
I did post some rough oracle times from previous PBs. Seems it was ~t56?
Sisu
since agriculture and AH are expensive
Ceiliazul
ah. Hmm. So when would you land oracle in that case?
Sisu
well, it depends on how much commerce I'm pulling in from other cities and trade routes, and being slow on the ability to cottage doesn't help
but I _am_ Industrious and I can prechop the forests in Oracle city's radius
Ceiliazul
trade routes will be 1cpt for each city only
until currency
Sisu
right, I just don't know how many cities I'll be settling
given that I don't know maint costs yet
depending on my expansion path I might also have to slot in Fishing.
Ceiliazul
fishing?? not before the oracle, certainly?
Sisu
if all my food nearby turns out to be seafood...
*shrug*
it does provide arrow bonus for pottery, though
and since I need pottery to sling mc
Ceiliazul
that's true... and the clam/cow spot does look tasty...
Sisu
ideally though I'll find an expansion path that doesn't require that sort of lousy detour
Ceiliazul
3rd city on the coast would find cows already in the capital culture (And pre-improved for clam city)
gotta sim it out
Sisu
Yeah, I think I'll have time tomorrow to update the sandbox
Ceiliazul
my gut says clam city develops too slow to be useful
...but definitely worth trying
clam city too slow *before Oracle* that is
Sisu
I suspect 'mids and GLH will go late this game; my guess is that stone and marble are edited out. It's weird that I haven't seen stone yet, from my experience poking around in WB at this latitude.
*nod*
and if Masonry resources are gone, nobody will be grabbing Masonry opportunistically
Ceiliazul
um, possible. that doesn't matter for GLH. With all those coastal starts I think you're wrong
'Mids are variable, and don't always depend on stone
Sisu
GLH requires masonry+sailing to build, yes?
Ceiliazul
yes, but GLH has no doubler
Sisu
right, what I mean is that people might prioritize other techs over masonry
Ceiliazul
sure
we'll see
Sisu
yeah
if there's one thing I've learned from reading a lot of PB and PBEM archives, it's that land tends to be king
Ceiliazul
yep
Sisu
so I guess I really hope Joao is bungling his start :P
But you're right, optimizing my own pays better dividends than hoping for others' misfortune
...still, can't help but think that it would be a real shame if something happened to Byzantium before they got to Guilds.
Ceiliazul
chin up, LOTS of people will be thinking that
Sisu
remains to be seen how many neighbors they have in a position to do something about it.
not worth planning too long-term though.
Ceiliazul
true
Sisu
well, thank you for your thoughts
Ceiliazul
no problem
focus on the task at hand
opportunities will present themselves
current task at hand: sim that city2 plant
but not any farther than Oracle
Sisu
yes sir
Ceiliazul
:-)