WW16: The Outlaws and The Olives

[Ichabod]

regarding people accusing me:

Sareln
novice

I could switch to uberfish for lynch if he gets more momentum. Only very slight preference to Sareln right now is that given more time uberfish might do something helpful to town which could change my mind - but that requires active participation so I don't expect it from Sareln .

Also wouldnt mind an Ichabod lynch, Zak made a good case and he isn't doing anything to clear himself. I'm also no longer sure that Catwalk is village, but too many suspects for me to worry about him atm - I fear him as a wolf less than these other 3, tbh.

I do not like the votes against Qgqqqqq at all. The momentum behind him seems very sketchy to me, even by normal day 2 standards, and especially this day 2 when we have legitimate reads. Also, he doesn't really appear to be acting any differently than he did in ww15

Mattimeo, I wanted to know who you protected in order to investigate your role claim for later use. I agree you're leaning villager now, it might not stay that way. I'd rather you state now who you protected and why rather than give you more time for it later so it matches later developments (in case you're mafia). I don't see the major downside to revealing whether you used a charge or not, you have 3 and are unlikely to live long enough to use them all if you're not mafia.

Bigger, I think it's useful for the town to know Mattimeo's reasoning since he passed up on two fairly promising targets. I'll drop the matter seems noone seems interested, but I would like to echo Jkaen's sentiments about not clearing people 100% yet.

The discussion on Ichabod seems to have come to a discreet halt, wonder if we're being poked in different directions.

Until now, everything of what I'm accused of is that Zakalwe post and a whole lot of people voting for me or asking why isn't anyone following Zak's suspicion on me anymore. Did you guys see that I answered Zak's suspicions before day 2 even?

Other than "Zakalwe found him suspicious" I have not really seen anybody argue the case at all. Try to put a detailed analysis together for why he is mafia, and you may find renewed interest. Personnaly having reviewed it I cant really see the case

So why vote me in the first place, only to change your mind before I made a single post? You voted for me and unvoted me after my defense and before any other post.

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Regarding Catwalk, I agree with the following posts. Catwalk reactions to Rowain question were pretty over the top and while he claims he just went to "I don't care" mode, I thing his posts lean in a different way.

sorry, this is funny:

Rowain: you do you think is guilty?
Catwalk: so much pressure. well here is a bunch of inexperienced players (lists 5 people with plenty of experience). here is 4 players who are less active (leaves off the 3 people with the least posts so far: Selrahc, Molach, Sareln).
Catwalk cont: now let me analyze this data, I'll be back with a spreadsheet later


Really, Catwalk. hmm, I don't really know what to think about that.

Let me just say... So scummy. You're under pressure so you draw up a list of people and then after that say let me see if I feel strongly about any of them? What? Give me time so I can figure out if I even suspect the people I listed? Are you kidding me!

I would vote for you, but I'm already voting for you.

About this:

I think I'd actually make a better wolf than townie, yeah. Correct, the live game was my only scum game. And as has been mentioned elsewhere, I probably would go for bold plays in attempts to gain deep cover. Chances are that I'd offer myself for sacrifice in such a gambit, though

Personally I think I look pretty flailing here, as a wolf it'd be a lot easier to make up crap since you don't have to worry about it being correct. Which is another wolf-wouldn't-do-that argument, I guess.

I don't agree with this. In my opinion, it's not easy to make up crap when you are a wolf. Villagers make up crap normally (in hindsight, of course), because they don't know the info. When you have the info, you have to "act it", not only "be it", which is harder. So wolves tend to go with more objective arguments, rather than subjective ones (another reason why Gaspar commetn about my lack of understanding of him doesn't make sense if he thinks I'm a wolf).

That being said, Catwalk. I'll review Qgqqqq case later, as I've already said, but what was pointed out in the thread (by himself and Uberfish, if I'm not mistaken) make me think the main argument against him doesn't hold.

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Regarding Gaspar:

I have no problem with a policy lynch if there are no quality candidates. I just wonder why we had a bunch of quality options EOD1 and now we're all LETS LYNCH SARELN LOL or LETS LYNCH QQQUEUEQQCUE LMAOZ. Its as if we've all decided we're going to roleplay Lewwyn from the first couple days last game.



Perhaps. I use lot of noise a lot when I perceive lots of noise. I actually have a hardtime scumhunting in this environment because I just zone out when I think I hear villagers fighting other villagers over nothing. But I'm still waiting for answers to two questions:

1. Why was Ichabod a good candidate yesterday and nothing today when he's not so much as posted?
   
2. Why did Mattimeo not protect obvtarget zakalwe?
   

While neither of those might fit your personal definition of scumhunting, I assure you in both cases I believe them to lead us in the direction of scum.



This. I think of Sareln as a pretty easy and pretty lazy lynch. Now, on a day1/2 where we have no information - sure. But everyone was pretty convinced we have a lot of information from yesterday. (I don't agree with this, btw - I think we got a bit of information and a whole lot of lazy scumtells for people who don't actually know how to look for scumtells.)

If there was so much quality options on the EOD1, why don't you point them out? Let's take a look at who Zak and Novice pointed out as suspicious at end of night 1, since they are so accurate this game, according to yourself:

Zak - Gaspar, Twinkletoes89, Lewwyn, Sareln, Uberfish, Ichabod
Novice - Qgqqq, Pindicator, Merovech, Ichabod, Sareln

Well, both of them include Sareln, Novice talks about Qgqqqq, and none of them lists Mattimeo, which Gaspar talk about in this post. And for that, Zak refers to Gaspar and Novice also puts him as runner-up.

What I'm saying with this is the following: what are those "quality options" that Gaspar refers to? A lot of those players are getting heat right now and those are only noises, according to gaspar. The only one in those lists that he mentions is me. And his case against me is "Zak and Novice said so".

And why aren't you mentioning Injera and Catwalk right now? What made you change your mind?

And if you had payed a bit more attention you'd have found out that post by thestick (number 200) that is a very good proof of Mattimeo's innocence, just like I found the same post. Doesn't seem like you are trying very hard.

You know that description (of rolling a blunt) fits you quite nicely. How about you step down from the peanut-gallery and try some scum-hunting? Your contribution today isn't really somethng to write home about.
PS: you used the lot of noise already lst night.

Agreed. Not only the "lot of noise" line, but also the "stupid village" line seem to me like just an impersonation of what is to be expected from gaspar.

Honestly, I watched a village full of lemmings jump off Selrahc last game after he claimed "Doctor" and then did nothing to prove it, so you'll pardon me if I'm skeptical of unproven role claims. The fact that zak was so obvious to protect just tweaked me more.

I only have a second because its halftime of the Arsenal match, so I'll get to Ichabod's Heroic Epic after the game. I'll give you a preview:

<post>
<post>
<same post>

OMG GASPAR IS SO SCUMMY FOR THIS UNSEEABLE REASON THAT ONLY I SEE. You've basically sung the same tune everytime we've played together since WW7, I guess I'll have to dig out the old posts to prove it. A task for this evening.

Whatever you might think, its apparent you ALWAYS think I'm a wolf when we play together and yet you're ALWAYS wrong and you keep coming back to it. So you're either scum or not on your village game this time. Period.

Why are you so defensive in this post? It's you that's accusing me as obvious/stupid wolf. Now I'm also suspecting you a lot, but even so, the fact that you defended more than attacked here is an interesting tell.

I'm only not voting for you because I don't think people will follow. catwalk has some heat already and looks very suspicious. And the result of Catwalk's lynch can be significant for my case against you (the other way around is also true). If catwalk is indeed a wolf, it's less likely that you are one. If you are one, it's less liekly that Catwalk is one.