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Tides of War, a balance mod

(June 21st, 2014, 20:38)Bacchus Wrote: ToW's fix for FIN is thoroughly driven by the beakers-at-start-of-game valuation and works to balance it's effect in the early-mid game, but in the end the trait still gives the player an absolute advantage in productivity that simply cannot be met by other means at equal size of empire.

This argument really falls flat for me because you haven't given me a reason to care that if two empires have equal size in the endgame and one is FIN while the other has a trait which helped them grow early game, that the FIN civ should not have an advantage.

Quote:you just save yourself a hopeless situation of trying to calibrate a multiplicative benefit on a base which ranges from 1 to 300+ over the course of the game (# of tiles worked) to match a multiplicative benefit on a base which ranges from 1 to 30 (# of cities), an order of magnitude less.

This is just fallacious. You might as well say that CRE should not exist, since it gives you thousands of 0.001 culture per city. Such wild swings!

Cities consist of tiles. The only difference between a bonus that scales with tiles, vs a bonus that scales with cities, is that the bonus that scales with tiles will also scale if you invest resources into bigger cities rather than more cities. In fact, the bonus that scales with tiles is likely to be less swingy. Tiles worked tends to scale more consistently throughout the game across different maps than city count does. The fact that the tile units are more fine-grained is a complete red herring.
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Messages In This Thread
Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - December 16th, 2013, 14:51
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Commodore - December 16th, 2013, 14:56
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Krill - December 16th, 2013, 15:22
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Bobchillingworth - December 16th, 2013, 15:26
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Qgqqqqq - December 16th, 2013, 15:28
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by novice - December 16th, 2013, 15:29
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Krill - December 16th, 2013, 16:04
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Mardoc - December 16th, 2013, 16:17
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - December 16th, 2013, 16:19
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - December 16th, 2013, 16:25
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - December 16th, 2013, 16:26
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Krill - December 16th, 2013, 16:34
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - December 16th, 2013, 16:56
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Ichabod - December 16th, 2013, 16:47
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Catwalk - December 16th, 2013, 16:49
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by plako - December 16th, 2013, 16:54
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Krill - December 16th, 2013, 16:56
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by plako - December 16th, 2013, 17:01
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by WilliamLP - December 16th, 2013, 17:00
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Krill - December 16th, 2013, 17:02
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - December 16th, 2013, 17:09
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - December 16th, 2013, 17:05
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by plako - December 16th, 2013, 17:11
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Krill - December 16th, 2013, 17:13
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Commodore - December 16th, 2013, 17:30
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - December 16th, 2013, 17:44
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Commodore - December 16th, 2013, 17:32
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Bacchus - December 16th, 2013, 17:47
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - December 16th, 2013, 18:33
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Krill - December 16th, 2013, 18:39
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Bobchillingworth - December 16th, 2013, 18:50
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - December 16th, 2013, 19:13
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - December 16th, 2013, 19:22
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - December 16th, 2013, 23:25
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by NobleHelium - December 17th, 2013, 00:30
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Sian - December 17th, 2013, 01:18
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - December 17th, 2013, 01:23
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - December 17th, 2013, 01:51
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by TheHumanHydra - December 17th, 2013, 11:13
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - December 17th, 2013, 13:39
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - December 17th, 2013, 13:43
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by TheHumanHydra - December 17th, 2013, 14:22
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - December 17th, 2013, 19:09
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - December 17th, 2013, 20:55
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Catwalk - December 18th, 2013, 00:30
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Tredje - December 18th, 2013, 07:04
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - December 18th, 2013, 07:15
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Commodore - December 18th, 2013, 08:57
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - December 18th, 2013, 16:10
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Sian - December 18th, 2013, 17:01
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Azoth - December 19th, 2013, 15:45
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Bacchus - December 18th, 2013, 09:28
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Sian - December 18th, 2013, 09:31
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Gaspar - December 18th, 2013, 11:03
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by WilliamLP - December 18th, 2013, 11:09
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Krill - December 18th, 2013, 17:11
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Catwalk - December 18th, 2013, 17:31
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Sian - December 19th, 2013, 15:58
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by novice - December 19th, 2013, 15:59
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Sian - December 19th, 2013, 16:14
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by suttree - December 19th, 2013, 19:25
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - December 19th, 2013, 19:32
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Gaspar - December 19th, 2013, 20:32
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - December 25th, 2013, 18:20
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Catwalk - December 25th, 2013, 18:27
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - December 25th, 2013, 18:35
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Cyneheard - December 25th, 2013, 19:09
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Catwalk - December 25th, 2013, 18:47
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Gaspar - December 25th, 2013, 22:33
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by antisocialmunky - December 26th, 2013, 00:30
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - December 26th, 2013, 01:01
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Kristian95 - December 26th, 2013, 21:06
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by NobleHelium - December 26th, 2013, 21:10
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by zakalwe - December 27th, 2013, 04:37
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Ceiliazul - December 27th, 2013, 02:00
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - December 27th, 2013, 02:10
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by dtay - December 27th, 2013, 03:07
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - December 27th, 2013, 03:27
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by dtay - December 27th, 2013, 04:10
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Krill - December 27th, 2013, 08:45
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by zakalwe - December 27th, 2013, 10:19
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Gaspar - December 27th, 2013, 13:31
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by superjm - December 27th, 2013, 14:01
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Catwalk - December 27th, 2013, 14:35
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - February 13th, 2014, 16:30
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Krill - February 13th, 2014, 16:44
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Old Harry - February 13th, 2014, 19:22
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - February 13th, 2014, 20:27
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by WilliamLP - February 14th, 2014, 00:01
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - February 14th, 2014, 01:41
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by NobleHelium - February 14th, 2014, 00:06
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Ceiliazul - February 14th, 2014, 00:10
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by pindicator - February 14th, 2014, 00:52
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by NobleHelium - February 14th, 2014, 02:00
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Old Harry - February 14th, 2014, 03:14
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by flugauto - February 14th, 2014, 12:28
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Ceiliazul - February 14th, 2014, 12:47
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Hashoosh - February 14th, 2014, 22:19
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Catwalk - February 15th, 2014, 07:01
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by flugauto - February 15th, 2014, 12:05
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Catwalk - February 15th, 2014, 12:48
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by flugauto - February 15th, 2014, 13:13
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by WilliamLP - February 15th, 2014, 12:20
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Catwalk - February 15th, 2014, 13:30
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Qgqqqqq - February 15th, 2014, 13:39
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Catwalk - February 15th, 2014, 14:39
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - March 12th, 2014, 00:03
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Ceiliazul - March 12th, 2014, 00:19
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - March 12th, 2014, 00:39
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by NobleHelium - March 12th, 2014, 00:54
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by novice - March 12th, 2014, 02:14
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - March 12th, 2014, 02:24
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Bacchus - March 12th, 2014, 09:01
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - March 12th, 2014, 13:40
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by yuris125 - March 13th, 2014, 05:28
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by NobleHelium - March 12th, 2014, 23:56
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Gaspar - March 13th, 2014, 01:49
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - March 13th, 2014, 02:15
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by NobleHelium - March 13th, 2014, 02:34
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Ceiliazul - March 13th, 2014, 09:31
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Gaspar - March 13th, 2014, 13:12
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by yuris125 - March 13th, 2014, 05:30
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Krill - March 13th, 2014, 05:39
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by TheHumanHydra - March 13th, 2014, 09:25
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by pindicator - March 13th, 2014, 10:04
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by pindicator - March 13th, 2014, 14:46
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - March 13th, 2014, 15:03
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Krill - March 20th, 2014, 16:45
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - March 13th, 2014, 15:27
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Gaspar - March 13th, 2014, 16:51
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - March 13th, 2014, 17:04
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - March 13th, 2014, 16:48
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - March 13th, 2014, 17:19
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Gaspar - March 13th, 2014, 19:39
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Ceiliazul - March 13th, 2014, 21:56
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by NobleHelium - March 13th, 2014, 20:55
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - March 13th, 2014, 22:37
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - March 16th, 2014, 19:38
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by pindicator - March 16th, 2014, 20:59
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - March 19th, 2014, 01:51
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - March 20th, 2014, 16:12
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - March 20th, 2014, 17:37
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Krill - March 20th, 2014, 17:59
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - March 20th, 2014, 18:09
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - March 22nd, 2014, 04:10
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Kuro - April 4th, 2014, 15:44
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - April 4th, 2014, 18:27
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Kuro - April 4th, 2014, 19:55
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Lord Parkin - April 4th, 2014, 20:21
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by GermanJoey - April 5th, 2014, 02:41
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Lord Parkin - April 5th, 2014, 02:57
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by GermanJoey - April 5th, 2014, 13:25
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Kuro - April 5th, 2014, 15:10
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Brian Shanahan - April 9th, 2014, 06:48
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by GermanJoey - April 10th, 2014, 01:19
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - April 5th, 2014, 03:05
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Kuro - April 5th, 2014, 04:26
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by plako - April 5th, 2014, 04:31
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Kuro - April 5th, 2014, 04:50
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by GermanJoey - April 6th, 2014, 04:46
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Kuro - April 9th, 2014, 14:56
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - April 9th, 2014, 18:14
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by WilliamLP - April 10th, 2014, 14:55
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by pindicator - April 9th, 2014, 17:37
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Kuro - April 9th, 2014, 17:48
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Bobchillingworth - April 9th, 2014, 18:14
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Kuro - April 9th, 2014, 18:22
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by NobleHelium - April 10th, 2014, 02:13
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by GermanJoey - April 10th, 2014, 05:01
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Lord Parkin - April 12th, 2014, 19:49
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Kuro - April 12th, 2014, 21:27
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - April 12th, 2014, 21:40
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Lord Parkin - April 13th, 2014, 00:59
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Lord Parkin - April 13th, 2014, 18:40
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by GermanJoey - April 16th, 2014, 20:21
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Kuro - April 16th, 2014, 22:01
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by GermanJoey - April 16th, 2014, 22:50
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Lord Parkin - April 17th, 2014, 05:26
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - April 17th, 2014, 05:31
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Lord Parkin - April 17th, 2014, 05:46
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Commodore - April 17th, 2014, 06:14
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Lord Parkin - April 17th, 2014, 06:18
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - April 17th, 2014, 07:08
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Lord Parkin - April 17th, 2014, 08:27
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - June 20th, 2014, 23:13
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by NobleHelium - June 21st, 2014, 02:00
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by GermanJoey - June 21st, 2014, 04:25
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Lord Parkin - June 21st, 2014, 07:27
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by WilliamLP - June 21st, 2014, 13:37
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Lord Parkin - June 21st, 2014, 16:23
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Bacchus - June 21st, 2014, 14:59
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Lord Parkin - June 21st, 2014, 16:16
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by GermanJoey - June 21st, 2014, 16:48
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Lord Parkin - June 21st, 2014, 16:53
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Krill - June 21st, 2014, 17:13
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - June 22nd, 2014, 07:16
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Commodore - June 21st, 2014, 17:24
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - June 22nd, 2014, 07:41
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by WilliamLP - June 22nd, 2014, 08:10
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Lord Parkin - June 22nd, 2014, 18:05
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by WilliamLP - June 22nd, 2014, 18:51
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - June 23rd, 2014, 02:01
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Bacchus - June 21st, 2014, 20:38
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - June 22nd, 2014, 07:52
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Krill - June 22nd, 2014, 07:36
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - June 22nd, 2014, 07:42
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Bacchus - June 22nd, 2014, 12:18
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Gaspar - June 22nd, 2014, 13:00
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Commodore - June 22nd, 2014, 19:02
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - June 23rd, 2014, 02:19
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by GermanJoey - June 22nd, 2014, 19:10
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by T-hawk - June 23rd, 2014, 09:25
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - June 23rd, 2014, 13:11
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by zakalwe - July 11th, 2014, 04:14
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Lord Parkin - July 11th, 2014, 04:24
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by NobleHelium - August 12th, 2014, 21:09
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Krill - August 13th, 2014, 04:36
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - August 13th, 2014, 04:38
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Commodore - August 13th, 2014, 09:00
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - October 22nd, 2014, 15:59
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by SevenSpirits - September 24th, 2015, 21:32
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Asterix - November 8th, 2014, 16:00
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by GermanJoey - November 9th, 2014, 02:09
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Asterix - November 9th, 2014, 23:56
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by chumchu - May 2nd, 2016, 08:59
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by greenline - May 16th, 2016, 21:46
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by chumchu - May 17th, 2016, 08:17
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by chumchu - May 16th, 2016, 09:32
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by NobleHelium - July 2nd, 2016, 06:06
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by kjn - March 21st, 2017, 14:31
RE: Tides of War, a balance mod - by Tasunke - April 18th, 2017, 18:13

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