Clan 9 From Outer Space

[Bobchillingworth]

Entropy for sure.


AV is awesome for certain, but be sure to build a pile of Paramanders before switching. 6/8/2 + Medic, all for 40 hammers, holy shit.

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Oh yeah. This is way down the track, past Alteration, Trade, Arete, as well as all the other techs I've named in this thread. Heck, I might even wait until post-IW before going for it.

For reference, in a Deity test game I got Iron Working ~t120. Between all the optimization of this, the lower difficulty level, and getting Sanitation, I reckon I can shave quite a few turns off that.

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GLH due eot72, after some furious microing. Only 6 SoK, too.

Up-front it'll be worth 36-40cpt, increasing over time. Given my last new city cost only 2gpt, I should be able to ICS it up to the max, especially once Foreign Trade comes in. I know I'll be settling 4 cities over the next 10t (so 16 cities by t75), but let's set a goal for t90...24 cities? A bit steep, but hopefully doable - I know I want to reach at least 25 cities by t100, but it would awesome if I can make that into 30.

GA will also give ~49hpt, ~50cpt. Calculations say that that'll give me the GC from MS t71, assuming it hasn't fallen. If it doesn't fall, I'll spend 18 of the next 21t in a GA (finishing t84).

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Uhh, ended up giving Northstar Open Borders for Ale and Sugar. Negative 1 happy cap sucks, but it was just necessary to be able to plant one of my island cities in time for GLH, which is worth a considerable amount of commerce (10?). He'll be a turn later than he could be as-is.

Besides, it's not like his cities are anywhere near large enough to actually use those resources.

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Turn 66:

Didn't get a screenshot of it, but we fired the Golden Age.

Which led to some, um, ridiculous demos:


Look at dat GNP! Now, a lot of that is 100% science with a meaty deficit, but OTOH it is 100% science into a tech none of my neighbors have yet (Military Strategy), and tGLH is only 5t away.

ETA to FotT: 4t!:

[/spoiler]
^ This will be the capital's setup once we get the Form of the Titan, actually, for now it's picked up another 2 mines.
Sucks to do that to a city, but thems the breaks.

The competition:


I'm cautiously optimistic. I only had the multiplier for one civ having Warfare when I finished it last turn, which is almost certainly the Khazad. They might have had it for ages, of course, but if so...them's the breaks. We're getting it as soon as reasonably possible, after all. Anyway, I'm confident because (1) they haven't hooked copper as yet, (2) they've been settling cities and the related drops in MFG mean they're likely losing vault levels and (3) they have marble hooked, so I think they might go for the Bone Palace.

Copper hooked this turn, Form of the Titan started next turn. Debated not hooking it up, so as to avoid warning my opponents, but if they haven't started it by now they definitely can't beat my time, and I want my naval garrisons to have copper weapons. I didn't report it at the time, but I lost another axe to a spider planting the copper city, so my defenses in the North-East are going to be a tad stretched:



I think I've finally learned my lesson, though. No settler out in the fog without at two defenders from now on, and I've managed to finangle that even with all the micro problems.

Speaking of new cities, I finally settled on the spot for City 16:


Basically just because it fitted well with worker micro, and actually has good output. A bit south would require a border pop, anywhere else would want for workers, and it brings in two good tiles. Workboat already built, as silly as that is for maintenance. Workers will come from the capital once they've finished chopping.

Fun Graph-Porn:

And remember, this is pre-GA being factored in

Rantine rearing for a last promotion:


He's actually heading south because of a C3/Shock axe being spotted. I don't think it means anything - with the very favorable power differential between us, and his city-spamming, I doubt he'll go for a rush. And it seems odd to constantly show his hand with units like this, if that is his intent.

Re:tech, Military Strategy comes in either next turn or the turn after that, depending on my breakeven next turn. Really I should've delayed going 100% for another turn, so I have gold for a event next turn, but I was just so chuffed with my gold expenditure at 100% exactly equalling savings I felt I had to do it. Hopefully it doesn't matter...

After that it's Writing->FT, I think. I know I keep pushing KotE back, but there just keep being better economic options. And if HBR is needed for my naval attack anyway...it's not happening too soon regardless. Hopefully FotT will save me turns, there.

Not sure when to delete Rantine, either. I think I'll delay it a fair bit - I don't really want to be building SotC for awhile, anyway.

Anyway. Cities in their golden glory.
Fake-edit: Decided to spoiler the domestic stuff, for ease of access later on. Still, I do recommend reading, because I'm quite rambly so a lot of stuff gets touched on.

You've seen Cluny, so let's check on Cheesethief:


Ends up losing less than expected, to still the Soldiers of Kilmorph out in time. It steals the pig this turn because it was coming exactly 2h short of targets. After multipliers it's actually 1h over, now.
As mentioned earlier, this place probably becomes my Shaman-spamming/SotC spot. Eventually.

Redtooth:


Another 1t faster on the SoK, which give me a bit more leeway. Will swap cottage to horse with Skulltooth next turn, so it grows perfectly.

Darkclaw:


Finally got that Warrens. Compare this ones output to Skulltooth, and you get the effect of concentrating on warrens rather than delaying it. Skulltooth's built four settlers and two workers at this point, whilst Darkclaw is only just getting started on it's non-naval production. Anyway. I think Warrens would be fascinating to analyse for edge cases in the same way Lighthouse versus granary is in base, for example.

Skulltooth:


Gives up the rice next turn to Killconey, just borrowed whilst it was catching up to improvements.
Moar workers! May be laying it on a bit thick, actually, might decide to push out a goblin build here. I want goblins for the animal-vis - enough that I'll probably get a Hunters Lodge out at some stage. Oh and goblins are cheap garrison, so it's worth considering phasing my warrior garrisons out to the borders...but that's one of the edge things I don't think I'll do. Copper warriors just have so much more utility for defense - especially against, say, a Khazad Griffon/Spider.

Hmm. Note to self: get galley to watch for commando Kithra shenanigans.

Fangburn:


Lighthouse finally completed. Just realised this place will be the first to benefit from the overseas plants - even if right now it's swingin' a 1c route.
This place is micro'd down to a T - or just off one, actually. That is, my micro notes actually get it 1h off completion!

Code:

103/415 eot66
(Picks up pig for farm, switches grassmine to plainsmine, finishes lighthouse)
21 natprod = 124/415 eot67
(Loses pig for farm)
19 natprod = 143/415 eot68
(First two SoK (from CC) can rush=+60h)
(19 chops flat/grass =+13h)
19 natprod +60h (SoK) +13h (chop) = 235/415 eot69 (Grows eot)
(Grows onto grassmine)
(Second two SoK (from RR) can rush=+60h)
(4 chops grasshill =+13h)
23 natprod +60h (SoK) +13h (chop) = 331/415 eot70
(Third two SoK (from CC) rush)
23 natprod +60h (SoK) = 414/415 eot71

Fake-edit: Why can't we have nested spoilers, again? This gets old.
Anyway. I'll pick up a hammer, somewhere. Probably work unimproved grasshill over farm for a turn. After the big GLH is finished, this one goes for another galley or two, for security/potential invasion purposes. Then it can finally return to it's neglected warrens.

Frogblood:


Built this workboat entirely by accident I'll send it south, in case I change my mind, or otherwise I'll just send west for the island over there. Eh well, it'll find a use.
Next turn start on this cities warrens. As useless as this place is, that'll still probably pay off. And if not, meh. These places always operate on the margin.

Scumnose:


Finally on all the improved tiles it'll ever work Will finish all it's pre-IW infrastructure over the next 10t, and then I'll put it on a slow naval crank. Mayhaps it'll be great post-shipyard, but I doubt it'll ever reach that stage.
It needs a garrison, but if I'm honest, it probably won't get one for another 5 sizes. Unless the Khazad show up with a griffon, in which case panic stations will be activated (well, I get a 1t goblin here anyway, so not too big of a deal. But still).

Ragear:


Working unimproved, and liable to stay so. Very much a meh city location, made awesome by sanitation and some worker support.

Mangefur:


Making a decent job of things, despite not having recieved any worker treatment for at least 5t. Next warrens location, surprisingly enough. Might make this one my Lodge city.

Killconey:


Really working the rice. Might want for worker labor soon enough - after that mine it'll only have one worker that isn't bled off to the isles. Still need to sort getting a worker on that cow, ugh.

Shadow:


Really working the copper, just slipped in a turn on the forest for more food and less wasted culture. Gets decently soon food.

Both the islands get founded on t69, two turns before properly used:




South gets more worker support, but worse tiles. North is lacking in worker support, but will have both the clams/crabs (for when I get around to building some workboats). You can also see corn city in the edge of the pane up there, founded t68 and working the pig immediately.

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Bit pissed at the moment. Dreylin built Form of the Titan, and either Dreylin or Kragroth got the Military Strategy Great Commander.

I know, I know, good play, good meta and all that. Still pissed, and had to take a while rejigging micro.

Firstly, without the xp from FotT I had to decide what I was going to do. In the end, I think I'm going to stay in MS, and eat the xp loss. That means that I need to kiss the mage idea goodbye. It had already mostly happened, what with delaying KotE and all, so this is more formality than anything else. So what will I do for collateral?



Based off current trajectory, ritualists are about 25t away, presuming I go there before Iron Working - which is by no means the definite right answer. I'll reevaluate that closer to the time.


Secondly, losing the GC means I'm very unlikely to get enough GP for a second GA. Instead, then, I plan on going for the AV shrine, which will let me be a bit laid back about the whole thing, as well as skipping Necromancy (and probably sorcery).


Finally, what to do with the capitals production? I was all set to turn it all into Thanes and SoK (for new Warrens), until I scrolled down and saw that a certain wonder was still available:




Not sure why it's lasted so long, but I suppose there's a chance I can run away with this. It took a bunch of micro, but I managed to turn my 3t FotT into a 4t Bone Palace. Requires another SoK (up to 3 total), but it's definitely worth it if I can get my hands on it.

That'll come in eot70. Every single one of my opponents has Philosophy, and most have had it for quite a long time, so there's a good chance I'll end up with failgold. Still, I'm not very invested in this build, nor am I planning much around it.


Losing Titan also means a Northstar capital kill-strike is untenable (needs xp to promote to mobility). I'll still look at sending over a small force to force sanctuary and potentially take Inishbofin, but I won't have nearly so lofty goals as I once did.

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I have the turn, but not enough mental capacity to play it after a looooong day of traveling. Not sure when I'll get to it tomorrow, sorry!

I do notice that this a reverse turn since the save came to me via Kragroth. Maybe we should try handing it the opposite way for a few rounds; Kragroth and I can swap passwords and Q and Northstar can do the same! 9-)

I'd quite seriously be curious to see how fast Northstar could screw up my position right now. If I could play with MP personalities as AIs, I'd look at playing a game like that.

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Kragroth showed up with Kithra.

8str, with Drill2 and all the flanking promos (85% withdraw, 2-3 first strikes).

Only 3 moves though, which is odd. I'll have ~5 warriors in the area if he tries anything stupid, plus there's a lizard lair he has to take out. Without him getting defensive bonuses, I'm confident. If he tries to explore my borders, I'll cancel them.

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Scored Bone Palace. W00t.

Kragroth's Kithra capered cowardly (not) closer. (Ran away.) He tried to get my world map, but that's not going to happen.

GLH falls next turn. I don't think anyone else even has sailing yet.

Declared war on Northstar, and moved in a galley with warrior onboard. Mksclicked, actually, so he keeps his crabs for another turn.

Settled my 16th city. Breaks perfectly even already, even before GLH (though in GA). Started another pair of settlers (due in 3t), one will go west towards the barb city, and the other will steal Kragroth's big island (giving me control of 3/4).

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We've all seen how good Bone Palace can be for Clan, so why wasn't I more interested in it?

Well, firstly there's the fact that I thought it would have fallen by now. Others have had Philosophy at least 20t, now, and marble is close, and I have two rivals with extra bonuses. So there's that.

But more importantly, IMO, Form of the Titan was a better choice for my civ. Lets unbundle that a little.

Bone Palace gives ~500h, ~500c. That's according to slightly old estimates, so a bit of a lowball, but pretty close. It costs ~300 real hammers. So it gives ~200h/500c. Which is massive, of course.

Titan doesn't give a real advantage like that. Rather, it makes the hammers I am making currently and will ever make that much more valuable (and remember, XP increases in power much more than in BTS).

The difference, then, is in the advantage each gives. BP gives a short term boost, albeit a massive one, FotT gives a long term one, which continues to grow as your own economy grows and you build more units.

In FFH especially, as well as ant game in general, you want to minimize the asymmetric advantages my opponents get over me and maximize my asymmetric advantages. As a runaway/game leader, I am already in a good position, so my focus is to be risk adverse - especially in taking the paths that may be slightly less economically efficient but will let me win militarily, for example, my island city near the Khazad would be a much better city one tile east...but it would be slightly less defensible. If another competitor was close to me economically, I'd take the risk. In the position that I'm in, I chose to eat the loss.

And the same goes for wonders. My economic position would still be unmatched if Dreylin had landed BP. Shaken, for sure, but still ahead. Thus, the greater danger lies in letting him continue to accumulate military advantages, so IMO the Titan would have been more valuable to land.