RB Pitboss #2 [SPOILERS] - Speaker and Sullla

[Dr. Nomadic]

I like how you guys are trying to get a Great Engineer in order to lightbulb a military tech instead of trying to rush a wonder. This game has so much strategy...

And BTW you guys didn't answer my earlier question.

[Cinnamon]

@ Sullla- I didn't realize that forges also applied a +25% bonus to whips as well. I will now be building forges in those low production, high food cities because it seems forges may be MORE useful there than in the high production cities.

Also, on a more serious note, please stop plagiarizing: those of us who got a Harvard MBA and have spent many years researching the foundations of finance know the original business plan quite well.
Phase 1- Collect Underpants
Phase 2- ???
Phase 3- Profit!

I expect proper citation to the Underpants Gnomes from here on out. MLA format please.


@ Dr. Nomadic- Obviously I am not playing the game, but imho if their sentries had not spotted the incoming stack of HAs, if the attack from the south had come in 1 big wave at the same time, and if those Praets had landed then (and correctly!)....then Speaker and Sullla would have had a very hard time holding on until construction.
Of course, there's no use in these hypothetical situations, since this didn't happen. Both sides played to the best of the ability, both sides made some mistakes, but Sullla and Speaker coordinated defenses well and came out ahead.

[ej801]

You should know that the underpants gnomes have gone to working full time for santa and therefore it dose not matter. :neenernee

[Dr. Nomadic]

@Cinnamon: Also remember that forges allow you to hire engineer specialists, which is another plus in high food cities. I think there's also a bug where if you whip a forge the forge's whipping bonus gets applied without actually having a forge, but I don't know.

[Speaker]

Sullla, I logged in to check out T138 and got a little carried away and moved our workers. Sorry about that. Plantations take 5 turns, so the Silks will be finished next turn, but the Sugar will take another turn. We will have both Sugars hooked the turn after next. I whipped the forge in Fort Henry for 3 population. I borrowed the copper resource for Fredericksburg, to finish the Forge (it was 1 hammer short otherwise). I moved our military, and we will be able to gift 1 HA to Korea next turn, and the second the turn after. I decided to do a bit more scouting on Jowy's island, and not get back on the boat. I am actually thinking we may just want to build another galley to move settlers to our island. We could keep exploring with the galley in Korea's land, and improve our map information, maybe head toward Kathlete and figure out just how far away he really is.

Plako was in game, so we chatted a bit.

Long, boring chat log to follow.

TL:DR version:
1) Korea has a NAP with Kathlete until T160 and worries they may be backstabbed
2) Korea is researching toward Feudalism for Vassalage, rather than toward Machinery for Crossbows. They feel secure with Hwacha.
3) Rome researched Aesthetics and Literature, but skipped Music, and is now researching Code of Laws. They do not have Construction. Korea can see their research.
4) Slaze is "relying on NAPs" and is teching toward Feudalism. Korea confided in us that Kathlete ended their NAP with Slaze and they are now in a cool down period. We knew this already, but it was nice of Korea to tell us in confidence.
5) Korea traded us a spare clam resource for one of our sheep. We are hitting the health cap now, so this was a nice surprise. Chancellorsville would have been unhealthy without it, and will need an aqueduct soon.

Speaker: for vassalage?
plako: yes
Speaker: not a bad notion
plako: and we've good enough units to handle melee
Speaker: right, the hwacha
plako: until maces come up
plako: Longbows are also cheaper
Speaker: question for you, and feel free to not answer.....what's the status of your relationship with Kathlete?
Speaker: they are gearing up for war (see power chart), and we are wondering if you have any inkling who they will go after
plako: it is alright although I'm constantly fearing they backstab us
Speaker: do you have a NAP with them?
plako: might be slaze
plako: we've until T160
plako: They canceled NAP with slaze actually
Speaker: ah ok cool....Jowy keeps asking us to extend our NAP, which is to 150....and we worry that if we do, he and Kathlete will be able to attack you without us being able to help you
plako: cool down period is still ongoing. Please don't tell him that you heard this from me
Speaker: We already knew that, but thanks for confiding.
plako: ah ok good
Speaker: I think T155 is when the cool down ends
Speaker: 25 turn cool down is ridiculous, by the way
plako: yes. But we might also be target
plako: I don't know if these NAPs make sense anymore in this game
plako: Seems to be gearing towards team game
plako: If opportunity comes I'm tempted to attack Whosit city that is close to our capital, before its border pops
Speaker: the one above you?
Speaker: does whosit have construction yet?
plako: no he planted NE-NE-NE
plako: nasty one. 2 movers can hit our city after the border pops
Speaker: do you have another land city to the west of your capital?
plako: yes
Speaker: or just your capital is mainland?
Speaker: ok that's good
plako: 2 cities on mainland
plako: we've only 1 spot left to settle
plako: in the islands
Speaker: i doubt whosit will build many two-movers, being Rome
plako: That is something I hope
plako: Hwachas+Axes could do pretty well against a stack of praets
Speaker: but he'd need quite a lot of two-movers to kill a mature 50%+ capital with spears or Longbows in it
Speaker: yes that would work very well
plako: true. I guess it is more likely it is brute force attack
Speaker: have you seen any catapults yet from him?
plako: he doesn't have construction
Speaker: well that's good
plako: going for CoL
plako: currently
plako: 5T
Speaker: ah you can see his tech research, i'm guessing?
plako: yes
Speaker: he did Aesthetics and Literature
Speaker: right?
plako: yes
plako: Great Library coming
plako: almost certainly
Speaker: yeah....he built the parthenon already, in anticipation I guess. that is an expensive wonder though
plako: I was afraid he goes for music and bombs the city close by
Speaker: he may
plako: He has marble
Speaker: yes I know, but it is still expensive, even with marble
plako: yeah what it provides and it obsoletes quite early
Speaker: exactly
Speaker: how's everything else going over by you?
plako: But he can afford that. We don't have that luxury
plako: building military mainly using whip
Speaker: been there, done that.
plako: and maturing our newest cities
plako: don't have neough workers, but GLH makes them still profitabel
Speaker: yes, great lighthouse is awesome for you guys, with all the islands. I'm glad you got it.
plako: that gives us even some kind of chance here, but also puts target on our head
plako: our islands are hard to defend
Speaker: i would guess that both Kathlete and Whosit would rather fight Slaze....but who knows
plako: long ones
Speaker: yeah, islands are quite difficult to protect
plako: probably, but I've understood they've been quite friendly towards him.
Speaker: bizarre. he has a ton of cities and no military
plako: He relies on NAPs also
Speaker: he should show his people the whip and soon!
plako: He said he is going towards Feudalism
plako: or might have it already don't know for sure
Speaker: ok well i should be going
Speaker: it was nice chatting with you
plako: ok bye
Speaker: and thanks for the trade
plako: nice talking to you too

[Sullla]

Nice conversation with plako, Speaker. There was some useful info in there. slaze's plan to build no defenders and rely on NAPs for safety sounds like sheer insanity to me. I guess he's banking on Kathlete and Whosit hating us enough to leave him in peace (?)

There was no harm done with the workers, as Speaker and I had already agreed on where to move them this turn. Just don't make a habit of it!

That meant I didn't have much to do other than end turn and take screenshots, so here's a pair of pictures for you:



We've finally reached plako's island cities in the north. It's very tough to see their aquamarine-colored borders against the water tiles, but look closely and you can spot the difference. Now we know why plako has been so worried about Jowy in his messages to us - Jowy's core is just to the south of plako's island cities. This is actually another reason why it might be a good idea to take out Jowy; if we controlled Athens and Corinth, we'd help secure plako's southern borders and allow them to focus on Whosit/Nakor. Worth thinking about.

Here's the GNP bar graph:



This thing always looks like a total mess, as people increase and decrease their science spending, not to mention all the pre-req bonuses and such. Anyway, I wanted to highlight the importance of Currency tech for our team. We're the light purple line, unfortunately tough to pick out from the others on the graph. The red circle shows where we were sitting after the war with Jowy ended - not in good shape, around 50 in GNP rating. Then we had 2 turns of Currency-fueled 100% research (the huge jump upwards), followed by a new plateau in the white region around 150 GNP. The graph provides a visible representation of just what a big deal that tech meant for us.

Just keep in mind how silly the GNP stat can be. We didn't do anything to increase our research this turn, yet just by going from Calendar tech (20% pre-req discount) to Code of Laws tech (40% discount), our GNP increased from ~155 to 187. Heh. Beware those numbers!

[Ilios]

We're the light purple line

Why not just call it pink?

[T-hawk]

Why not just call it pink?

Yeah, then you could use the Pink Line to connect the Pink Dots.

[Sullla]

Some picture updates from the current turn, T139:



The news ticker on the left side shows two important facts: slaze got a Great Prophet and built the Hindu Shrine, and Whosit completed the Great Library, just as we predicted he would many turns ago. Nice move from both of them, unfortunately. We'd really like to get a Prophet for our own Jewish shrine (that would help our finances noticeably), but I don't see any easy way of doing so, since our next Great Person after the Engineer will require 300 GPP. We'll probably end up turning Spartansburg into our National Epic city, and run a Priest specialist there in the hopes of popping out a Prophet at low odds. If we can get enough Great People, sooner or later a Prophet will appear... although that's the type of Great Person that always seems to show up when you don't want it, and never the reverse!

Also notice that Nakor has a galley sailing past us in the inner sea. Hopefully that unit is just scouting, not setting up a city in there... I mean, Nakor wouldn't be foolish enough to plant right across from us on the center island, right? That would be an invitation for trouble.


Spartansburg has expanded borders, and holy cow at the food here! +11 food surplus at size 4. Looks a little like those cities in the T-Hawk mod used in the last Adventure. The three food bonus tiles alone can actually support five specialists between them. With a single farm, we could run 6 specialists at size 10 (working rice, sheep, deer, grassland farm = +12 food) which would be 6 x 3 x 2 = 36 Great Person points per turn. Add in National Epic, and that would become 60 GPP/turn! That's a lot of Great People...

Obviously we'd need to research more techs and settle the marble resource in the far northwest to set that up, but it's worth thinking about.



Our horse archers have finally reached Korea, and scouted out their best island city. Now we have even further reason why plako has been concerned about Jowy: Pusan contains the Great Lighthouse! And Korea's entire economy is running off of Great Library trade routes. This is their most important city, even more important than their capital. The worst thing for us would probably be a dogpile from Whosit, Kathlete, and Jowy on plako, striking at this key island from Korea. Take out the Great Lighthouse, and plako goes from being an important economic player, to a useless non-entity again.

Speaking of Korea, they sent us this email:

Dear Killer Angels,

Would you be up to provide us a short term loan so that we could finish Feudalism in 3 turns? We have money for the next 2 turns, but lack some for the 3rd turn. I haven't calculated exactly, but I think I would need ~60 gold to finish Feudalism. After that I would turn the slider to 0% and start accumulating gold and could repay you a turn after Feudalism.

Would it be alright, if we pay 10% intrest rate for the 2 turns? i.e. assuming that 60 is needed we pay 66 back?
Best regards,
plako

Can't say we want to do this, but I think we have to agree, don't we? I mean, they helped us out earlier, after all. It will delay our research by basically 1 turn to raise the 60g they need. What do you say, Speaker?

In terms of our own research, we did discover Calendar last turn, and our workers are in the process of connecting silks and sugar. We'll actually go from having 0 Calendar resources connected to having 2 sugars and 1 silks connected in a single turn! Heh. That's just the way the worker micro turned out. Now Speaker can finally start shifting units around into actual strategic locations, as opposed to just keeping them around for Hereditary Rule military police.

This turn's almost over, so as soon as Jowy plays his turn we'll be ready to go again with Turn 140.

[Reagan]

The worst thing for us would probably be a dogpile from Whosit, Kathlete, and Jowy on plako . . . .

Can't say we want to do this, but I think we have to agree, don't we? I mean, they helped us out earlier, after all.