[SPOILERS - PBEM29] spacetyrantxenu - Mao of Babylon

[Boldly Going Nowhere]

My understanding is that production occurs when you hit end turn. If you have the hammers in at that point, it's done. If someone were to do that earlier in the same turn order, they would complete the build. Same thing for tech races to get the Artist at Music, Merchant/Scientist/General for later techs.

Yes, turn order matters. In PB games it is randomized each turn IIRC. PBEM it is set and if you ain't first, Ricky Bobby, you're last. Or 2nd, or 3rd.

[Boldly Going Nowhere]

Turn played in an effort to set a frantic pace and catch up to the vets. Lurkers, how are we doing? Have we caught the pros yet?

This game is moving faster now. Good! I skip paying attention for a few turns and see lots of progress. This makes me very happy.

This turn, Rick continues the GLH build. The stack of workers that finished the grass mine last turn all moved to complete a 1T cottage NE of Rick. This was to get them in position to help finish the mine and other chops next turn without wasting worker turns. I suggest getting in and finishing the mine next turn, as well as the two chops, and getting the workers moved to other jobs in other cities. Here's where we stand with GLH:

GLH = 134
chops available= 13*3 = 39
current production into GLH = 26

remainder = 69

T47 (work clams to finish writing) = 15
T48 (work grass mine) = 18
T49 =18
T50 = 18

134-39-26-15-18-18-18=GLH
zero remainder.

Mitt, in particular, needs some worker love, and I have designs on a new city in the tundra to increase our happy cap. May as well send some these workers there. Mitt hooked up fish and is desperately short of improved tiles. Currently we have fish, sheep, and a mine improved. Growth to 5 next turn, after we finish the bowman. We'll be unhappy for a turn and double whip 5/3, and perhaps go with either a worker or settler immediately after to prevent more growth. No sense being unhappy, and this city has been whipped pretty harshly. What doesn't kill you...

Chop completed in Ron Paul, C4 location. I could have completed the granary this turn by working the 0/0/3 PHF over the 3/0/1 river FP, but this would have delayed writing by 1T. Yes, it is down to 1c! I don't think it's worth it to delay the tech, even if we aren't building libraries next turn, which we won't. I want to give as much time as possible to set up open borders before we drop the GLH bomb.

Newt still has a couple turns left in the settler build, which will go to the C5 location. The upcoming settler from Mitt will go to the horse/silver/whales/fur site in the shit tundra. I want that happy cap raised. We have plenty of good tiles in Rick and Newt that I want to continue to work, even after whips.

And, explorers explored. Nothing spectacular. I like this map. Xenu, we can talk about city plants later on. For now, the FP location, tundra location, and perhaps the cottage incubator south of Newt are next. Or, building a galley and taking out the islands.

[spacetyrantxenu]

Of course we decide to settle the tundra now and Dazed snipes the spot from us. We didn't have a border agreement, but he should have certainly consulted us before just settling. Mao is not pleased. I've managed to talk him down from the ledge, but evidently Boldly had a direct line to Mao when I told him about it:

Boldly: F^$!#r. let's take it

me: lol. that's why you aren't doing the diplo.

I chatted with Dazed, Catwalk, and Sian more or less simultaneously. Posted below. If you're a diplo hater feel free to skip. TL;DR version is that Dazed and I are trying to come to some sort of accommodation that doesn't lead to war. I don't get the impression he's very concerned about it, though. I'm also not intimidated. This is a stalemate situation that would be detrimental to us both.

Posts forthcoming.

[spacetyrantxenu]

The unabridged conversation with Dazed:

Mao: catwalk says you've settled up on me.
any truth to it?
or is the kitty making mischief?

Dazedroya​lty: kitty's do like to make mischief
but it is closer to you than you'd probably like

Mao: hmm...considering we don't have a border agreement you had no obligation to discuss it with me. but in the interest of maintaining good relations it would have been a good idea.
how close is it to my existing city?

Dazedroya​lty: i can't see your city

Mao: can you see my borders?

Dazedroya​lty: but there''s no bfc overlap

Mao: right. but we don't consider our existing city to be a front city.

Dazedroya​lty: i'm not sure i understand whta you mean
my city is in the tundra and only 1 tile over the "middle" line
so it's not exactly a far reach

Mao: we considered that territory to be in our sphere of influence. it is closer to our capital than it is to yours. i understand the concept of a settling race and getting there first. i'm just staying that doesn't always leave the party who was settled upon feeling equitably treated.

Dazedroya​lty: i see your point.
in my perspective we all had a "home are" and then two "contested areas" (tundra and jungle)
my city is clearly in tundra not your starting area

Mao: it is also clearly on my side of the even point between our empires

Dazedroya​lty: that's true.
but in a contested area

Mao: i'll put it this way. if i can get a source of silver elsewhere without causing myself irreparable harm, i'm probably not willing to go to war over this. but it can't be as part of a trade that could be cancelled by anyone on a whim.

Dazedroya​lty: there's four silver sources

i only settled one
you have another one to the north that is equal distance
to get silver i had to settle towards you or towards someone else

Mao: correct. i could settle the one to my north, as you could have. this one was much closer to my land

Dazedroya​lty: it just fell to you

Mao: i don't have a copy of the map handy. i can't remember how close the one toward sian was to your land

Dazedroya​lty: i'm looking right now
ok
looking at the map
i coulda settled north
but then I woulda been doing the same thing to Sian
and I simply didn't have the map info in that direction
so i had to choose
so i went with the map i could see

Mao: so that implies you'd rather take a risk against me than against sian? or is that going too meta game?

Dazedroya​lty: short of settling on a mountain, i had to come closer to you

Mao: that's understandable.

Dazedroya​lty: well it is more a funciton of the mpa knowledge i have
i have a NAP with Sian so i woulda loved to push towards him
but i can't see what's there

Mao: kuro did screw you on map knowledge
i have a complete map of the central area, if you were interested in trading. a bit late now though.

Dazedroya​lty: hmmm... that woulda been nice for sure
off the record for a moment and I think i can help
but not unless you agree to discretion (ie not sharing this info)

Mao: i can go off the record.
*off the record*

Dazedroya​lty: Sian has told me his settling plan
basically

Mao: that was silly

Dazedroya​lty: of course he could have been lying

Mao: right. but we have ways of dealing with liars
as you probably do too

Dazedroya​lty: but i think that if you build a settler (or have one already!) asap, you'll be able to claim a great part of the Tundra
ultimately, it is not going to be likely or maybe even possible for all four of us to have an equal share

Mao: in the center?

Dazedroya​lty: there's lots of options

Mao: that would be difficult to defend

Dazedroya​lty: not with bowmen
you have the best "don't attack me" unit
it's not great on offensive
but it's a PITA to attack

Mao: for everyone but you
well in cities, yes
by everyone

Dazedroya​lty: true but i'm not interested in attacking
that would be counter productive for me
you send one bowman and a settler and you can claim just about anythign in the middle

Mao: i think my adjustment to this problem would have to be to take catwalk's location. but he has previously told me that the northern silver is not in a good location for him.
maybe. but lines of reinforcement would certainly be tricky on the wrong side of your city

Dazedroya​lty: you mean your N and his S?

Mao: yes
oops, yeah, stupid toriodal

Dazedroya​lty: yeah. well w/ OB that's defintiely not a problem
but even still there's a land path that woudl be open to you

Mao: OBs can be cancelled prior to invasion. that city would not be safe without a contiguous and protectable cultural border
provided catwalk doesn't beat me to the other silver spot, yes

Dazedroya​lty: right, and i'm saying take the one between you and Catwalk

Mao: the other problem i have with your new settlement is that it makes defending my border much more difficult. now my starting area is exposed without a fortress city between us

Dazedroya​lty: force Catwalk to battle Sian's Stonehenge culture
you don't have a city there? I assumed that was a second city's borders! that's from your capital?

Mao: there is a city but it isn't designed to be the outside of the core. workable tiles would be pillaged in the event of war
enough to cripple the city.
and your city placement makes any other settlement in the area illegal

Dazedroya​lty: ah. i didn't realize that

Mao: i'm talking to catwalk about the other silver site now. to prevent strained relations with both of my immediate neighbors i'd prefer to work out a deal for that silver rather than just settling it with a bow and settler. what would you be willing to do to work out compensation toward that end (if he proves harm from having to settle toward sian's gold, that is).
compensation != tribute to me. it would go to catwalk as a way of ensuring no hurt feelings about inconveniencing him.

Dazedroya​lty: i'm not sure what you're meaning

Mao: the alternative is always to do nothing, just settle up on him, and then have him mad at me, which i'd rather not do.
well at this point there isn't anything we could actually do, can't trade without OBs, can't send gold before Currency. this is a theoretical exercise until a practical application could be possible.

Dazedroya​lty: but you want me to compensate catwalk for him giving you the silver to your norht?

Mao: i guess gifting units is possible with OBs right?
it would rankor you less to compensate him than me, wouldn't it?

Dazedroya​lty: yes

Mao: *rankle i mean
rankor being the product of rankling

Dazedroya​lty: i'm always open to continuing negotiations and maintaining strong relationships
like i've said before i have no intentions of war
and i believe i settled in a "contested" area
but beyond that, everything is on the table

Mao: how about this. in the interest of assuaging my security concerns you agree to not launch an offensive from that front city toward my core. that isn't to limit you from in the future attacking me. you'd just have to stage the troops elsewhere. likewise, i agree to not wipe that city off the map, pending a peaceful resolutions (somehow) to the silver issue.
have you seen silver anywhere else on the map?
we have not
(you also sniped a whale, but we can get that elsewhere)

Dazedroya​lty: I am willing to not launch an attack from there for a specific number of turns (to be negotiated) but not indefniitely

Mao: doh, that sounds a lot like the NAPs that Regan warned us about.

Dazedroya​lty: you're asking for an agreement too which is like a NAP
logically speaking

Mao: well, republicans aren't always consistent. we can't stay on message, you know.

Dazedroya​lty: that is true

Mao: who has the turn?
either you or catwalk according to the traker
*tracker

Dazedroya​lty: i passedit on already

Mao: i'll take a look at the map when i get the save and think about it some more. if you're willing, try to scheme a compensation plan that isn't onerous to you (for the relatively slight provocation). i'll think about it, too. my goal for this situation is to maintain good relations with as many people as possible since war is unprofitable at this stage; to maintain a secure and defensible perimiter for my core; and to provide defensible access to resources that i should have access to. i acknowledge there is no such thing as "my land" and "your land" if two parties are willing to fight about it, but i know it would benefit us both to stay away from that level of action at this point of the game. stalemate = falling behind.

Dazedroya​lty: i'm not sure i don't see why you can't negotiate with catwalk/slowcheetah for that silver
the whole "i don't have a choice" when they do is pretty compelling

Mao: i am negotiating with them

Dazedroya​lty: hardline them
just say it's non negotiable

Mao: but that doesn't eliminate that you didn't take the diplomatically productive step of discussing the border settlement with us.

Dazedroya​lty: that's true and it was a major oversight
in my mind, no NAPs just rolled into settling as well
i've never played diplo game with a player who didn't sign NAPs

Mao: lol. in the face of existing tradition of border agreements being a separate issue? you can't say i've been unresponsive in diplo. we could have talked it over.

Dazedroya​lty: well, i've only played 2 games with diplo at all. in the first i was eliminated pronot
*pronto
in teh second all settling agreements were a part of NAPs
so i admit diplo is not my forte

Mao: if you had been 20 turns later in getting to this one you would have probably been eliminated very shortly because of kuro's mishandling of playing the turns. we would have already been at war

Dazedroya​lty: that woulda been exciting
20 turns later i probably wouldn't have signed up

Mao: yeah, the lurkers were upset that you joined when you did. you saved team ottoman
probably saved my chances of winning the game, too. fighting at that point would have been suicide for winning but i wasn't having any fun

Dazedroya​lty: yeah i understand
i'm suprirsed y'all stuck it out as long as you did
i even had made a comment that when Kuro "came back" that you'd all regret it shortly

Mao: because he'd hold the save for three days again? he did that a few times after saying he'd do better

Dazedroya​lty: he's done that in every game he's a part of

Mao: right. it was pointed out to me in my thread he had previously been eliminated from a game (by bob) because of that.
i would have learned from it. oh well.
i'm glad it didn't come to that. i enjoy playing the turns on time much more than staring at the timer.

Dazedroya​lty: well, let's keep up the discussion because i think neither of us wants to make a hasty decision we'll both regret

Mao: OK. i'll look at the save tonight and talk things over with boldly. btw, there's a reason he isn't doing diplo. his first reaction:

Boldly: %!&%^@. let's take it

Mao: lol. that's why you aren't doing the diplo

Dazedroya​lty: well i hope you also told him that'd be harder than he might think!

Mao: my next line:
he is more likely to have immortals now than he was before. this is not a good time to fight.

[spacetyrantxenu]

Chat with Catwalk:

Catwalk: Hello dictator

me: holler

Catwalk: I've been busy all day, slowcheetah played the turns for us

me: yeah, i had my brother play the most recent one

Catwalk: Have you noticed a new blue settlement near your city?
Not our blue settlement, mind

me: near the tundra?

Catwalk: Yes

me: hmm...no i haven't. how close?

Catwalk: Very close, claiming the southern silver

me: is it taking my silver and horses?
just the silver?

Catwalk: Let me see
Horse too

me: oh really. that's across my side of the line

Catwalk: In between them

me: that won't work.

Catwalk: This is of particular interest to us, as the eastern silver is the only one in range for us

me: righty

Catwalk: If you and dazed were to make peace over this, that would put our two empires somewhat at odds
As we need that silver badly

me: someone is goign to end up with two silvers

Catwalk: Well, we could go for the northern silver

me: either they share or there will be a war somewhere

Catwalk: And everybody would get one, if we manage to claim it
But it's hard to claim

me: would that location fit your dotmap?

Catwalk: Dotmap-wise it'd be okay
But it'd be far away, in the middle of the tundra
And we'd have concerns that Sian would get there first
He has a monster start

me: he has no military

Catwalk: Basically, I'm fishing for clues as to how you might respond to dazed making this settlement
Not to be forwarded, of course
Nor will we forward any information dazed may have given us, although I don't think there is much

me: i haven't seen the save since it happened, is it in the current turn?

Catwalk: Our turn is up, and dazed settled just now
We have a scout there, will need to check with slowcheetah whether or not we can forward you scouting info
We haven't been able to coordinate much past few days, both been busy
Micro and diplo have suffered a bit as a result
Ah, there he is

me: ha, yeah. i'm playing quickly too.
well, i outsourced the last turn to my brother. maybe he played it well.

Catwalk: I will get back to you soon, we will discuss matters
Also need to get our workers and stuff sorted out
Mistakes are piling up

me: ok, at your leisure.

Catwalk: Would you be able to easily vacate dazed from the location, if you so desired?

me: depends on how much i'm willing to set myself back vis a vis expansion.
as long as he doesn't have longbows, yes, i could raze the city. but the cost may be more than i'd like.

Catwalk: If you capture a size 1 city, is it razed automatically?

me: yes

Catwalk: It'd be a nice spot for you

me: we already had a spot planned over there. not sure if he nailed it or not

Catwalk: It's right in between silver and horses

me: nope, he's settled in the wrong spot

Catwalk: slowcheetah says I can forward scouting info
He has a warrior and a worker there
We don't know what else might be underway

Catwalk: Hey
Have you by any chance contacted dazed about this yet?

me: talking to him now

Catwalk: Ouch
Means he knows we told you
Was going to suggest waiting until your turn rolled around

me: short of war the only logical solution is for everyone to settle silver counter-clockwise. how much would that cause problems for you to settle the west gold instead of the south? maybe we could make it worth your while (*not an offer) and avoid war for everyone.

Catwalk: Hmm

me: in the cost/benefit analysis, going to war right now would be the most expensive thing we could do.

Catwalk: Still discussing

Catwalk: How serious might such an offer of compensation be? We're sad kitties looking at the land with the east silver taken

me: not serious yet. dazed didn't seem interested in paying anything

Catwalk: Alright
And yeah, compensation would only make sense if dazed were to compensate you for settling up
This is not a good situation for either one of us
Kudos to Commodore for the map, though

me: i'm working from a security point of view on that issue. economically i am compensated enough as long as i get silver in contiguous cultural borders
it's a great map

Catwalk: contiguous cultural borders?
Please google translate that into Korean

me: i won't be satisfied with having to build a city that doesn't touch the rest of my empire to get silver because it would be impossible to reinforce and defend.

Catwalk: Hmm
Catwalk: Would some sort of deal involving you giving us bowmen that we'd pledge not to use against you be any use?

me: since we're not on teams wouldn't they convert to archers?

Catwalk: aw
They would?

me: i think so

Catwalk: That would suck balls

me: wait
maybe not...seems like sian would know about that from one of the PBEM games he is (was) in

Catwalk: We don't need a decision about this matter tonight, won't affect any of our immediate moves
Will it affect yours?
slowcheetah says he has confirmation they won't convert
Based on a previous game

me: oh, good to know then.
then again, there's the slaze factor which would necessitate us signing a NAP

Catwalk:
Hence the promise to not use them against you
Call it a one-way NAP
Technically, you wouldn't be signing a NAP

Catwalk: Also, another matter

me: yes?

Catwalk: Sian seems to be taking a lead
He has 6 workers
If dazed were to commit to settling up on Sian as well, that might help curb him

me: he's told everyone about that
if dazed settles on sian, you get no silver.
until you take sian's

Catwalk: Provided we settle up on Sian as well

me: right
me: sian has lots of land toward the jungle worldwrap he can settle

Catwalk: Looks like Sian might be okay with letting us have the northern silver
If so, the matter can be put to rest

Catwalk: It seems likely we can get along about it, we're planning on going for the northern silver
Where would you want to settle the eastern silver?

me: i don't have a map in front of me but i think it was immediately south of the river tile on the coast. you and i had discussed this a long time ago, where i told you i didn't want to snipe your horse
but since we've found horses elsewhere in the meantime i assume that isn't important now
me: but that may have to change since dazed has changed my dot mapnow, i don't nkow.

Catwalk: There is a good location NE of the silver
But not sure if either of us could be happy with the other having that spot
Anyway, I will play our turn now and go to bed
Thanks for the chat xenu

me: if you have a photo of it, feel free to email it and well discuss. i have the entire region mapped out already so it's no new info for me.
thanks for discussing the settlement issue. it's best to remain on friendly terms when possible.

Catwalk: Agreed

[spacetyrantxenu]

Chat with Sian:

Sian: the kitties are appearently having a long chat about what to do

me: i'm off work in an hour, can play anytime after that
right. well, if i can offer you some free advice from a distant rival who would like to have no cause to grumble about your in game choices, i would advocate you settle your southern silver, not your eastern one.
dazed settled up on me and i'm trying to lead to an outcome that won't involve me going to war and still get everyone the resource they want.

Sian: planing to settle south anyways
allready dealed it off with Dazed so he's aware of that i'm eying that one

me: that's good to know. you may want to pass that along to catwalk since he may wonder about the truth of it coming from me, since i have a vested interest in that outcome.
really? what deal did he offer?

Sian: not really made a deal ... i said that i was planing, and he said that he had no reason to work against it, since it wasn't in his plans to anyways

me: i plan to settle all of your jungle cities across the grassy world wrap, then.

Sian: come again?

me: that was tongue in cheek
in repsonse to you not driving a hard bargain against dazed for the silver location

Sian: hard to drive a hard bargain when he says "okay, not that i care to much anyways since its not in my plans to grab it"

me: right. you haven't said you plan to settle those grassy sites. though i can assume you will.
it was meant as a joke.

Sian: incoming vultures

me: toward...?

Sian: those grassy site cities

me: should send settlers, too. :neenernee:
back on topic, and seriously, it's good that you plan to settle south. that grants catwalk access to the only other source of silver, which should delay a hot war over this problem.
*prevent

Sian: actually its first recently (within the last few turns) that i figured it would be better for me in terms of availabiltiy and tradability) to target the silver to the south instead of to the east

me: i've heard from you and from someone else in the game of your six workers and almost settled fifth city. not to put too fine a point on it, but don't you worry about being dogpiled?

Sian: not really

me: easy enough to whip out a defensive force i guess

Sian: even just building when my hammerheavy pumps out 15base hammers

me: that's almost enough for a bow

Sian: it doesn't sound as if you're to friendly towards Dazed right now through

me: he did settle up on me. but i'm trying to avoid conflict if i can meet my resource and security concerns about his city placement.
i'm sure i could remove the city if i bent my empire's production toward it. but that would just mire both of us in 3rd and 4th place

Sian: given that Dazed probably is the strongest player then ...

me: i'm sure you'd be all for a war between any of your rivals.
and he may be a better player than i am, it's very likely. but attacking into protective bowmen would be stupid in any case.

Sian: won't deny that, but that doesn't make it any less true

[Boldly Going Nowhere]

The unabridged conversation with Dazed:

He cannot save that city that far from his core from a determined assault. Period. His immortals die just like every other unit, and we can bring forces to bear faster than he can at this distance. Immortal vs. Spear. We can win that. His city is new, no cultural defenses, and no walls. Particularly important, on flat terrain. He is begging to get slapped back. My vote would be to build up a couple spears and bows and take it, followed immediately by a settler on the hill and chopping a city wall/monument. He was provocative in settling so close and should be made to pay for it.

Also, you're insane for thinking he should pay Catwalk anything. If anyone, it should be you for settling up so close. Do not believe he will not use this as a base of attack. You need to secure your frontier with a true front city, on the hill. Remove this city.

Lurkers, feel free to chime in. I'm sure you're all craving some violence. :neenernee

One other thing: if I had to choose who to go to war against, it would be dazed rather than Team Kitty. Kuro didn't do him any favors with the opening and I think overall Dazed is weaker at this moment. Kitty could bring reinforcements faster, I think. Something to keep in mind.

[Boldly Going Nowhere]

Catwalk: slowcheetah says I can forward scouting info
He has a warrior and a worker there
We don't know what else might be underway

Destroy this plant.

me: in the cost/benefit analysis, going to war right now would be the most expensive thing we could do.

Disagree. Much easier to uproot this thing now and plant our forward city that we can actually hold.

Compromise with kitty. Request a unit as compensation for a guarantee of the silver location he prefers. This will help us secure our goal and bring our teams closer together. This favor could be returned later against Sian's farmer's gambit.

[spacetyrantxenu]

T48 - To summarize the events since Dazed settled on us yesterday, I tried to take a peaceful tact through diplomacy and really thought I could live with the city location he settled. Then I got sick last night and didn't look at the save until this morning. In the meantime the only thing I kept hearing was Number One saying we need to burn down that city. After opening the save this morning and realizing that Dazed's new city would have level 2 cultural borders only 4 tiles from my capital...that is unacceptable. So, lurkers...you'll get your war against team 4 after all!

I'm hoping for not much of a war. All I want to do is raze that city and settle my own. Once that is done it should prove difficult for Dazed to try a counter assault into protective bowmen at this stage (difficult, not impossible if he's determined to do it).

Here's the plan:

The offending city:


What I plan to do about it:

This turn I moved 3 workers onto the NW forest tile between Mitt Romney and Dazed's new city, Pasargadae. Next turn they will chop that forest into Mitt to make a 1 turn chariot. The spearman and the other bow already in Mitt will advance to the tile south of the workers on T49. On T50 two of the workers will build a road on the wheat, the other worker will go down to Rick Santorum to chop out the GLH on T51 (two other workers will be down there for T51 to finish the wonder - A and C). With the road in place we'll be able to declare war and move all four units onto the hill SW of the city - 2 bowmen, 1 spear, and 1 chariot. Hopefully that's enough to do the job. Catwalk reported seeing only 1 warrior at the city so if that is an accurate report we should be OK.

Dazed has a warrior at our borders east of Newt, but Newt is building a bow to deal with it, should that be necessary. It feels like we're woefully short of military units but everyone else has less than we do, judging by the power graphs, so who knows. I know this incursion against Dazed won't leave him pleased, but he knows he screwed up settling that spot. He told me in a chat today that he didn't have good map knowledge of the area before he settled, which was careless of him. It looks like it's going to cost him 65 hammers on a settler + whatever I kill in the city.

As for other events, switched a few tiles around: in Rick I set the city to a food deficit to throw more hammers into the GLH so it can complete in 3 turns. I slowed growth in Mitt as well, since getting that spear was a 2 pop whip (penalty). I don't like whipping with 0 hammers invested, but it seemed worth it in this case. It will let us get 2 units for the fight doing this (whip overflow + forest chop = 1T spear and 1T chariot). Similarly, I didn't like wasting 3 worker turns by moving all three onto the forest tile, but that was the only forest I could chop into Mitt and still have enough movement points to build the road with two of them for T50 on the wheat. I moved the bow toward their location to cover but they'll be exposed this turn. Dazed says he didn't kill them, which probably only means he didn't have a 2 move unit available to punish my unguarded move. When he asked about the three workers and the bow, I told him the workers are just chopping and the bow is an attack deterrent. I'm pretty sure he doesn't believe me, but that's OK. I think we're in good position for this attack.

City updates:

Newt will finish the settler next turn, settler will be used to build our border city (almost) as soon as Pasargadae is burned. The caveat to the settlement timing is that I want to finish Polytheism before settling this city. I don't want a holy city on the front with a hostile neighbor. If we land Hinduism before building C5 (which will be Jon Huntsman), Ron Paul should have the best odds of being the holy city which is good since that will eventually be a safe core city.


Switched off the pasture onto the lame 1/2/0 GFH tile to delay growth into unhappiness. Mitt has been whipped hard and needs to cool off before growing. After the spear and chariot builds Mitt will probably be building settlers and workers for a few turns while the whip anger subsides. If we need more military out of our only barracks city while whip anger remains, I may have to use the "avoid growth" button, as much as I dislike it.


The people are a bit hungry but look how productive they are, 18 base hammers per turn. The GLH will finish before the city starves down, so no worries there. The only concern is that someone beats us to the wonder. At this point it will be tough to swallow if that happens. We're so close!


Not much is happening in Ron Paul for now. The granary finishes next turn and I'm thinking about going on to a library next since Ron has no culture yet and the city will be a good library candidate eventually anyway (about 5 future cottage tiles).

Here's the empire at the end of the turn:

Demographics and charts:

Upward on the soldier count....


We're all closely grouped here.


Several recent nose dives as we've all settled our fourth city. Dazed's fifth city is not shown on this graph, I won't see it in demographics until next turn.


I wonder what Sian is hammering out? I'm working a lot of mines right now, we have the same number of cities and he probably isn't working many more mines than I am. Could an IND bonus be in play? I'm paranoid about losing the Lighthouse.


I love the obvious whipping cycle Dazed shows here. Mao is pleased. Otherwise...hey, why are we leading a chart? We'll be out of 1st place next turn. :neenernee


I'm sure by next turn Dazed would have already figured out our response, even if we hadn't declared war by then!


Nothing new here. Big lead for the guy with Stonehenge.


The only interesting thing to read from the espionage graph is that Sian has never had a revolt (he is not SPI), so either he doesn't have BW and can't revolt into slavery (or chop forests!!), or he does have BW and has just chosen not to whip. I can't see why that would be a good idea. The longer he waits to make the swap the more wasteful it will be in terms of production. The only thing I can think of is he is waiting to do a multi civic switch when he has teched something else he wants to swap into. But in the meantime it would seem not being able to whip would set him back.


Hopefully soon everyone will know the name of Rick Santorum!

[spacetyrantxenu]

I missed an IM Dazed sent to me yesterday:

Dazedroyalty: Just wanted to find out if you're willing to agree to hold off on moving the bowman towards me in exchange for diplomatic agreement
i.e. gift a worker
or immortal

I'll have to decline the offer. If I was willing to let him keep that city placement, I wouldn't be bought off by a worker or immortal. I'd need more compensation than that, but Number One has me fully convinced that the smart move is to just burn the city down. That's the plan we'll put into action when I get to play the save in a few hours.