RBP3 - [SPOILERS] - Team DIM (Mehmed of HRE)

[dazedroyalty]

I decided to stick with AH because every advantage, no matter how small is important. Plus, I like me some sheepskin jackets and stuff. I hate to see those little white animals wandering around unprotected from wolves. Oh wait, our magical yellow borders keep the wolves away anyways. Regardless, AH it is! Turn has turned over.

I can't remember the plan for the warrior but I am concerned since if another warrior came out of the fog at NE-NE-NE he could get to our capitol before we could get back if we move any further.. Unlikely I know...

[Ilios]

I've logged in and changed our build to worker. I haven't moved the warrior yet. With the tiles we're working we can finish the second warrior in exactly 2 turns, so no risk to start exploring with warrior 1 as well (can we name them? I think we had settled on questionable figures).
If we move the warrior, where to?
The hill will give us major sight on the land to our NW, but will leave Al (Capone?) vulnerable to attack. Still, I say we move him there and the move SW on the forest.

[meatbalz]

hey ilios, i think you'd mentioned you wanted to move him W and then swing him S? that's fine by me, plenty of safe ground to move over. it's painful to have our scouting curtailed but we need to get an idea of our surroundings as well.

worker due in 12 correct? would be awesome if we had horse nearby.

warrior 1 suggestion: richard nixon (don't know why, just the first name that sprang to mind)

[Ilios]

Yeah I'd like to move him west then swing around the peak. But that hill is going to give us a lot of sight. Can you make out if the tile 2 W of the warrior is a forested hill? If it is we can just move W W. If not I'd prefer to move him NW on the hill and the SW on the forest.

Edit: Never mind, the tile W W of our warrior might or mightn't be a hill, in any case there's a hill tile for sure to it's north which would block view. So my vote goes to moving NW on the hill.

Worker is due in 10T.

I agree with Nixon, but we have to call him Tricky Dick (I love that nickname!)

[meatbalz]

10 turns, of course

i think that hill, even though it's a bit risky, gives us visibility on a couple of tiles we wont otherwise see for many turns (our scouting will mostly be in other directions)

i'd go NW onto hill, and then SW & hopefully around the peak over safe land.

i won't have access until this evening (CET) so move as you think is best.

oh, and tricky dick gets a big thumbs up from me

[Ilios]

Guys, about the micro plan:

(T21) Dim 0/24 food, Warrior 7/15, Worker #1 finished
Worker goes W Start Farm, Capital works 2/1/1 + 2/1/1 + 2/1/0
(T22) Dim 2/24 food, Warrior 10/15, Animal Husbandry discovered

(T23) Dim 4/24 food, Warrior 13/15,

(T24) Dim 6/24 food, Warrior 1/15, Warrior #2 finished

(T25) Dim 8/24 food, Warrior 4/15,
Wheat farm finished, Capital works 2/1/1 + 4/1/0 + 2/1/1

Because we discover AH a turn earlier, on T21 I propose to move the worker (let's call him Stachanov) N and farm 1 turn (instead of farming wheat)
On T22 AH is discoverd, so we move Stachanov W and start Pasture
On T25 the pasture is finished (which is the same turn we'd have finished farming the wheat) That means we'll have the 4/1/2 tile about 4 turns earlier.

Suggestions?

Edit: Nevermind, we'd delay the Settler by one turn because the second 4 food tile (wheat) will be finished a turn later

[meatbalz]

hey ilios, will look over the plan shortly. let me just say for the stakhanov suggestion, which i whole-heartedly endorse. i don't think we could come up with a better name for a worker.

now, onto diplo. here's what i'd like to send to team A4

Team A4

Our scout Hernan has spent a disturbingly long time flexing in front of the mirror since hearing you'd described him as "mighty". We just haven't had the heart to tell him the truth yet. Still, although Hernan couldn't fight his way out of a paper bag, at least he can run away pretty quickly - we'll meet civs faster and gather more information than those who start with warriors.

We ARE willing to share these benefits with you; in other words, we agree to your request to exchange information on other civs and where to find them. We're (clearly) not an aggressive/early rush civ and we hope this gesture shows our friendly intent and desire to cooperate. I'll tell you right off the bat that as of now A4 is the only civ we've made contact with.

As far as a NAP is concerned. Yes, that is the likely outcome if our relationship - as it appears to be doing - develops along friendly lines. At a minimum we'll require a better knowledge of our surroundings and a fairly specific agreement with you regarding aggressive settlements; having said that, since a NAP would be mutually beneficial it's something we're willing to start working towards.

I think that's a good place to start. Let us know how things are going. If you're fair and show a willingness to work with us, you'll find us to be a strong ally.


Meatbalz for DIM

yeah, it's very, very friendly. while being friendly doesn't cost anything, my worry is it's too much and makes us look like pushovers.

i've tried to make the point that the information-sharing deal is a concession on our part without over-egging it or rubbing it in their faces ("we're giving you a big concession, we expect something in return, nudge nudge").

the part on the NAP is hopefully saying yes we'd like one if it makes sense but it's too early. the reference to aggressive settlements is necessary i think.

as far as i can tell the message contains 3 pieces of info:
1) we haven't met anyone else
2) we have friendly intentions
3) we're worried about having enough land to settle in their direction

feedback?

[Ilios]

Good work MB, but I think we should remove:

"We're (clearly) not an aggressive/early rush civ "

I think that's a bit too much. "We hope this gesture shows our friendly intent and desire to cooperate." should be enough.

"fairly specific agreement with you regarding aggressive settlements"

Again, I think this sentence says "we're afraid, please don't hurt us"
We should be able to re-word it to something "we would be seriously pissed off if you plop your second city 4 tiles from our capital"

Also, I'd try to weave a question about their capital's whereabouts in the second paragraph, where we agree to share info. (even though we will have more of it) I'd really like to know how far away they are.
something at the end of the paragraph like: "btw, is your capital far from where our explorers met each other?"

"we'll meet civs faster and gather more information than those who start with warriors."

Any reason we couldn't change that to:
"we'll meet civs faster and gather more information than you."

For the rest I agree 100%

[meatbalz]

ilios, i'll wait until dazed responds but i agree with a lot of what you say.

i think what the turns look like (assuming no horse in the BFC) is

T22 min 02/90; warrior 10/15 food 02/24 pasture 4t
T23 min 13/90; warrior 13/15 food 04/24
T24 min 24/90; warrior 01/15 food 06/24
T25 min 35/90; warrior 04/15 food 08/24 4/1/2 2/1/1 2/1/0
T26 min 47/90; warrior 07/15 food 12/24
T27 min 59/90; warrior 10/15 food 16/24 farm 5t
T28 min 71/90; warrior 13/15 food 20/24
T29 min 83/90; settler 01/100 food 00/26 4/1/2 2/1/1 2/1/0 2/1/0
T30 BW 05/216; settler 09/100
T31 BW 18/216; settler 17/100; 4/1/2 4/1/0 2/1/1 2/1/0
T32 BW 31/216; settler 27/100
T33 BW 44/216; settler 37/100 mine 4t
T34 BW 57/216; settler 47/100
T35 BW 70/216; settler 57/100
T36 BW 83/216; settler 67/100 4/1/2 4/1/0 1/3/1 2/1/1
T37 BW 97/216; settler 78/100 farm 4t (1t put in on T21)
T38 BW 111/216 settler 89/100
T39 BW 125/216 settler done

worker 1 T21
AH T22
warrior2 T24
warrior3 T29
mining T30
settler1 T39


edited to add: the next 8 turns also work out beautifully,

T39 BW 125/216 warrior 00/15 4/1/2 4/1/0 1/3/1 2/1/1

T40 BW 139/216 warrior 06/15 food 05/26 4/1/2 4/1/0 3/0/1 2/1/1
T41 BW 153/216 warrior 09/15 food 12/26 go to city 2
T42 BW 167/216 warrior 12/15 food 19/26
T43 BW 181/216 warrior 00/15 food 00/28 4/1/2 4/1/0 2/1/0 3/0/1 2/1/1 (the other option is to go straight to worker or settler here)

T44 BW 195/216 warrior 04/15 food 07/28
T45 BW 209/216 warrior 08/15 food 14/28
T46 TW 07/108 warrior 12/15 food 21/28
T47 warrior done, size 5 hit.

then things get really speculative...

[Ilios]

Super, that means the Settler is finished on the same turn. I really really hope that neither forest nor jungle (worse!) expand to the grassland hill and the grassland river between our resources...