New EitB PBEM

[BING_XI_LAO]

Sign me up
While I support whatever modding changes, I am fine without them too.
I would like a late era advanced start

[xist10]

I have a bit interest in playing - and losing, but I'm not sure if I have the time.

[fireblaze]

What would a level 1 regen even look like, seems hard to balance competing with courage

Have some interest, work is coming off a busy period but I'm not entirely sure what my time will look like + have another pbem running so dunno if that'll overcommit even if the other is far more casual

[Aurorarcher]

Would be fun to have a game with more people than usually (4 or 5) so I’ll encourage all you ”maybe joining” people to play.

[coldrain]

Welcome all! The more the merrier (or chaotic at least)?

So if I understood correctly, this is the current status:

Confirmed players
Aurorarcher
Bing
coldrain
Ginger
mackoti

Possible participants (time constraints might affect final decision)
Dreylin
fireblaze
xist10

No need to confirm participation yet, just trying to understand how big the game will be. What kind of settings would we have? Some have expressed interest in later era start, any objections to this? I'm open to trying it out, but I'm fine with a "standard" start (boosted thaw start as in last game was interesting, maybe we can copy the settings form there?).

[mackoti]

Welcome all! The more the merrier (or chaotic at least)?

So if I understood correctly, this is the current status:

Confirmed players
Aurorarcher
Bing
coldrain
Ginger
mackoti

Possible participants (time constraints might affect final decision)
Dreylin
fireblaze
xist10

No need to confirm participation yet, just trying to understand how big the game will be. What kind of settings would we have? Some have expressed interest in later era start, any objections to this? I'm open to trying it out, but I'm fine with a "standard" start (boosted thaw start as in last game was interesting, maybe we can copy the settings form there?).

I would prefer a start like last Pbem as never played one and later era is just about fighting right away.

[mackoti]

About changes to movement: Moving haste to body II (mages) makes it harder for less magic oriented civs, especially the dwarves, to even out the mobility. Q's proposals are interesting, but I'd rather do small changes first to try and see how the it balances out in a game. I prefer to have another game with a larger map without modded changes, but if most players vote for reduced mobility, I would support limited modding: such as moving spell extension promotion to channelling III (leave it available to channelling II for summoner trait?) and mobility II promotion only for heroes (can be seen as a slight buff to Grigori)?

About mackoti's proposals:
- I agree with a larger map (previous map was designed well, but we run out of space quite fast).
- I'm not sure about snake pick with unrestricted leaders. This could lead to some hilariously over powered combinations, and the game outcome could be decided during the picking phase? Then again, if we allow unristricted leaders and the game is resolved quick, we can start another one soon afterwards? 

About the powerfull combination there are plenty of them i have 5-6 in my head which i dont know which is stronger and i bet there are many more.And perhaps even some would consider those are not tat strong. I would say will make for a very interisting game. Why i proposed banning ilians , well i consider they are too strong and so unfun for the other players.

[coldrain]

Yes, there should be many good combinations with a snake pick. I forgot that EitB changes some traits to allow better unrestricted leader combos (for example, Grigori as a civ are now agnostic, instead of just their default leader, Cassiel). If we copy the "boosted" thaw start as in previous PBEM, then I can see how Illians could be considered too powerful. I'm ok with banning them for this game. If we have a larger amount of players signing up, let's say about 6 to 8, would unristricted leaders create any issues: For example too few options for the last person to pick, or newer players might not have a good idea of what to take?

[mackoti]

Yes, there should be many good combinations with a snake pick. I forgot that EitB changes some traits to allow better unrestricted leader combos (for example, Grigori as a civ are now agnostic, instead of just their default leader, Cassiel). If we copy the "boosted" thaw start as in previous PBEM, then I can see how Illians could be considered too powerful. I'm ok with banning them for this game. If we have a larger amount of players signing up, let's say about 6 to 8, would unristricted leaders create any issues: For example too few options for the last person to pick, or newer players might not have a good idea of what to take?

I ofer myself to be the last person to pick, and i supose auror wil be ok to be the on the end of snake pick.

[coldrain]

Alright, so far there has been some good suggestions by mackoti. I'm ok with his proposals. I'm curious to hear the opinion of other players as well. Based on the discussions the overall game settings would be something like this:

1. Snake pick with unrestricted leaders. Determine pick order of players by dice roll. If there are concerns of imbalance due to number of players and/or newer participants who don't know the mod that well, veteran players (mackoti, Aurorarcher, maybe me also?) can be asssigned in the snake pick to a position that allows the newer players to pick first? This would prevent the vetarans from taking the best civs or leaders first? Just to be clear, I'm also fine with random order for the snake pick, just trying to think of a balanced and fair method.
   
2. I'm in favour of "boosted" thaw start*, as in previous PBEM, and there's no strong objections to this so far? Later era + advanced start was proposed by Bing, but he was fine with this too?
   
3. No changes to mobility (haste spell, promotions, raiders trait etc.).
   
4. Larger map relative to number of palyers than previous.
   
5. Bans: Illians. Map-makers can decide if for example Cultists or Lanun would be too powerful (in case a bit more water/lake heavy map).
   
6. Mapscript and number of continents: up to map-makers.
   

*Explanation of "boosted" thaw start:

Normal thaw start is somewhat equal to a BtS ancient era start. FFH2/EitB is much slower during the early game, this is why we "boosted" the normal start by adding:

• Free worker in addition to normal starting units.
  
• All players start with the first level technologies: crafting, agriculture, exploration and ancien chants.
  
• Players can choose one additional technology based on tehir civilization pick. For example, Ljosalfar can pick hunting, cartography or fishing and Hippus can choose animal husbandry or calendar.
  

Basic game setting from previous game (for reference):

• Quick speed
  
• Emperor difficulty
  
• AI diplo
  
• No tech trading
  
• No vassal states
  
• No espionage (does this option matter?)
  
• No Acheron
  
• No Orthus
  
• Wildlands
  
• Living world
  
• Blessing of Amatheon (up to map-maker to decide in my opinion)
  
• Tribal huts: no
  
• Lairs, barrows and graveyards: yes
  
• Unique features: yes, but balanced (for example, no remnants of Patria close to player, no easy access to powerful mana)
  
• Limited mana nodes: one guaranteed source near capital, other nodes and features in contested areas.
  
• Normal settler at start (no bonus vision or movement)
  

I would like to hear opinions on the overall game settings (points 1 to 6) listed above. I also added basic settings for reference, but no need to decide on those just yet, I think.