Return of the Horde: Temujin of Rome

[Ilios]

Game mechanics point (and it's an easy one to miss):
Moai Statues are not available in a Medieval start. Ancient Start Only.

I don't know WHY that was the design decision, but it's the way the game's set up (the other wonders which aren't always available are HE and NE, which aren't available in Ind or later starts).

Yeah, I thought it might not be available in Medieval starts.

[WarriorKnight]

Depending on what is revealed, settling on the wine might be a decent option. You could move the settler onto blue dot on the first turn, and then depending on what is revealed then decide where to settle on t2.

While we don't know half of the BFC yet, that may be a good idea. There's 2 seafood, a couple of hills and i can see a couple of forests through tilebleed, plus whatever else is in the fog.

Also, I assume the worker moves 1S to start (to get that chop into a worker asap). If that is the case, is moving the eastern archer 1S really worth it to reveal what appears from fog gazing to be a tundra tile? (I believe that is the only additional tile that move would reveal, correct?)

Actually, I meant one of the archers moves onto blue dot, and the other heads west to be a scout in that direction.

Anyone else get the feeling this start is going to be the hardest to plan/sim out? The lack of forests (to get out those all important early workers) and the need to sink hammers into wbs for food makes this start a bit unlike most normal starts it seems to me. I just get the feeling this is going to be one of the harder ones to figure out the most effective way to get the snowball rolling because of the competing demands for the limited chops.

Definately. We could sink hammers into a work boat while we're growing but the lack of forests will complicate things. With IMP though we'll probably be able to keep up.

WK, I see a nice Maoi city south of the Copper. Or on the Copper, should there be another food resource hidden in the fog.

We don't know whether we can get a workboat from the Capital to the Crabs.

We really need forests at the beginning to chop some workers out. That, combined with no moai, still makes me want to go for red dot. True, we might not be able to fix up the crab immediately but since we have 2 other food resources for growing that may not be relevant for a while.

It's a shame we can't see iron right now. We'll need to find our source quickly if we want to use preats at all.

[WarriorKnight]

As we're up, I moved one of the archers to blue dot and the scout north to see what we could find. Fortunately there is some food up north:



Sheep isn't great, but it's something (plus there's horse). Also note the NE, that's India's start and we're very close.



Much less impressive. Mountain range that gives settling on the wine a total of 5 peak tiles, which is ugly no matter how you look at it. 2nd city should still probably go around here, not sure where though.

Haven't moved anything else yet.

[Ilios]

Oh man, five peaks, that's pretty shitty. Don't see a lot of good alternatives though besides on the Wines though.

Let's hope the fogged tiles in the north reveal one more food resource, warranting another site S of the Horses.

[dazedroyalty]

I think scout N-NW next turn is good just to get away from India. You don't end up on a hill but you'd be in position to get further west next turn.

[oledavy]

Not enough forests around, and too many peaks. No really good second city spot pops out at me. Perhaps scouting around a bit, finding iron and settling near it would be the best option?

[WarriorKnight]

Is a second city near the copper/horses/sheep worth it? Blindly sending a settler to the SW looking for a good spot doesn't seem worthwhile to me. The other alternative is near the wine, but that either has 5 peaks or has a lot of overlap with red dot (I'm assuming red dot is going to be one of our spots at this point).

If we do put our second city near the copper, perhaps the scout should go NE-NW to make sure there isn't anything in that ocean tile we're still missing.

[oledavy]

Unless there is seafood hiding in that cove, a city there will never be a gem of the empire. However, it would be worth it just as a unit pump city. Plant it on that plains hill and grow it up to 4 pop; working the sheep, horses, copper and grassland hill mine with no food overflow. You'll be getting a base of 17 hammers a turn there at that size. Slap down barracks, a forge and a stable and have it do nothing but pump out units for the rest of the game (perhaps even a heroic epic city?).

[dazedroyalty]

Unless there is seafood hiding in that cove, a city there will never be a gem of the empire. However, it would be worth it just as a unit pump city. Plant it on that plains hill and grow it up to 4 pop; working the sheep, horses, copper and grassland hill mine with no food overflow. You'll be getting a base of 17 hammers a turn there at that size. Slap down barracks, a forge and a stable and have it do nothing but pump out units for the rest of the game (perhaps even a heroic epic city?).

I think this city will definitely need to be in the mix even if no new food shows up. The question we need to be asking now is, will it be the best second city? Of course, it's complicated by the fact that we don't know the whole map nearby. I'm willing to guess it's not the BEST second city possible, but it may be the best we know about. I'm not a fan of settling blindly and hoping for good resources. That didn't work out well for Zulu in PB4! :neenernee It can work in SP, but won't really be a worthwhile risk in this game.

[scooter]

Ok, so our options:

1. On the wines: Gives us 2 seafood and 6 grasslands. Also gives us 5 peaks which is not-so-good.

2. 1W of the wines: Gives us 2 seafood and 6 grasslands. Does not have 5 peaks, but also has very heavy capital overlap.

3. Sheep/Horse/Copper city: Some good production, doesn't have much overlap... But has nothing better than plains sheep for food.

Comparing the 3, I'm just not sure #3 is viable honestly. One thing to keep in mind is that each city starts with a granary, so whipping out of the gate is stronger than ancient, so the value of food over hammers is greater than what we're used to. Granted, this is Imperialistic, but whipping is a great way to leverage Imperialistic. So I think either way, we need to use those seafood for City #2 - they're just too valuable.