Let's talk about something awkward ... online dating!

[TheHumanHydra]

Thanks for your advice everyone (more is always welcome, too!). I especially found that link about what to (not) say in your first message helpful, since I'm currently contemplating my first ever message on such a site. Apparently I should leave that self-effacing phrase in ...

Here's a question: Is it worth it to try and connect with that girl who is, you know, way out of your league? Or is it a waste of mental energy? I'm weighing it in my mind: on the one hand, she probably gets tons of messages from way more appealing guys, why would she want to see mine? On the other hand, she's (still) on this site precisely 'cause she hasn't met the right kind of guy yet, what if it's me?

Sorry I sound so naive about everything; like I said, I've never even dated someone I've met in real life, let alone online. @spellman: yeah, the thing is I really do want to marry young, for myself. But you're right, realistically I do have time, I guess.

Thanks again for your advice so far, everyone.

[spellman]

If she's really that far out of your league, you'll get no response. Minimal effort expended.

[SevenSpirits]

I've used online dating sites (mostly OKCupid) a bit in the past. My advice:

1) If someone doesn't reply to your message, that is a rejection. Move on unless you really, really care. By the way, include questions in your messages if you want replies.
2) Know that there is only a small chance that you and the person you are messaging are "right" for each other. Write your message as a declaration of interest in finding out if you and the other person are a good fit. Do not write your message as a declaration of love.
3) If you find someone that you like, but not as dating material, let them know, and (if they are willing) quiz them about how they perceive the way you present yourself.

There isn't "out of your league", but you'll probably be rejected no matter what. That's OK.

[Sareln]

To echo some thoughts (I haven't used online dating sites, but some of the concepts that work in meatspace are sure to be transportable skills)

Co-conspirators are very helpful... but I'd temper that with the idea that people try to heavily intellectualize what makes you more or less attractive when you ask and it contaminates the data. Especially since initial attraction is an emotional thing, not an intellectual thing. So the feedback is great, but is not the be-all, end-all.

Rejection sucks, but it's a fact of life. It's like playing the college admission game in the US though. Even if you could be a good fit, there's a die roll on the rejection table before you even start. Some opportunities will close before they even get rolling and that's okay! Also, keep in mind that your own desire for a relationship is working against you in this endeavor. Try to look at people who message you back with a critical eye and look for red flags. It's okay if after the first date you find you're not a good match. Heck, if you have fun on a first date but there's no match, that's okay, you already had a fun time out! It's a numbers game. Play accordingly.

Also, I agree that if you're fresh out of college at the usual age (22) you have a ton of time. Make sure that you're doing the usual advantageous things. Setting up a career. Getting your student debt (if you've got it) paid off. Rebalance work and life so that you're happy with yourself.

On a similar note: If you've got issues, fix them! This isn't saying be someone who you're not, I mean be the best version of you that you can be. For example: If your diet sucks and you're always feeling lethargic, eat better. If you've been toting around a spare tire or two, lose it. If you can't grow good facial hair, shave. If you've got weird sleep patterns and they're messing with you (eg. sleeping 3 hours one night and 11 hours the next) fix those patterns. Build good habits. (this is probably generalizeable to life in toto).

At the end of the day, if you're trying to build a lasting relationship you're going to be asking (explicitly or implicitly) someone to commit to you (potentially for life!), so you need to be someone who has their stuff together and can weather the world. Good luck!

[KingOfPain]

First of all, I echo what many have said here that it is most important to be yourself, don't be a fake.

Now comes the hard part to get over - No one is out of your league. I know, I used to get intimidated by beautiful girls but they turned out to be just as approachable as everyone else. You have to be confident, confidence is sexy. Ask any girls here.

Yea there are girls who knows they have the looks and are snobbish, but those are not the ones you would want. So good for you if they turn you down.

[Jowy]

Yes number one tip for any dating is to be confident! Don't take it too far though, you wouldn't want to be a douchebag.
Well, you can be a dbag too, but only if you are a 10/10 in the looks department.

[Gustaran]

On a similar note: If you've got issues, fix them! This isn't saying be someone who you're not, I mean be the best version of you that you can be. For example: If your diet sucks and you're always feeling lethargic, eat better. If you've been toting around a spare tire or two, lose it. If you can't grow good facial hair, shave. If you've got weird sleep patterns and they're messing with you (eg. sleeping 3 hours one night and 11 hours the next) fix those patterns. Build good habits. (this is probably generalizeable to life in toto).

This. I don't think that's the case here, but it is amazing how sometimes people complain about their lack of dating success when it is obvious to everyone else what the reason is...

- Check your weight. If overweight, lose some.
- Perform at least some sports, even if only casual.
- Should be a given, but basic hygiene is a must. I wouldn't even mention it, but I just read about the fact that the prestigous MIT has started a campaign to encourage their students to take regular showers...
- Check your look. Sometimes a new haircut and a little change in style go a long way.
- If you can, get some honest advise on these points from a female (sister/cousin/friends fiancee, etc.)
- Get some interesting hobbies if you don't have any. Unless you hook up with a gamer girl if all you do is sitting in your basement playing videogames, you will have trouble leading a meaningful conversation.

If you think you are doing fine in all of these departments and just lack the courage: Go for it.
I recently read a story about an average college guy who had lots of dates with different women and when his friends asked him how he did it, he replied: "I get turned down by 90% of the women I ask out. What you see are simply the 10% that say yes".

[spellman]

- If you can, get some honest advise on these points from a female (sister/cousin/friends fiancee, etc.)

Along these lines, this is excellent use of the dreaded "Friend Zone". If you're friend-zoned, this also means they will be honest about their opinions. Take advantage of their perspective. Understand what they feel are your strengths and weaknesses. My sister has been invaluable for me actually dressing properly and stylishly. So much so I sometimes get complimented on dressing well (for a guy).

If you have 0 female friends that you can trust to be honest, you're doing something wrong. Being able to maintain a friendship with the opposite sex is kinda the whole point in a dating relationship.

[TheHumanHydra]

Still digesting everyone's great advice - thanks; I didn't expect so much! And I'm seeing some common themes, which is helpful. Just wanted to respond to spellman quickly - don't worry, I have several female friends I'm close with. I will make sure to ask them about these things when I have the opportunity!

[Jowy]

Could always ask a gay guy.