[SPOILERS] HitAnyKey's Thread for the Jumbled Masses of Crap within his Brain

[HitAnyKey]

Ok, done the review of what has been picked so far. Now to decide for myself. We only have LP after us, where he'll be picking both his things.
Upon quick look, I think I'm in agreement that we take Wang Kon. And then if LP doesn't take Spain, I'll probably take Spain. To answer your question about religion....I like having both the culture and the happiness. But the culture in the beginning is a really nice thing. Especially for the new cities if I can get religion into them quick enough. I've always liked getting religions when I can. After all, then when you have a shrine you also get gold from it.
Do you have any thoughts about the rest of the picks I had thought of besides Spain? Which of them would be your top choice?

[Cheater Hater]

Hey, I just finished dinner too
Yeah, Wang Kon seems good. I don't really have that much of an opinion on the civ--I'd rather not be Rome since I don't want to associate this with PBEM 58, but I don't have that much of a preference. Spain seems fine

I also sent you a chat request on Gmail, not so much for this discussion but so we've made contact at least

Edit: What do you think of what's been picked so far? Are you as surprised as I was at the amount of civs picked?

[TheHumanHydra]

Looks like you're in good hands, HAK. I don't really know much about Tides of War anyway so I probably wouldn't be much help.

[HitAnyKey]

Definitely been some weird picks. I don't really know the various civs/leaders and their traits too well myself without spending a long time trying to research each one (which I don't really desire to do). But I do also totally not understand the Khmer & Egypt picks. The Boudica & Napoleon ones are also ones I would never have considered.

[Cheater Hater]

Don't worry, I'm good at the research part--I'll wait until more of the pairs are done to do the full analysis

[HitAnyKey]

Lord Parkin - Churchill of Zulu(CHM/PRO,agri/hunt)
HitAnyKey - Wang Kon of Spain(FIN/PRO,fish/myst)
Haram - Ragnar of Mongolia(FIN/AGR,hunt/wheel)
Mackoti - Charlemagne of Germany(IMP/PRO,hunt/mine)
SevenSpirits - Pericles of Russia(CRE/PHI,hunt/mine)
Gavagai - Willem van Oranje of Ethiopia(FIN/CRE,hunt/mine)
slowcheetah - Napoleon of Vikings(CHM/ORG,fish/hunt)
Douglas Quaid - Elizabeth of Egypt(FIN/PHI,agri/wheel)
Gawdzak - Boudica of Rome(AGR/CHM,fish/mine)
Kuro/Wetbandit - Tokugawa of India(AGR/PRO,mine/myst)
GermanJojo - Cyrus of Khmer(CHM/IMP,hunt/mine)

With only one other civ starting with Mysticism, and that one not having Financial, I think I have a pretty good chance of scoring that early religion like I was wanting. So I may go for Meditation first to grab Buddhism and while we're working on that figure out where I'll go next. Likely Mining/BW so that I can chop/mine those PH to make the most use of my PRO trait as soon as possible.
Though Pottery is also a good option to start cottaging ASAP.
As is getting myself to AH to pasture those pigs. But I think I have either of those other two options are better to start since I'd need to get Hunting or Agriculture first before I can get AH, and neither of those techs get me anything huge right away...other than having my scout move faster with Hunting.

The more I think on it, it might be best to go Pottery first and then grab the Mining/BW. What do you think?

EDIT: Just remembered I have to get the Wheel before I can get Pottery, so that makes the decision a little trickier. Definitely a lot to think about for whatever tech I go for after the religion.

[Cheater Hater]

Can't we guarantee religion, since the only other Mysticism Civ doesn't have Fishing? Financial doesn't have anything to do with it, since the fish tile doesn't get the commerce boost in TOW (since it's +1 on 3 or more commerce).

Yeah, AH is definitely not a priority, mainly since that's sheep on the plains hill, not pigs

I don't know which tech we want first--assuming we go Workboat->Worker, what turn will the Worker finish? Will it even finish before we research our second tech? Heck--there actually aren't any hills to mine other than the sheep, so that means a Mining start would leave the early worker with nothing to do. Wheel would give the worker something to do, but it's not that useful, and would likely mandate we go to Pottery next, which means we're really delaying Bronze Working. Could we risk delaying religion to the third tech?

Honestly, this start requires so much timing a sandbox would help a lot, especially since PRO is speeding all the builds up.

Edit: I just saw Krill say he sent the map off to Caledorn already, so if I'm going to run a sandbox, I should get on that
Further edit: Sandbox created here, everything looks right (notably tech costs), so now time to test some starts

[Cheater Hater]

Start Sandboxes:

Attempt 1: Mediation->Mining->Bronze Working, Workboat->Worker

• Mediation T8, Buddhism founded
  
• Growth T8, work plains forest hill
  
• Workboat T9, nets fish
  
• Mining T13
  
• Worker T15, BW has 9-11 turns left
  

Well, that wastes a lot of turns, even if you mine the sheep just as something to do--try something else

Attempt 2: Mediation->Wheel->Pottery, Workboat->Worker

• Mediation->Workboat same
  
• Wheel T13
  
• Worker T15, Pottery 6-7 turns left
  

I don't know what to do with this next in terms of builds--start the settler right away? Another Worker? A Warrior?

Attempt 3: Mining->Bronze Working->Mediation, Workboat->Worker->Warrior->Settler

• Mining T5
  
• Growth/Workboat same
  
• Worker T15, BW 3 turns left, switch from working plains hill to silk, worker goes to mine sheep, capital builds warrior
  
• BW T18
  
• Growth T18, work spices
  
• Warrior T19, capital builds settler (9 turns)
  
• Mine completes T19, move 1E and chop
  
• Chop completes T23, move 1NE and chop, switch capital to mine (mostly a mistake, though you need a bit of the spices commerce to complete Mediation quickly)
  
• Mediation T25 (note: I didn't set opponents, so they will beat you; it shouldn't matter)
  
• Settler T26
  

This looks interesting--I forgot just how beneficial the mine is because of the Productive bonus.
I did a follow-up where I switched to the mine right when it finished--if you work the mine until the turn the chop finishes, then switch to the spices, you finish the settler and research Mediation on T25.

There's more I want to try--some Workboat->Warrior->Worker strategies, along with possibly whipping the settler, but I'm bored of it for now--right now all the simulation is telling is that we shouldn't have chosen Spain :/

[HitAnyKey]

I know it probably sounds weird or messed up, but what about going Meditation while building the Workboat. And then on T9 when the WB completes, start work on a Settler while waiting for another good tech to be finished. Maybe not finish the settler, but at least get a bunch of turns closer to finishing it. Then do the worker. I'm on my way to bed so don't really have time to think about it right now, so hopefully the game doesn't start up too quickly tomorrow giving me time to think about things before having to play the turn.
Since I did go ahead an pick Spain with the intention of trying to ensure getting an early religion, it's probably best to actually do so. Though with only one other Civ starting with Mysticism, I suppose we could probably work on a different tech first. If we see someone get Buddhism or Hinduism, we simply immediately switch to research the opposite one. We'd still likely beat anyone to it, since it's highly unlikely that those who started without Mysticism will research it as their first tech. Right?
Anyway, just a couple things that ran through my head just now.

[Cheater Hater]

Yeah, that's what I was thinking if we don't start on Mediation--start researching the religion as soon as we see one fall. I don't know when that would be though--we would probably get to it worst-case after BW, Pottery, and whatever tech we need for food at the next city. Still, I think we definitely should get to it earlier than that at least, I'm just having trouble figuring out stuff for the worker to do, gettting BW completed in a reasonable timeframe, and not wasting our Spain on a lake start. Granted, that's part of the tradeoff you make to get a religion :/

Building the settler after the workboat is weird--if you didn't want the worker out first, I think you might just want to build a warrior to help scout out the second city location, as well as letting yourself grow to size 3--you grow in 3 turns, and the warrior takes 4 if you work the silk. I haven't tried the exact timing yet, but it takes 5 turns to move onto and mine the sheep, which means there's a turn at most wasted before BW comes in, I think, especially considering you have to use a turn moving onto the forest before you start chopping. I'd test it, but I'm going to bed soon