February 19th, 2010, 03:07
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Okay, I've updated the turnplan on the first page to around T60. At the moment it looks like we'll be able to found our third city on T61. At that time, we'll have 3 Workers, 3 Warriors and 2 Chariots as well. There's still a lot of unknowns that could influence this, and I'm certain I made an error or two as well, but here's my basic thoughts for the next 20 turns:
Tech: Given that we'll have two chariots out fairly quickly, I think it's safe to research Pottery after BW finishes. After that, it really depends on how the game develops. If it's safe enough to do so, Masonry would help to build a Quarry and set up Feros as a production city (see below)
The Citadel: We can use the Citadel for commerce, production, or as a Worker/Settler pump, really. For now the emphasis is on getting out the third Worker and Second settler. The food tiles allow for decent growth, and we may want to consider cracking the whip here to speed up builds. Building a granary quickly would be a good idea as well.
Feros: Finishes monument and grows to size 2 after the first farm is finished. The city has limited growth potential, but until we have a real production city, Feros could function as one on a limited basis, working Stone, Horses and a grassland hill. I set production to a Barracks after the Monument finishes so we can start training military units there, but would strongly favor switching to a Granary as soon as we finish pottery. Whipping should be limited to emergencies only.
I haven't included the chariots in the turnplan yet, but having the first one scout, and the second one defend would have my preference. We also will want to build another defensive unit at some point for the third city, but the chariot can also do this for a few turns.
We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing. - George Bernard Shaw
February 19th, 2010, 03:41
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I have a few comments.
We are going to be working an unimproved tile in the citadel which isn't entirely optimal. Maybe starting to build another worker there and then chopping the rest of it might be better. Also I would much prefer to chop/mine the grassland forest hill rather than the plains forest hill. It would add an extra turn getting the worker there but for growth purposes grass hill mines are much better than plains mines (unless building settlers/workers/workboats). With relatively poor food I don't think working a plains mine this early is the best approach.
Also do we really need a barracks in Feros so early? We haven't even met a neighbour to plan on rushing yet so I'm not really sure what the need of a barracks is. All those forests could be put to good use chopping out workers/maybe even a settler. Yes we will need one eventually but should come later imo.
February 19th, 2010, 04:02
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The unimproved tile will only be used for 2 turns. After that we'll have a fourth improved tile to switch to. Waiting for the citadel to grow to size 4 to not have to do this and delaying having Chariots for scouting and defense in the process just doesn't seem like a good payoff to me.
I do agree that the grassland hill is better for growth, but we will be spending a lot quite a few turns building the worker/settler pair. Also, the grassland hill east of the Citadel unfortunately isn't connected to the river (I checked this in a simulation) but the plains hill is, so we'd have the same amount of production working the plains hill, but with an extra bonus commerce. And when the the Settler is finished, we should have our first cottage finished which would be better than the grassland hill for growth as well.
The downside is that we'd sacrifice a few turns of growth by working the plains hill over the grassland one, then again our defenses are rather dire right now. I feel safer getting the chariots asap, but am willing to consider alternatives.
Barracks in Feros is probably me tunnelvisioning on defense a bit too much. I would still favor getting out a Granary in Feros asap (even aided with a chop or two), but we can switch production to something else after the Monument finishes.. we could go for a worker like you suggested, or maybe another chariot?
We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing. - George Bernard Shaw
February 19th, 2010, 04:19
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Ok fair enough about the plains hill then, I thought the grass hill was on the river.
How about monument/chop worker/chariot/granary or something like that? Maybe build chariots/slip in barracks for a while and then chop/whip a settler later?
What do you think Bob?
February 19th, 2010, 04:33
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Hmm, chopping a Worker after the monument sounds like a good idea. An extra one would definitely help work all those FP tiles around the third city site.
We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing. - George Bernard Shaw
February 19th, 2010, 08:38
Bobchillingworth
Unregistered
I just briefly looked over the turn plan. Looks pretty solid to me, instead of the barracks in Feros I suggest a 3rd chariot followed by a chopped worker (or perhaps the other way around). I would like the Citadel to be functioning as a settler pump ASAP to get the 3rd settler for a 4th spot produced, because we really need to secure as many fp in the south as possible, city maintenance and distance costs be damned. I recommend all chops at the citadel go into workers or settlers, the FP city be on max growth for working as many cottages as quickly as possible, and Feros grow until it can function as a reasonable early game military pump, which we will need if we're going to attempt some rapid settler / worker development. I would rather not whip any cities for the forseeable future except for emergency defense and for a granary and probably monument at the FP spot (since it's a great commerce location, how about naming it Illium? [sp?]).
February 19th, 2010, 16:51
Bobchillingworth
Unregistered
Perhaps I missed it in this thread, but were we aware that stonehenge has already been constructed? It looks from the top-5 cities / wonder screen like it's been gone for a few turns now...
I suspect Krill.
February 19th, 2010, 23:16
Bobchillingworth
Unregistered
Just played the turn. Nothing of interest to report, really. Bronze Working is 3 turns at 90 or 100% research, but I went with highest science rate because it synched up with the gold remaining math on the first page. I think one of you bounced off of me while I made the moves, sorry about that.
February 19th, 2010, 23:59
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Stonehenge was finished on T29, there's a screenshot of that turn on page 16. Given that Krill didn't increase in score that turn andinstead India made a huge jump, I suspected it was them who built it. With Fast Worker chops and the Industrious trait, it wouldn't have been too hard to manage it.
Using binary science is probably best for now. It might not make that much of a difference yet, but we might as well get used to doing it early. ![smile smile](https://www.realmsbeyond.net/forums/images/smilies/smile2.gif) I suspect we'll have to run 0% science for at least 2 turns, possibly even 3, to research Pottery.
That said, we may be able to turn down science down a notch or two on the last turn of BW. I'm not certain how mathematically sound that is, but if the option is available, would you guys favor doing so?
I'll see about updating the builds of Feros sometime today.
We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing. - George Bernard Shaw
February 20th, 2010, 06:02
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Okay, I took a quick look at the build options at Feros, and we could follow up with a Worker, although this will delay the growing to size 2 a bit. The Worker would finish on T55 with one chop, or T52 with 2. I would probably favor the former at this point as that would allow us to move onto a Granary at T55. I don't think we'll have pottery at T52 yet. I haven't yet worked out the micro for it, but I'm fairly sure that we can have Feros halfway to size 3 when the Granary finishes, so that we can have the maximum effect from it right away.
So work order would be Monument > Worker > Granary in that case.
We also spend one chop into a chariot at the Citadel at T48. Should we consider swapping builds to a Worker for this as well? It would delay our scouting and defense some more though.
We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing. - George Bernard Shaw
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