American Politics Discussion Thread

[Mjmd]

But on the more serious side of the British point of view, the UK is suffering from high power prices, meanwhile 40% of our power station capacity is gas, there's a COMPLETED GAS PIPELINE UNUSED leading from Russia towards Europe.... and we're mad at the Russians? We're siding with the US while it BLOCKS OUR SUPPLY OF FUEL!??!?!?!?!

Anyhow, why is it a bad thing if Russia were to annex an area that's inhabited by Russians? The Western position implicitly assumes that an ethno-linguistically Russian area that's already rebelled against its non-Russian government, has historically been part of Russia before, and is right next to Russia, shouldn't be annexed by Russia. But what's the abstract or practical case against that obvious solution?

I'm not going to lie I skipped a lot of the posts after this.

Just going to address a couple things here:
A) So you are willing to bow and scrape for lower power prices?

B) I mean I know people go to WW2 German history too often, but does appeasement and German annexations ring any bells?

[BING_XI_LAO]

Just going to address a couple things here:
A) So you are willing to bow and scrape for lower power prices?

I think we are bowing and scraping to the Americans, or rather acting like a silly little imitation of the USA - but instead of getting low power prices in return, they give us high power prices.
I think it's a deliberate policy to weaken and subordinate Europe to the US. After all we operate in the American military financial and cultural world, if we're worried about bowing and scraping it should be about whether we're bowing and scraping to them or not.

B) I mean I know people go to WW2 German history too often, but does appeasement and German annexations ring any bells?

Russia is resurgent from being laid low, like 1930s Germany, and has revanchist claims. But it doesn't have a totalitarian fervor and its demography is older compared to 1930s Germany.
The thickest bars in Russia's demography are 30-38, the thickest in 1939 Germany were 17-19 and 24-37. 2022 Russia even has a secondary spike all the way up at age 60, while 1939 Germany's population pyramid was an "arrow-head"shape past age 38. If the annexation of Crimea in 2014 was Anschluss, then we have already gotten to 1946 without the big war happening.

Also if I was Russian I'd seethe about the comparison, because of the actual Third Reich-aligned flags being waved in the conflict by the Ukrainian side.

For myself, I think the better Third Reich comparison would be with the side that rewrites the racial composition of literary works (referring to new LoTR movies) and which destroys statues on a basis of racial resentment. Of course that's kind of a frivolous comparison, but it's a bit more accurate even so...
I was just reading the other day the time Tolkien sent back a rude and sneering reply to the Third Reich for inquiring whether his work was "Aryan". Well it's definitely not Aryan now lol.

[Mjmd]

You didn't really address appeasement and annexing "ethnic populations" comparisons. Claiming to be protecting "ethnic minority populations" is an OLD excuse for war. Its important to look past the justification and just admit "Russia wants it".

So you are saying invasions for lower energy prices are ok? I mean I know there are American's who say that as well, but I can confidently say THIS IS WRONG!

[Ginger()]

Ahh phew. I was really worried about thousands of people dying and a continent destabilized but thank God that the demographic curve of 1938 Mordor is different and Saruman had more authoritarian fervor than Putin so I think that settles it

[superdeath]

Ahh phew. I was really worried about thousands of people dying and a continent destabilized but thank God that the demographic curve of 1938 Mordor is different and Saruman had more authoritarian fervor than Putin so I think that settles it

[Mjmd]

People often say history repeats. That isn't really true. It does rhyme however.

Rome is probably the most famous "invade to protect themselves".

Hell it doesn't' even have to be "ethnic" based. Countries have used "protecting religious minorities" as justification for war many times.

Pretending Russia hasn't done both of these in the past and somehow going "this time is different" is just hilariously ignorant.

[superdeath]

People often say history repeats. That isn't really true. It does rhyme however.

Roman is probably the most famous "invade to protect themselves".

Hell it doesn't' even have to be "ethnic" based. Countries have used "protecting religious minorities" as justification for war many times.

Pretending Russia hasn't done both of these in the past and somehow going "this time is different" is just hilariously ignorant.

The problem with internet arguments is no one changes their mind.

[Bobchillingworth]

Well now, that's just not true, Mr. Death! Why, I've changed my opinion on quite a few people, thanks to this very thread.

[superdeath]

Well now, that's just not true, Mr. Death!  Why, I've changed my opinion on quite a few people, thanks to this very thread.

Touche'

[BING_XI_LAO]

doublepost