RBPB3 - Gandhi of the Egyptians

[Krill]

And at last, a bit of spam. This thread has 5847 thread views. Regoarrarr et al have 5791. While regoarrarr may be in a post count race, that kinda favours him. What I'm aiming to win is the view count race. I am, however, still at a handicap in that, as I have less posts and the thread is updated less regularly, there is less reason to keep on reviewing the thread compared to the Indians.

So, any requests on what you want to see? New screenshots? More strategy and tactics? I'll definitely be posting all of my diplomacy for you to pour over, but until I meet new people that is going to be a bit slow.

Hmmm. Perhaps killing Lobo really had a downside? Just think of all those extra views...

[Krill]

Ugh, remind that nights really screw with you. Just woke up and I still feel knackered.

Oh well, onwards, ever onwards...below is the screenshot of my scout. I think I'll continue SE, along the hills. Need to speak to regoarrarr et al about how to contact the HRE and Ruff.




Settler is out, and moves onto the city tile next turn, after I scout it out with Cuddy. There was a lion around there, so I'm wary of loosing the settler in rather acrimonious circumstances.




Polytheism hasn't been founded I think I'm now a lock for it, so I need to go and change the tech I'm researching to Mining.




I just got the demographics for Mutski, so I'm keeping 1 EP on them until they meet another player, and then I can try to get an agreement where we put EP onto other teams to get the demographics quicker. I'll just give you the links, as there are a lot of screenies which would distort the layout.

http://i554.photobucket.com/albums/jj417...ot0064.jpg
http://i554.photobucket.com/albums/jj417...ot0065.jpg
http://i554.photobucket.com/albums/jj417...ot0066.jpg
http://i554.photobucket.com/albums/jj417...ot0068.jpg
http://i554.photobucket.com/albums/jj417...ot0067.jpg
http://s554.photobucket.com/albums/jj417...ot0069.jpg

[Krill]

One note: I am going to immediately build my second worker in AM. I plan to start building Oracle in about another 14 turns, and need to dedicate the current worker Vimes to Dunmanifestin. An immediate worker is the only option to get mines down on the hills asap to speed up the Oracle.

I'll have a road down connecting Dunmanifestin to AM the turn after the city is founded, so here is the question:

What do I do with Cuddy? As I see it, I have 2 options. Keep him between AM and Dunmanifestin, or move him onto the northern sheep to protect the worker. I'm aiming to get that sheep hooked asap, and then the gold for use at size 2, and then the wheat, so moving the warrior north gives me an extra turn of the sheep, which I think works out at one turn faster growth, and hence one more turn working the gold. Kind of a no brainer, right? Leave both my cities open, building my second worker at size 2, never chop, and explore deep.

Hopefully I don't die.

[novice]

Something for you lurkers to consider:

What do you think I should do about other foreign religions, and about the GP that the Indians are currently producing? Remember that the main aim of my strategy is to get as much gold as possible via shrines (and bonus points for getting every remaining shrine in the game without warfare).

Basic time line for you: Can build Oracle by around t61ish. While it can be built faster, don't forget that it is mainly tech dependent, and not production dependent, as most people don't aim to oracle something cheap, but something expensive, and above all, useful. I can then almost certainly research Monotheism by t75, and never forget the Obelisk...

I already have a tentative answer, but I'm still thinking it over, and I'm not sure it'll be allowed to fly...

I'd like to hear your answer... Are you thinking of tying a "no heathen gods" clause to your alphabet trade? Where does the Indian prophet come in play?

[Krill]

Something for you lurkers to consider:

What do you think I should do about other foreign religions, and about the GP that the Indians are currently producing? Remember that the main aim of my strategy is to get as much gold as possible via shrines (and bonus points for getting every remaining shrine in the game without warfare).

Basic time line for you: Can build Oracle by around t61ish. While it can be built faster, don't forget that it is mainly tech dependent, and not production dependent, as most people don't aim to oracle something cheap, but something expensive, and above all, useful. I can then almost certainly research Monotheism by t75, and never forget the Obelisk...

I already have a tentative answer, but I'm still thinking it over, and I'm not sure it'll be allowed to fly...

So, to answer this question...

I want to buy the Indians Great Prophet. I have a couple of sound arguments why they should give it to me, namely that they have no chance to bulb a religion with it because I will always beat them to it thanks to my Obelisks and Phi. So, why not trade it for something more useful, such as a Scientist?

But, I hear you cry, how can I get a GS? It'll cost 300 gpp, and here I am floundering about only just building my second worker and no plans for a third city! Well, I have 10 forests at AM, and 9 at Dun...so I don't need to chop all of them...and I'm PHI, so what is the most obvious wonder synergy out there? Simple: I get the Indians to help me build the GL and NE, in the two consecutive turns after discovering Lit. And a beeline is quite easy, if I can get the Indians to help me set up a few tech trades...only 2 techs away at t65.

So, I turn AM into a wonderwhore city with the NE. It has the food to be the NE city, much better than any other city I have. And about those priests, if I (somehow) manage to get the next 5 religions, I'll be able to use half price temples for cheap happiness, as well as the Obelisk, which gives me 7 priest slots, and I'm SPI so I can make use of Caste System for short bursts if I want a Scientist (or maybe Artist?) The only downside is that I need to find a source of marble, but if I get that, then 8 forest chops will net me both the GL and NE on the two turns after receiving Lit.

That is perhaps the most economically aggressive way I could play it. The simpler way is to just revolt to caste and shove out the GS from Dun, it would only take 17 turns at size 5 through 7.

[Krill]

I'd like to hear your answer... Are you thinking of tying a "no heathen gods" clause to your alphabet trade? Where does the Indian prophet come in play?

That's actually dead on what I was thinking. I gift Alphabet to anyone that wants it, provided they agree to spread Hinduism to all of their cities. Let them spread a second religion if they want...I'm planning to get the rest of them anyway.

The problem with the Indian Prophet is that Ruff is close to the Indians, so it would be quite easy for the Indians to sell their GP to Ruff for the shrine, Ruff then aggressively spreads his religion to as many people as possible and the game becomes polarised along religious lines, and he reaps the benefits of my hard work. This is one of the problems with me trying to grab as many religions as possible: it becomes a duopoly, and ruff doesn't have to work to make his religion wanted by other players that fear me getting too much money from my shrines (or god forbid a religious victory...like anyone would vote me winner. I'd rather lose than get such a cheese "victory").

And Ruff has a scary civ/leader combo. He can draft twice as hard as anyone else, and combining that with a shrine to make him a good contributor to a teching group means that others will value him economically, instead of seeing him as a means to achieve military ends. I think he has probably meta-gamed this more than I have.

[novice]

I'm having trouble seeing why India would help you build TGL. Maybe you can bribe them into settling their prophet instead of selling it to Ruff.

Do you think you'll have contact with everyone by the time you Oracle alphabet?

[Krill]

Yeah, the GL is a weird one, I'm pretty sure I'd have to offer them a couple of GS to make them want to do it. Basically I'd be selling them the idea on these points:

1. They get rid of a relatively useless GP for a more useful GS, without the oppurtunity cost of having to rush for a library and run 2 scientists. From a micro and ancient era tech standpoint, that's pretty useful.
   
   
   
2. They don't have to spend the hammers on the GL, instead maybe they could build the HG (along with some sort of stone/marble swap).
   
   
   
3. They would get the 1 GS for an Academy early on, but after that they can focus on whatever great people they want, such as merchants, artists or even an Engineer, opening a whole world of wonderful strategies. Just one Artist could split 2-3 enemy cities and let them kill on neighbour so easily, swinging the tactical aspect of a relatively early war in their favour. I need to make them think outside the box on that one.
   
   
   
4. I'd probably promise to bulb Philo and gift it to them, provided I get the religion (seeing a theme here?) Add this to the academy and they are in a pretty decent position to assure themselves of having a shot at Lib (even if an alliance they are in can't reach Philo in time, they only need to beeline Edu and then let the Indians research Lib, whilst someone slow techs Philo).
   
   
   
5. I'd be very willing to trade them scientists for Prophets that they'd pop at any odds, which is part of hte synergy of SPI/PHI (easy to use Caste).

I'm not saying they'd definitely take the deal, or even that it is feasible. We'd have to set up a pretty solid tech alliance to grab Maths/MC/Monarchy/HBR/IW (I'll bulb CoL with the Indian GP if they would sell it to me) beore Aesthetics becomes a good tech to head for. It would be a very aggressive move on my part, and I need to be very careful balancing my horizontal growth and military builds, because I seriously need to catch up in grop yield and some cottage growth.

Actually, I'll make a separate post on that cottage growth idea...

[Krill]

On the diplomatic contacts...no, no way in hell will have I have met everyone. If this were 16 teams on this map, I think the map would roughly look like this

|OxOxOxOx| |OxOxOxOx| where O = civ start
|xOxOxOxO| |OxOxOxOx| and x = empty land (not to scale!)
|OxOxOxOx| |OxOxOxOx|
|xOxOxOxO| |OxOxOxOx|

body centerd cubic on the left, simple cubic on the right. At last a chemistry degree comes in useful!

Well, with the extra team there will certainly be deformities, but as you can s each team will have at least 6 close neighbours, and up to 8 or 9, and then everyone else about equidistant in an outer ring (remember that the map is toroidal!). Well, right now Gaskin is in the outer group, but I've only met one nearest neighbour, so I'm probably still waiting to met a half a dozen neghbours who aren't just waiting for me to meet them, but are trying to find me as well.

I have met 2 teams out of 15. I think I can get India to help me meet Ruff and HRE, which brings me to 4 of 15. If half of my close neighbours find me, then that's another 7 out of 15, so I think I'm looking at knowing at least half of the teams in the game by the time I have discovered Oracle. Hopefully I can work with the remainder to help triangulate a few meeting spots in the game. With Alphabet being a useful carrot to make people help me I suppose there is a good chance of that happening. Getting out 2 or 3 scouting WC would also help, but unfortunately that has to wait.

[Krill]

Message to HRE/Rome, via Darrell of India.

Hi guys,

Hopefully you've just received this message from the great nation that is India (All bow to their masterful pile of rocks : unworthy: )

I'm sending this message via the Indians, trying to set up a meeting point so we can all gain contact.

On turn 36 my settler will be 4 tiles south of the Indian capital, on a plains hill tile. After that I will either head south east for at least one more turn, but he can hold for one turn if needed.

Hopefully this summit will be a success

Thanks in advance (especially to India),

Krill