Caster of Magic Release thread : latest version 6.06!

[Pinkeh-_-]

That is intended. They are unlocked in 01.1406

Oh that makes sense, its quite easy to rush them in 10 turns. Happy to know its not a bug. I guess i wont do a stag, great lizard rush

[Nelphine]

Incidentally, how early were you trying to make them? It's a relatively recent change, so feedback is still helpful

[Pinkeh-_-]

First time i noticed it was arournd turn 40-50 i think. Had a good start with 10 nature, arch, conj. Got a quick 7-8 hamlets with nature eye,. Got great lizard in 20-30 turns then bought my way toward stag in my capital to make an early unstoppable doomstack to grab merlin capital and nodes around me. 

I redid this strat today and im at 1408 with 6 nodes and all my town producing stag and spamming glizsrd and  cockatrices. still pretty strong but feels about right with the delay imo, earlier would of been unstoppable. Mind you im playing fair all around to test out strats so anything can feel strong as hell.

Altho klackons feel a bit limited army wise with no range units but as a expansionist, conjurer race it works so far. Yet not my favorite race in retrospect.

[ZombieManWerePig]

I keep starting with 2 swordsman and 2 settlers and it's really annoying and should not be part of the game.

The klackons are OP rn and their growth rate should be like the base game (below average)

The mod is really cool but really needs some tweaking and stuff, I never have problems with anything unlike base MoM where I either have mana or gold or something and less of something else,kinda lame in that regard tbh.

[Seravy]

I keep starting with 2 swordsman and 2 settlers and it's really annoying and should not be part of the game.

The klackons are OP rn and their growth rate should be like the base game (below average)

The mod is really cool but really needs some tweaking and stuff, I never have problems with anything unlike base MoM where I either have mana or gold or something and less of something else,kinda lame in that regard tbh.

I'm not a fan of starting settlers either but we had no better solution for that problem of having to build both military and settlers in the early game. If we hand more resources to the player - gold or production doesn't matter- they can spend it all on military and steamroll the game because the AI has to spend some of it on settlers and other stuff. If we give nothing, they can't compete with the AI - either you don't build settlers and you can defend yourself but have nothing to defend, or you build settlers and don't have the troops to defend them. You only have one city with very limited production at the beginning of the game. And yes, summoning helps but not every realm and strategy is based on summoning. Anyway, if you want more details instead of relying on my blurry memory, you should find the thread(s) where we discussed this feature.

How many times did you play klackons to conclude they are OP? I played them enough times and they felt about right. Their buildings are fairly limited and they have no ranged or flying units.

Certainly, we always need more tweaking, there are still 3 races left I haven't had the chance to properly playtest.

[Nelphine]

This mod makes the AI what you actually have problems with, which means the rest of the economy actually needs to work or they'll overwhelm you.
As you can see in the previous post, other people generally find klackons weak, even with the benefits you've described.
 However, if you do feel that something makes the game too easy to win, please let us know, and details help a lot. We continually work on it.

The starting settlers were a very long decision process, but the extremely short version is that without it, it's always better to simply go and conquer the AI cities, because they've been made strong enough that they will have those cities faster than you. If you have particular suggestions on how else we could make military less obviously better than long term strategies , then I highly suggest you read the various threads that led to that decision. Once you've read those, suggestions would be welcome.

[teelaurila]

Both klackons and early settlers probably interact strongly with the difficulty level, too. We need to give the player a start with more cities so that we can give the AI a higher bonus to keep it competetitive later on. Klackons have a weak unrest table, so they suck at conquering AI cities - which AI develops faster on elves than the player on klackons, with high AI bonuses. So the klackon inherent quick expansion probably works over-well on lower difficulties.

[ZombieManWerePig]

I keep starting with 2 swordsman and 2 settlers and it's really annoying and should not be part of the game.

The klackons are OP rn and their growth rate should be like the base game (below average)

The mod is really cool but really needs some tweaking and stuff, I never have problems with anything unlike base MoM where I either have mana or gold or something and less of something else,kinda lame in that regard tbh.

I'm not a fan of starting settlers either but we had no better solution for that problem of having to build both military and settlers in the early game. If we hand more resources to the player - gold or production doesn't matter- they can spend it all on military and steamroll the game because the AI has to spend some of it on settlers and other stuff. If we give nothing, they can't compete with the AI - either you don't build settlers and you can defend yourself but have nothing to defend, or you build settlers and don't have the troops to defend them. You only have one city with very limited production at the beginning of the game. And yes, summoning helps but not every realm and strategy is based on summoning. Anyway, if you want more details instead of relying on my blurry memory, you should find the thread(s) where we discussed this feature.

How many times did you play klackons to conclude they are OP? I played them enough times and they felt about right. Their buildings are fairly limited and they have no ranged or flying units.

Certainly, we always need more tweaking, there are still 3 races left I haven't had the chance to properly playtest.

As Klackons I am able to get my starting city fully built before the stags are unlocked for example. Getting +1 production and faster growth rate, you can easily get out of control. Also with the changes to gold buying stuff (which I like) it's really easy to max out cities now with little effort (pretty much 1 city out of like 5 will be making a building every turn due to klackon low unrest, high pop growth, and taxes and markets giving massive flat boosts for their costs).

And the score graph... Well the AI's are all at like half of my score. This is on fair difficulty, when I play other races on the same difficulty it's less of a difference in graphs.
My game which just turned 1406 I have 2 fully built klackon cities with the third almost done. All I can really do out of them is spam hali's or making more gold which I will use to max out more cities faster.

[ZombieManWerePig]

This mod makes the AI what you actually have problems with, which means the rest of the economy actually needs to work or they'll overwhelm you.
As you can see in the previous post, other people generally find klackons weak, even with the benefits you've described.
 However, if you do feel that something makes the game too easy to win, please let us know, and details help a lot. We continually work on it.

The starting settlers were a very long decision process, but the extremely short version is that without it, it's always better to simply go and conquer the AI cities, because they've been made strong enough that they will have those cities faster than you. If you have particular suggestions on how else we could make military less obviously better than long term strategies , then I highly suggest you read the various threads that led to that decision. Once you've read those, suggestions would be welcome.

I only played up to fair difficulty so far but I find defense to be easily handled by spells / summons / magic until I max out my cap and can spam hali's into all my cities for even more defense. Then I turtle for some rare spell to help me win.

Pretty much on fair as klackons you can play full defense until you research something to attack with (which is a lot faster than you think with the massive amounts of power and research in this mod).

[Nelphine]

Right, the game is balanced around expert. Fair is meant to be for people who are knowledgeable about the genre, but not necessarily highly experienced with caster of magic. If you're good already, I'd suggest moving the difficulty up.

One of the problems with the original was that there was too much difference between difficulties, so extra intermediate difficulties were added to give a smoother curve for people improving their game.