RB Pitboss #2 [SPOILERS] - Speaker and Sullla

[Sullla]

Unexciting T21. We completed the second chop and will get our second worker out next turn. Chamberlain moved back towards the capital. By using the turn order in our favor, we can sneak him past Dantski's warrior and get him back into our capital safely. Here's the current situation:



We got 9 points this turn for our land tiles in the first ring. It appears as though the value of land is almost 1 tile = 1 point. We received 9 points for 8 tiles, so the exact value per tile is a little iffy. (Both Jowy and Dantski only received 5 points last turn, so they both only have 5 tiles of land in their capital's starting radius! Wow. Sucks to be them, especially the non-Financial Dantski.)

Dantski gained one population point in his capital, which is now size 3. DMOC/Nakor also grew to size 2 and researched a tech, which by guesstimating a couple of factors is almost certainly Fishing. Just to recap, our two neighbors of Jowy and Dantski are ranked #1 and #2 in Soldier count (we are #3), and they both have capitals at size 3 already! However, that's actually a *GOOD* thing, because it means they have no workers done. They will both have to pause to build workers, and then after that a settler. Meanwhile, we'll have not one but two workers ready next turn, and they will improve our food resources and chop out a settler very quickly. We really suck right now in the Demographics - last in Food and Production! - but within 15 turns we should be up among the leaders. You'll see, trust me.

Jowy's capital was in Anarchy last turn, so no new info to report there. We'll see how quickly they are building their worker next turn (we can estimate the exact turn it finishes!)

Since a lot of data has been added recently, here's the current Excel table:

http://www.cassiopeiathedog.net/Images/P.../RBPB2.xls

[Sullla]

We also got a response (finally) from Jowy and Yaz:

Good morning Killler Angels.

We've discussed the NAP offer and would like to accept, but as mentioned with a little tweak. We feel that T75 is a bit long, because the game can change a lot in that time. We suggest a little checkpoint about halfway through just in case we drift apart to different diplomatic sides, or disagree on borders between our civs etc. Though hopefully we can prevent that from happening and live in harmony. :)

- NAP until turn 35.
- NAP automatically renews to turn 75, unless either side decides to end it - If the NAP is ended at turn 35, either side still can't attack eachother until turn 45.

~ Jowy

PS. Sorry to take so long to answer. It took a while to discuss this and other things going on in our game, then came the busy weekend :P

I confirmed receipt and said that we would respond once Speaker came back from travel. My impression is that we'll probably accept. I highly doubt that either team is going to want to break the agreement halfway. And if they don't want to be locked into long-term peace with us, well, that's their choice!

[Speaker]

I'm home after another loooooong weekend! The NAP response from Greece sounds perfect. Let's take it.

The turn has flipped (to turn 22) and Dantski logged in and completed his turn already. He moved his warrior East onto our spices. He is still 3 tiles away from our capital at the most direct route, but our warrior can also get there in 3. I don't think he's trying to attack us though. I think he's just trying to uncover as much of our capital as he can.

I have not moved Chamberlain or either of our now two (!) workers. I leave that for you, Sullla. I have set Gettysburg to build a warrior, and we will have 5 hammers in the box next turn. Excess food is converted to hammers first and then added to excess hammers to produce the total overflow when a worker finishes.

[Sullla]

Thanks, Speaker! We got in our free turn of mining and pre-chopping with our two workers () while they waited for Agriculture research to finish. Here's the current situation:



I decided to name all of our workers after famous battles from the Napoleonic Wars, which is what my students are covering right now in their military history course. We'll start with "A" and keep going through the alphabet as we build more workers. Thus our first worker has been dubbed Austerlitz, while our second one gets Borodino. Maybe a little weird for personal names, but too much fun to resist!

If Dantski moves NE next turn onto the spices, we'll wait to be the last ones to play our turn, then double-move NW-NW to skip past to safety. Yes, I don't think Dantski has any intentions of attacking us. At the same time, I also don't see any reason to risk our entire game on a Combat I warrior vs unpromoted warrior battle, which Dantski would have 70% odds to win! Better to be slightly cheezy and abuse the turn order, avoiding any possibility for conflict altogether.

Here's our next five turns:

(T22) Agriculture 1t, Gettysburg 0/22 food, Warrior 4/15 [Worker #2 done], Worker #1 move 1E and busywork mine (4t), Worker #2 move 1SW and prechop (3t)

(T23) AH 12t, Gettysburg 3/22 food, Warrior 5/15, Worker #1 farm wheat (5t), Worker #2 farm wheat (4t)

(T24) AH 11t, Gettysburg 6/22 food, Warrior 6/15, Worker #1 farm wheat (3t), Worker #2 farm wheat (2t)

(T25) AH 10t, Gettysburg 9/22 food, Warrior 7/15, Worker #1 farm wheat (done), Worker #2 move 1NE onto forested hill

(T26) AH 9t, Gettysburg 14/22 food, Warrior 9/15, Worker #1 move S-SW onto forest, Worker #2 chop (3t)

(T27) AH 8t, Gettysburg 19/22 food, Warrior 11/15, Worker #1 chop (2t), Worker #2 chop (2t)

(T28 ) AH 7t, Gettysburg 2/24 food [SIZE 2], Settler 40/100 [Warrior 13/15], Worker #1 chop (done), Worker #2 chop (done)

Internationally, the only score change this turn was LiPing getting land points (as expected) and growing her capital to size 2. That's it, no techs discovered, no military units built. athlete will get a big score increase for land points next turn, due to Creative expanding the second border pop before anyone else.

As for Jowy:

(T21) Athens 0/26 food, Worker 7/60 [4 food, 3 shields]

We don't "know" that they're building a worker, but it seems likely to me. I mean, what else could they be working on? They already have a work boat done and a warrior to defend their capital, plus a scout to explore. Building anything other than a worker now would be idiotic. Anyway, they definitely produced 4 food, 3 shields last turn. (That's the one disadvantage of the bar graphs: you always must operate one turn before the current one. You can only see what they DID, not what they're DOING.)

I'll type up an acceptance message for Jowy on the NAP in a little bit.

[Sullla]

Let's try this for Jowy and Yaz:

Dear Greek Friends,

Speaker and I had a chance to discuss your offer, and we are pleased to accept! We look forward to many years of peace with our Greek neighbors.

Please stay in frequent contact with us, and let us know if/when you meet any other teams. Until then,

Sullla
The Killer Angels

I couldn't resist slipping in the reminder that they need to let us know if they meet any other teams. Since we both agreed on the deal, I went ahead and sent the message immediately.

[Speaker]

Do you think it would be wise to have the worker on the forest chop it again next turn? It will slow down our farm by a turn, but will give us a lot more safety (being able to 1-turn chop the forest after), and the ability to block a tile and/or protect a worker (with a 2nd warrior) in case Dantski tries to get cute.

[novice]

Actually, since the farm is 5 worker turns, prechopping the forest one more turn still gets the farm in three turns after that.

[Rowain]

If Dantski moves NE next turn onto the spices, we'll wait to be the last ones to play our turn, then double-move NW-NW to skip past to safety.

I'm surprised that you are so easily ready to make a very cheesy move bordering on cheating.

[RefSteel]

If Dantski moves NE next turn onto the spices, we'll wait to be the last ones to play our turn, then double-move NW-NW to skip past to safety. Yes, I don't think Dantski has any intentions of attacking us.

You could run some kind of test game to confirm this, but I think if you move your warrior onto the spices in question, then if he moves there and then declares war (including by attempting to move into your borders[?]) while both warriors are on the sme tile, his warrior will be teleported away from yours, in the direction of his lands, and its movement expended. This should allow you to get your warrior to the capital before him without ever exposing it to attack outside the city (if I'm right). Also, it would leave your warrior in better position to resume exploring (should you wish to do so) if Dantski goes by without declaring war, which is apparently what you expect anyway.

Of course, pre-chopping the forest again per Speaker and novice above might obviate the need to play defense with Chamberlain at all. I therefore admit that my suggestion is largely motivated by the hope that you'll run a test someplace and confirm some of the mechanics of war-declaration-teleportation once and for all! (Does it really work when the war declaration is made by ordering a move into an unoccupied tile of "enemy" territory? Does the turn's movement really get used up by the teleport? Even if the unit, post-teleport, could still reach the tile to which it was trying to move in the first place to trigger the war?)

[Speaker]

I'm surprised that you are so easily ready to make a very cheesy move bordering on cheating.

There won't be a double move. Sullla is just explaining it incorrectly. We'll want to log in next turn before Dantski and move our warrior right away, but wait to end our turn. Then we'll make sure to be the first to move the next turn, and move to safety. The turn order of the warriors is preserved.

If Dantski declares war, we will continue to chop the forest next to Gettysburg and chop a 2nd warrior before he gets to the city. None of it will really matter because he won't declare war.

As an aside, we'd be in better shape, Sullla, if we had put a turn of mining into the hill S of Gettysburg with Worker #1, instead of E-E. Then we could double chop the forest next turn and have the warrior if needed. That's why I chopped the outer forest first by the way, to allow us to keep the worker closer to the capital. I wish I had communicated that better, but oh well!