[49 spoilers] Miguelito, pindicator and Adrien take Shiva by the hands

[pindicator]

I love the reporting. And the fighting spirit!

[scooter]

Ruff had reclaimed the city which Cairo had emptied, apparently by deleting his units*.

*Btw, is this allowed by the rules? Not asking for a reload (shouldn't have played then), but it kinda amounts to city gifting, while I had my stack besides the city and would have easily fought either Cairo's defenders, or Ruff's after he'd take them out. I would like for lurkers to make a judgement, in case this is relevant for the future, and also because I then can blame someone else but myself. Oh and as I now realize, Ruff also had to double move Cairo to achieve this. If I was still relevant in this game I'd make a fuss about it.

I'd say this can range from perfectly allowed to so blatantly wrong it needs a reload. I don't know what the situation was (or even if he actually deleted units), but I can absolutely see a situation where you determine your units are certain to die, and you decide it's better to deny XP to your attacker, for example. I'm not saying that happened here at all, but giving an example where it would be more than fine. On the other hand, if it amounts to actual city gifting or has a serious impact on the results, yeah that's not good of course. There isn't a strict rule against it, but it's in the realm where someone might be justified in demanding a reload depending on how impactful it was.

[Miguelito]

I love the reporting. And the fighting spirit!

glad it's entertaining, that's what we're here for, right?

Ruff had reclaimed the city which Cairo had emptied, apparently by deleting his units*.

*Btw, is this allowed by the rules? Not asking for a reload (shouldn't have played then), but it kinda amounts to city gifting, while I had my stack besides the city and would have easily fought either Cairo's defenders, or Ruff's after he'd take them out. I would like for lurkers to make a judgement, in case this is relevant for the future, and also because I then can blame someone else but myself. Oh and as I now realize, Ruff also had to double move Cairo to achieve this. If I was still relevant in this game I'd make a fuss about it.

I'd say this can range from perfectly allowed to so blatantly wrong it needs a reload. I don't know what the situation was (or even if he actually deleted units), but I can absolutely see a situation where you determine your units are certain to die, and you decide it's better to deny XP to your attacker, for example. I'm not saying that happened here at all, but giving an example where it would be more than fine. On the other hand, if it amounts to actual city gifting or has a serious impact on the results, yeah that's not good of course. There isn't a strict rule against it, but it's in the realm where someone might be justified in demanding a reload depending on how impactful it was.

The way it looked from my perspective:

• t131 Cairo had 3 units in the city. I felt very smart for landing on Ruff's terrain to attack the city.
  
• t132 they were gone, Ruff and Cairo had OB, and Ruff was garrisoning the city with 4 units (the ones from the t133 report). I am reasonably (not 100%) sure that Cairo did not have 2 galleys in range to save his units, hence why I think they were deleted. He had reasonable odds to at least kill one unit on defense (fortified axe on hill), that's why I'm saying it feels like a gift. I got teleported out of range when Ruff declared, not looking so smart now (would have got it had I just landed on Cairo's hill straight up)
  
• t133 Ruff declared on Cairo (have to correct myself, the double very likely didn't matter), apparently taking the city under him.
  

Also I'm noticing I might be completely wrong and Ruff may actually have attacked a remaining axe that I missed with his catapult and then won flawlessly, in which case I should stop talking and go over to the t133 report.

It's summed up pretty easily:




Lost a city, killed a stack. I might still lose the winning elephant due to (won't elaborate). Legend:
Jem Hadar are spears, swords and axes (one of each in the final set), Fiddlesticks are catapults, Hirogen I think an elephant?
Best that can be achieved at this point. I'm considering whipping a settler out of the capital to refund, but will it pay for itself before I get the coup de grace? Would need to grow, whip the granary, then start getting out units... like 20t to get the <100 hammers back in units? (we're IMP, so it isn't 100, but neither 66, because Nataraja also has a forge, and I'm too lazy to figure it out)

[Miguelito]

Cairo's moving up a 30 unit stack. I have about 20 hitters and 4 catapults (yep, too little )
I decided to make the last stand at Mahadeva, which has 5% less defense bonus but barracks and stables, the connection to FT, and great tiles for producing reinforcements. At the capital only a skeleton garrison of 4 units remains. It's threatened by 4 galleys of unknown content, I hope to hold at least agains a direct attack from the boats

I can't attack out, but he should have a hard time chewing through, against cultural defenses and without collateral. Otoh, I was already surprised once in this game at how well swords do attacking cities.

I'm getting the fleet back. Lost a galley to a Persian trireme, but also sunk one randomly attacking one of Ruff's. One axe survived to tell the tale (and to die to Persia). The fleet now has cover from the 3move trireme which had stayed at home. Ruff can attack with a trireme and 2 galleys, but that would be pretty suicidal. He also finished a quest for the largest fleet, does that give him 8 free triremes or something? It won't matter.

Also made a point of killing a sentry chariot and a scout that Ruff had stepping over the border from Gangadhara.

FT is fielding maces.

[Miguelito]

Party's over, folks

Here's where we started:



He has so much more than I do (there are also 4 galleys forking us, likely loaded with swords). What I have are catapults. So, have at them. They were too few of course (I used to have more, but then decided it would be a good idea to let Cairo sink my loaded ships ). But they manage to get hits on most, if not all, of Cairo's units. What I could have done now was to let him go at me, behind 60% culture, with mostly wounded units (knowing Cairo, he'd just retreat and heal, come back with more, against probably less catapults. The man has time). But if you've paid any attention in this story you'll know that I like to attack out and hey, my elephants get 70% odds, and it's  just 4 spears, and my horchers are also getting odds...



I lost every single one of the 6 catapults at 30+-2 % odds (quick calculation gives me 12% odds of that happening, fair enough), then lost all but one of the elephants at 70%+, also a horse archer at 70%, while the other two barely survived their fights at same odds. Again, I probably should have turtled, but would I have had 6 cats ready next time? (also, the dead cats give him XP, so the situation's only getting worse)
Some complaining about RNG is inevitable, but I've had some good rolls in this game as well, maybe not as decisive (well the shock axe event was huge), but very helpful at the time.

Cairo now had enough shock horchers at 5/6 or more that attacking out with axes was stupid, and I'm very proud of myself that I resisted hitting the button. But the good guys are just too few. I just hope that Cairo makes it quick now.

Btw pindi, if he doesn't, could you cover the turns August 1-14 when I'm on vacation?


Also I considered trying to give gold to FT for protection, but he does not have too many troops around after taking Gangadhara, he's still at war with Commodore, and this game somehow doesn't have the AI diplo options, so I'd have to signal with copper. I may still gift my gold to him and Cornflakes, for the support given.

[pindicator]

Btw pindi, if he doesn't, could you cover the turns August 1-14 when I'm on vacation?

I gotcha

[Miguelito]

follow up looks brighter:



I didn't take the time to go through the combat logs and judge the odds, but Cairo has reported so he'll tell you hopefully.
I'll take the nice result of still being alive and him almost out of healthy units.

But also those of our boys who escaped death this time did so barely:




I had to decide what to do with the GG, between spraying the XP in the city, giving near all those units a promotion (but I'd need auto-promote for god knows what ), and making a super medic. I went for the latter, using the scout that so bravely hunted in the jungles in our early days. Annoyingly, he's at 25/26 XP now, 1 short from taking Morale or some such. Not that I actually could use a 3 movement medic. This way I'm hoping to heal the troops in the city a big deal, hopefully enough to strike at the stack in retreat (Cairo will get promo heal on some or most of those units though).

Dry whipped a new horse archer at Mahadeva (poor city already dry whipped a catapult 2 turns ago), and moved a new elephant and 2 axes including the super axe up from the capital, which is left with a spear and archer, betting that the galleys are empty for now - I am pretty sure that he unloaded swords into the super stack, though to my great shame I have no records from 2 turns ago for comparison. The galleys are retreating fwiw, seemingly to pick up new invaders, but can't be loaded unless they were already at the start of the turn. I'll whip a new elephant there next turn, and one axe at least will go back there as well.

[Miguelito]

Btw pindi, if he doesn't, could you cover the turns August 1-14 when I'm on vacation?

I gotcha

Oh, and to that!

[Miguelito]

t140

Cairo had his stack in retreat, after pillaging the horse and road. The super medic scout had healed all of our units into green lines, I had the units from the cap, and the new HA, while he had just a fresh HA, a spear at 2.4, and then some half health swords and immortals, between the really crippled bulk.  I couldn't resist and rebuilt the road. Elephant went in at 56% against the single spear - and lost, because of course he did. Got a bad feeling there.  But I had to take up battle in earnest, else he'd pick up those workers (you could argue that you'd rather lose 2 workers than 2 cities, but in India we don't leave one man behind).

Glorious victory!

Not without this gem:



but at this point, who would want to complain?


Now this still can all go very much south next turn, because I'm guarding the cap with just a spear and archer, and the new elephant:




He's loaded up some axes at Nilakantha, but I don't think more than 4. Also I can't know what he has on the other galley forking my cities. With the new spear at Mahadeva that city should be safe at least.

For a while, that is, because look here:


There are 2 explanations for him bringing his first knights to Gangadhara. Either he wants to hit Commodore from an unexpected angle (sorry FT for never renewing that road on the banana tile), or he has decided that his Indian possessions be rather administered by himself than the puppet king (yours truly). Now if he declares this turn that would be particularly hurtful because it would cancel the elephant at Nataraja and then Cairo really has a great shot at boating it. Wait and see.

[superdeath]

No currency yet? Even the mighty Romans got currency! :P