WW16: The Outlaws and The Olives

[novice]

Novice do you suspect Azza or not? I'm reading the back and forth between you and catwalk and Jesus I can't tell what your stance is! Personally, I think Azza is clear scum.

I don't think he is scum. But I guess my stance is, I won't stand in the way of his lynch if the right people are voting for him. I'm not feeling confident about my reads atm.

[Gaspar]

What exactly kept Gaspar high on your list for voting reasons? I've had the opposite thoughts: that gaspar's voting record is bad and his posts have been usually helpful (although now i want to check over hs posts again)

Yeah my approach sucks, he wasn't high on my villager list for voting reasons. I can't separate votes from tone in my mind - Gaspar is just taking hold as superficiallly helpful, essentially useless. So again, other suspects just bobbed past him. I suppose I could argue that his scumminess is not related to his votes per se, but rather to his spells of inactivity.

Anyway, I think I need to reevaluate my list when I'm able to look a bit more dispassionately on this game.

Ultimately, I shouldn't have signed up for this game. I had been enjoying the lurker thread the last few games and thought it'd be fun to put myself in the mixer again. I had mainly been staying out because I had those angry outbursts in my last game and I was waiting until I had regained some emotional stability. I've done so (and I think I've not been overly hostile) but unfortunately I just haven't had the time I like to have to actually play.

Because of that, I've tried to do some different stuff - poking holes in theories I don't buy, pointing out some theories I do, my useless gambit yesterday with Injera, etc. But I haven't had time to do that read and reread bit which usually has me all over someone and finding scum. And ultimately that puzzle solving is what I enjoy, not so much the arguing in thread.

Anyway, I certainly acknowledge my voting record is somewhere between terrible and useless. But I have done my best to contribute as much as I can. That's all I'll say about me until the votes start flying tomorrow. Hopefully between now and then something will crystallize for me. Its weird because we haven't had a terrible game as a village, with 2 scum down and the Rowain thing working in our favor, but I can't help but feel like we're constantly just wading in mud.

Anyway, let's see what happens tonight and take it from there.

[pindicator]

Well, I think we should take the advice of Gaspar here. Not necessarily WW16 Gaspar (as I'm undecided on him), but WW15-lurker thread Gaspar:

I actually learned something from Lewwyn last game I played. You can't judge the players by their ability to sound innocent - experienced, skilled players can fake that. You judge them by the quality of their reads.

Maybe a re-read of some people with this in mind will help?

@waterbat- any chance of a scraper update?

[Gaspar]

What I meant by that is who are they attacking and over what, not the success mainly. Primarily, there are players who Lewwyn oft refers to as "lynch-bait." Generally speaking, if a good player takes that bait, that's a good scum tell.

In this game, the players who have behaved like lynch bait:
Tasunke
Qgqqqqq
Merovech

[SIZE="1"](You could argue Rowain, but Rowain is always being Rowain, which usually gets him lynched, but I wouldn't call him traditional lynchbait, since he's often behaving like that and scum.)[/SIZE]

They're all dead of course. I can't say that I had that all right at the time. But novice made an excellent point earlier - even more than attacking those players heavily is a scum tell, players defending those players is, to me, a huge village tell. The last thing a scum wants to do is take a lynch patsy off the board.

So perhaps someone who has more free time than I - who attacked those 3 most vociferously and who defended them? That should actually be a pretty decent tell. Merovech in particular was super lynchbait-y and probably the vote I most regret all game.

Of the remaining players, I don't think anyone has played in a lynchbait fashion. Azza and Waterbat both have a bit of it to them, but Azza actually strikes me as quite savvy and Waterbat's performance last game pretty much eliminates him from the discussion.

[Gaspar]

Apropos of nothing, but I think I just wrote lynchbait like 4 different ways in that last post. I clearly am not getting enough sleep.

[Ichabod]

I don't regret my play at the end of the last day. I've been trying to discuss suspects for a long time and no one seems to care. Then, afterwards, everyone come with the talk of everything happens near the lynch. Of course, because no one wants to discuss things beforehand.

As a matter of fact, i'm proud of my play in this last day. I wanted to lynch either Meiz or Tasunke from the players that were being voted (I also wanted to lynch Gaspar, but no one wanted to discuss the case or bothered to do it). When Selrahc and Azza were getting votes that I knew were going to surpass Meiz (who never had more than 5 votes during the day, even though, again, hardly any player mentioned him), I switched to Tasunke. I already had stated I was going to do that, no one can come with this "late switch at 10 minutes" talk.

Then, when I saw the opportunity arrise, I tried to lynch Meiz by switching the vote. I almost did it, if that Catwalk vote had counted, Meiz would have been lynched. Anyway, I campaigned hard for my lynch targets and I got both of them up there. If no one wants to discuss, I'll try to win this by myself.

I can give a word of understanding to novice here, because I also thought Azza was way up in the lead of votes near the deadline, which made me move from meiz from Tasunke in that vote that wasn't counted.

I made a mistake, but I don't care. At least I'm trying to play this in the way I think it's right.

[novice]

That's an interesting post, Gaspar. One of my impressions of Waterbat is that he's good at participating in the lynch discussions and has voted correctly some times (although not on Thestick), but he doesn't really bring many new suspects to the table. That's my impression at least.

[pindicator]

@Ichabod - aside from Tasunke you liked Lewwyn, Meiz, and Gaspar as suspects, correct? Do you still like those three or do the events yesterday make you rethink your list?

[Ichabod]

@Ichabod - aside from Tasunke you liked Lewwyn, Meiz, and Gaspar as suspects, correct? Do you still like those three or do the events yesterday make you rethink your list?

I'll answer your question near the deadline.

[Lewwyn]

That's fine Ichabod. That basically confirms exactly what I thought you were trying to do and manipulate the lynch. Personally I think that you had a different motivation from the one you are expressing, IE: lynch Meiz, and more of "lynch anyone but wolf buddy".

I keep thinking about WW3, because I just keep seeing parallels. I think today's lynch matches up pretty closely with the Fire&Ice lynch in which we had 2 wolves on the block in Scooter and Zak but end up lynching the villager because Roland barrels in at the last second and blows up the vote.

Also if I remember right, Ichabod, you put the final vote to seal my lynch and leave the village with a final mislynch. I'm not eager to see history repeat itself.