Out on the Rim [Mr. Cairo spoilers]

[Mr. Cairo]

Why war with OH? Could you elaborate on the 'small numbers of units at first across a wide front' bit? And I'm unfamiliar with the mod, what changes has Krill made so that pre-Astronomy vs Astronomy is easier?

Well, OH is the only logical target for a war. The only other civ I have a border with is Gavagai, who's too strong and too far away. OH also has a bunch of cities on the coast stretched out in a ring around me to my north and west, so I can attack a lot of them at once.

The 'small numbers of units' thing is because he's been leaving very weak garrisons (Warrior mostly, some with Axes and/or archers) in those cities for the past many turns, and with an apparent invasion of his own underway, I hope they remain weak enough that I don't need many units to take them. I know this because I've had vision on his cities from my EP spending for a whil;e now. He's starting to put EP into me though, so I've lost vision of some of his further cities. I want to get that back, but I also don't want to alarm him with massive EP spending on him (I'm making 50 EP/turn right now), so it's a bit of a balancing act. He also has a Chariot running around my territory, if I can ensure that it sees nothing untoward, then that might be enough to fool him into thinking I'm not a threat, and that my own EP spending on him is defensive in nature (now that he has Galleons).

Finally, the recent changes to Krillmod. Firstly, the Caravel now has 4 strength (same as Galleon), and can carry a military unit in addition to what it could carry before (it also gets -30% vs galleys and triremes to keep them from being too powerful a beeline target for chocking someone's coast, I guess). The second change is that the Privateer is now available with Optics and Paper. It no longer needs Astronomy, so I'll be able to get a ship that can reliably kill Galleons (Privateers are strength 6), without needing Astronomy of my own.


I'll just report on one more thing, now that I'm posting this. Gavagai just started a Golden Age, and is 3 turns from Guilds. So my first few Caravels are going thataway to just ensure I don't get invaded from there. I don't think it's a serious threat, because Gav has a land border with OT4E, who has quite a lot of power as well. But I need to be sure, I already have a Chariot in his territory scouting, and I'd like to get vision on his cities eventually. I'll also go after Engineering relatively soon, for Pikes.

[thestick]

Thank you. Roughly how long will it take to get to Paper/build up an invasion fleet?

[Mr. Cairo]

I don't know. I don't generally plan in that much detail that far ahead.

However, it is complicated by the fact that OH didn't attack Superdeath as I had thought he would, and instead went after DZ, who is crumbling fast. So it depends on what he plans to do next. I get Optics next turn and can start whipping Caravels, and I'm already whipping Longbows and Xbows.

Here's a screen of the area in question:


I plan to take the cities on the islands and my continent at the very least. I have also thought about trying to capture and keep some cities on his mainland, as well as land a force outside his capital, all on T1 of the war. But I may have to settle on burning them instead. It depends on what I can build up and where his forces are. Keeping city visibility on him is vital. I'm also starting to get city visibility on Gavagai to keep that front secure as well. Having huge EP production is turning out to be very, very useful.

edit: sorry, wrong screenshot. I hope no-one from EitB 52 dropped by before I fixed it

[Mr. Cairo]

Some more details coming into focus for the attack. I'll need around 16 Caravels loaded with Xbows, I'll have 10 galleys with Jags, some HAs, some cats, and a LB or two to take the cities on my own continent (the one marked BURN on the above screen). I'll need at least one settler ready to correct that dotmap travesty. Unfortunately, nothing upgrades into Privateers, either in the queue or with money. So I'll need to set up my whipping cities to be able to whip a bunch out the turn after I get Paper. I will also be burning his mainland cities, including his apital if possible (although that will require landing a suicide squad). Then my Caravel swarm will hold off any Galleons he has in the area while my Privateers get built. Taking out those cities on his mainland should cripple him, but he'll still have his army from his conquest of DZ and I'll want Privateers to prevent it from landing anywhere and causing trouble.


In other news, I think OT4E is about to get attacked, as I've found Gavagai's army, and it is terrifying.


OT4E looks to be going for Muskets to counter, but will it be enough or in time?

[Mr. Cairo]

I was right, Gav just declared on OT4E, and got 2 Great Generals in the same turn, so it looks like it's starting well for him. I need to get my chariot over there to follow along.

OH is also at war with Lewwyn, looks like he took a couple of cities, then whipped all over his empire. Which turned out to be HA whips becoming Knights as he finished Guilds. Well, as long as those Knights aren't garrisoning his cities that I'm attacking, it'll be ok .

I still plan on holding him off in the sea with Privateers. But I am still going to go after Guilds next (but not finish it). Once I build up my attacking force (assuming the garrisons don't change ) I'll get Paper, then 3-pop a bunch of Privateers in my coastal cities, then attack OH (or perhaps even on the same turn as those Privateer whips), then whip another round of Privateers, then whip HAs into Knights while finishing Guilds.

Hopefully I'll take the island cities from OH, burn some of his core cities, and have the fleet to keep him from landing any revenge armies to either retake his cities or go after me. I'll still be reinforcing cities with Longbows and ideally Pikes, and hopefully I'll be able to stabilize with a few new cities, and plenty of capture gold to upgrade my units or do some teching.

[Boldly Going Nowhere]

Blood! More!!

Thanks for all the updates.

[Mr. Cairo]

Well, you might have to wait a little longer. My plan was to wait until he revolted back out of slavery (he's Spiritual), that way he can't whip units. However, he just did that now, and I'm not ready. I might be able to get some units in position in 3 turns, but there's another problem. I now have enough EP in him that I can see city details, including production. So I know that a bunch of the cities I'm planning on attacking are finishing up Knights in the next few turn, and that means that Galleons are going to be around soon to pick them up. I'v already spotted one.

So, it may end up being that I need to wait for at least another 10 turns (assuming he sticks to 5-turn cycles between Caste and Slavery). Probably a little more though. I don't think I'm really ready to go so soon, unfortunately. More time will of course give OH more time, to perhaps guess my intentions. But it'll also let me attack with a much stronger force that'll include Pikes and War Elephants to counter his Knights. I'm still trying to move my stuff around his scouting Chariot so he doesn't see my build-up, or rather, doesn't see the Caravels. He might also not swap out of Caste in 5 turns, in which case, I'll just attack when I'm ready, and maybe even get Privateers before I attack.

[Mr. Cairo]

Hmm, I may have to put it off a bit longer. Gavagai is having no trouble whatsoever conquering OT4E, and is teching Paper. I don't want him to have a naval dominance over me (I don't think he has Optics yet, but I'll find out soon). I'm still going to prepare for the attack on OH, but I'm going to get Paper myself in a couple turns and start getting Privateers. I'm also putting EP into Gav so I'll be able to see if he's building up forces to invade me. I'm massing War Elephants, as the cheapest and most versatile way to combat Knight Swarms. Pikes would also be useful, but I don't want to build fully defensive units. Not unless I have to. Dodging OH's roaming Chariot is proving problematic, but I'm moving groups of Xbows and such "towards Gavagai" to try and convince him I'm focused over there. I do hope he doesn't find my group of galleys and notices that my Jags and HAs he saw earlier are nowhere to be seen....

Krill is amassing Knights on his border with OH, but they have OB and are watching eachother with scouting units very closely. Superdeath has Privateers of his own now and sent me a fish-fish deal, which I offered back. Maybe he's planning something against OH? I hope so. If I do attack OH I have no doubt others would jump at the opportunity, so I'd prefer it if they attack first (but they would prefer the same of me, so...).

At the very least I'll have to wait until after the Knights he's building in my target cities are finished and get shipped off, and the Galleons doing the shipping aren't around. Unless I already have a bunch of Privateers. I suppose a test of OH's attention would be to see if he reinforces his cities near me once I get Paper and can theoretically challenge his control of the sea.

Sorry for all the text , I'll do a report with pictures next time.

[Mr. Cairo]

Krill attacked OH this turn:


Civstats shows three cities taken, but they're not ones that I knew about, so Krill must have attacked with Caravels the same way I am going to. This is very good news for me, and I am going to be attacking myself in a couple turns. I don't know if I'll be able to burn his capital, but now is the time to go.

Power graph:

[Mr. Cairo]

So, with all the units running around OH's land, I'm having to pull back some of my plans for burning his mainland cities. I'm going to be putting the most of my effort into burning this city:

For obvious reasons. It will be a hard thing to do, but necessary. Especially if Krill starts to win his war on their 'mainland'

Next turn I'll whip 10 Privateers, for 3 pop each and a couple more the next turn. Some of these are from cities with only 6 or 7 pop and limited food, it will be painful . I'm also going to be saving cash from now on for upgrades. I attack in 2 or 3 turns.