Races, Units, Buildings

[Nelphine]

What.. What other unit would ever trigger the terrain requirement that doesn't also have the terain requirement on the building? I think we keep the feature.

I'd be OK with beastmen getting 10 or 20 higher growth and no other changes.

[Seravy]

No, what I mean is if the unit requires a building that requires terrain, there is no check for that.
For example a High Elf city with no Forest tiles would still list Longbowmen on their Smithy, or...I think that's the only one, actually? Miner's Guilds no longer need a mountain.
Oh, Nomad Rangers, those also need the Forester's Guild.

[Nelphine]

Oh right I see. OK. Yeah I'd leave it in - foresters guild is something you usually want when choosing city location anyway.

[Arnuz]

Yeah definitely leave it. Would it be possible to make foresters guild always available, as per miners guilds? I really despise AI or neutral elves cities for that reason: the AI seems to have a knack to choose terribad places for their cities ^_^' And when starting as an elf, if the location is without forests that's grounds for saying F* this and rerolling tbh. When starting with anything even perhaps.

It'd seem that then the problem I raised disappears. As for the foresters guild, it could become hunters or something like that that is not forestry specific. guild? Agronomists? Husbandry?

Beastmen: I'm saying remove the +1 attack because it's really pointless in a myrran race (dwarves and trolls look at their +1 strength and lol, draconians piss over everyone, and dark elves shoot them) but to add insult to injury, a myrran race whose middle troop is ranged - the centaur - and whose top troop has only 2 figures. But yeah, for the same reason it's inconsequential so with or without that, fundamentally they deserve a much bigger growth imho. Myrran orcs is indeed a better comparison than lizardmen.

[Nelphine]

Remember that things like the +1 str is so the race is better than the arcanus race. But it should be on par with other myrran races. I'll play beastmen instead of dwarves and trolls any day, and usually instead of dark elves. Draconians if you abuse flight are obviously better.

But I also usually pick orcs over high men, nomads, or high elves.

My preferred races are barbarian > beastmen > lizardmen > halflings > some mix of orcs, dwarves and draconians > some mix of gnolls and dark elves and trolls > klackons and nomads > high elves > high men.

[Arnuz]

But it isn't better than arcanus races in practice. By the time they're met, swordsmen are pointless to use. Anything above swordsmen doesn't benefit from the +strength - centaurs - or very little - minotaurs. Well, now that I think about it, I guess you like the strategic value of +1 str. halberdiers given your style... But tbh that's not a fighting style, that's a non-fighting style I don't think I've ever willingly built halberdiers. I possibly should given that they let you avoid fights. On the other hand I kind of consider the strategic value shenanigans a bit exploity... Not sure I'd like to do that!

[Nelphine]

Steam Cannon against Water Elemental should do something right? Just attacked a water elemental 10 times with steam cannons without doing a single point of damage.. *grumble luck grumble*

[Tlavoc]

Did the steam cannon have the alchemy buff? Water Elementals have weapon immunity on top of decent defense and on a sorcery node it would have a bit more.

[Nelphine]

I don't know. It was a random monster invading my city, and the city has an alchemist guild.. maybe I produced the cannon before the alchemists guild. Either way, the elemental killed everything and rampaged on, so.. if another one comes back, I can test..

[Tlavoc]

So no sorcery node, still I'd guess it was because of weapon immunity and a bit of bad luck. I'm pretty certain I've taken out water elementals with ranged attacks, but it's possible it was with magicians. If I run into one I'll give it a shot, maybe two if the first one doesn't kill it.