Uncommonly Good: A Story of Elves

[Mardoc]

Ultimately, I'll leave foreign policy to you, Gaspar. I think it's clear that the longer we wait to waste hammers on military, the stronger we'll be. That assumes that we don't profit from war, though, like by getting free cities and infrastructure and etc - but everyone knows one doesn't win wars, only lose and stalemate . I suppose you've pegged me accurately as the conservative one. Speaking of which...when do we get that list of fun posts you promised us?

I'm glad to hear the river makes Hash Pipe a net commerce profit already (it's neutral, until you account for the trade route at Chronic, which bumps it positive). Of course as it grows, and especially if it grows onto cottages, we'll be in good shape.

I did know it was a 3 happiness unique, that's a large part of why I kept referring to city 2 as an 8 population city. Of course, I forgot that we have only one palace happy, partially cancelling that out

Well....junk foods for worker names. That seems appropriate, we will never want to have just one . And we want lots and lots of names, since our lazy workers will need to be multitudes. We'll probably end up circling back to A, actually . Just need 9 cities for our recommended workers to be 27, after all.

Cheetos Chocolate Cookies Chips Cake - C is easy. I think therefore we need to plan on 81 workers .
Doritos. Doublestuff. Dreamsicles
Eggs . Um..gotta be something better.
Fudge. Fudgsicles. Frosted Flakes.
Goldfish. Gorp.
H...amburgers?
Ice Cream.
Jalapeno popper
Klondike bar
Lays
Musketeers, 3. Munchies.
Nutrageous
Oreos
Pizza, popcorn, potato chips, peanuts, peanut butter...maybe it should really be 94 workers? 110?

Ok, that's a start. I'm sure we need more names than that, though, and some of my suggestions here are really really weak.

[Man Behind the Mask]

MBTM was prescient as always, here are score increases:

Balseraphs (17), Hippus (23), Grigori (25)

I didn’t realise that fancy word meant “right, for the first time ever” . Kyan’s increase is sadly another tech, plus third city growing to size 2. It’s notable that the Grigori are the only other civ with no water in the capital’s first three rings (based on land scores). In fact, even with our new borders unexpanded, we’re back up to second in land area. It’s possible everybody started at the coast around the edges of the continent.

I suppose you're right that it makes sense to build an elder council before more warriors in city #2. Unless a horde of Azers show up, we should be reasonably safe with the 2 we have, and the ability to react to something for more.

In terms of build-plan for city 2, I’m not so sure that the lizardman ruins don’t pose an “imminent threat”. I’d inherently prefer a third jobber in the city so that we can lose to a bad roll and then attack out to finish off without risking complete disaster, or we could double-cover a worker. What’s surprising is that there are two civs more vulnerable than our light-counting military! Could Orthus actually do some damage, for once?

And finally a C&D puzzle: Turn 43 demos show top soldiers as 65000. Turn 45 shows 66000, the difference being consistent with the two pop increases for the Balseraphs. However, between that on Turn 44, it drops back to 53000. Here’s the full list of units representing 12 soldier points:

Priest of the Empyrean, Priest of the Order, Priest of the Veil, Priest of Winter, Illusionist, Mage, Wizard, Spectre, Succubus, Supplies, Wood Golem, Trebuchet, Angel, Caravel, Royal Guard, Mobius Witch, Mokka, Griffon, Grigori medic, Ice Elemental, Pitbeast

There’s nothing in there that jumps out as being likely to die and be replaced at this stage of the game. Therefore I’m left wondering if a portion of that scary power is due to continual summons, which Kyan didn’t make on that turn? Wouldn’t we get a message if he’d built Loki, contact or not?

**

I'd enjoy lurker junk food suggestions for subsequent workers. As 95% of everyone at Realms Beyond is European, don't feel a pressure for me to know what it is.

Filling in for Mardoc… workers beginning with “e” or “h”, hmmm (with translations for Gaspar where needed): Eclairs (pastry cake), Haribo (mixed candy), Hot Dog?

I really hadn’t got the impression 95% of the board was European.

[Azoth]

In terms of build-plan for city 2, I’m not so sure that the lizardman ruins don’t pose an “imminent threat”. I’d inherently prefer a third jobber in the city so that we can lose to a bad roll and then attack out to finish off without risking complete disaster, or we could double-cover a worker.

Yep, all I'm saying is we shouldn't build that third - er, jobber - in City #2, since it would waste hammers under Pacifism. The capital could slip one in between workers.

And finally a C&D puzzle: Turn 43 demos show top soldiers as 65000. Turn 45 shows 66000, the difference being consistent with the two pop increases for the Balseraphs. However, between that on Turn 44, it drops back to 53000. Here’s the full list of units representing 12 soldier points:

Priest of the Empyrean, Priest of the Order, Priest of the Veil, Priest of Winter, Illusionist, Mage, Wizard, Spectre, Succubus, Supplies, Wood Golem, Trebuchet, Angel, Caravel, Royal Guard, Mobius Witch, Mokka, Griffon, Grigori medic, Ice Elemental, Pitbeast

There’s nothing in there that jumps out as being likely to die and be replaced at this stage of the game. Therefore I’m left wondering if a portion of that scary power is due to continual summons, which Kyan didn’t make on that turn? Wouldn’t we get a message if he’d built Loki, contact or not?

I'm sure we'd get a message if Loki was built. Perhaps we overlooked it?
There are a couple other (rather unlikely) possibilities:
1a. Kyan might have picked up Knowledge from the Ether from a hut, graveyard, or lair. (Mysticism is its only prerequisite.) If he had hammers to spare, he might have built an Adept for the Mind I spell Inspiration. One or more puppet summons could account for the power fluctuations.
1b. If Kyan built a Mage Guild, he might have picked up a free Adept from various random events.
2. The only 12-point units available to him at this point are Griffons and Supplies. It's possible he rushed a building with Supplies and caught a Griffon a turn later; or lost a Griffon to barbs and then found some Supplies in a lair.

Filling in for Mardoc… workers beginning with “e” or “h”, hmmm (with translations for Gaspar where needed): Eclairs (pastry cake), Haribo (mixed candy), Hot Dog?

Might I suggest Eggo (a North American brand name for breakfast waffles)?

[Mardoc]

2. The only 12-point units available to him at this point are Griffons and Supplies. It's possible he rushed a building with Supplies and caught a Griffon a turn later; or lost a Griffon to barbs and then found some Supplies in a lair.

Or, um - we're pretty sure he's gotten at least one Dwarf-Lizard event. Depending on how common griffons are, maybe he lost one and captured a new one. Odd coincidence, if true, but easier to believe than supplies.

Or, well, he's got 3 cities now. So it quite possibly could have been a combination of several things - lost and retrained a mixture of units.

[Gaspar]

Another dull turn. I'll spice it up at the end though. (Cue Azoth recoiling in horror at the thought of me deciding to attack the ruins with Hash Pipe's garrison. )

Score increases: Elohim (12)

I double checked the log, no Loki anywhere, and yes we would see that whether we had contact or not. I think Lizards + Griffon seems the most likely of the plausible solutions posited. It also would be consistent with him managing to get contact with Nicolae from seemingly far away, as well as why we haven't seen him yet (unit died.) Speaking of Nicolae, I'll leave this to the C&Dfather, but anyone else think this looks like an Academy?



Slight increase in Sheaim culture at the same time, no less. No GSage message in the log, so I suspect we're looking at a Sage from an event. I thought we started out pretty ok with the RNG stuff, but clearly if Fishing tech and a dead Adventurer is the best we can do, we're paling in comparison to our rivals on that front. Unfortunate.

Here's the perfunctory overview shot:



and here's demos at EOT:



My question to the team: I think we should power ahead to city 3, perhaps as soon as the second worker completes, at worst after a 3rd. Given that, and the fact that we won't have any of the techs for the "optimal" city 3 (Cotton/Pigs/Gold) wouldn't it be a better idea to settle the backlines Deer/Fish/Pigs site with city 3, tech AH and Calendar, then settle the better site? I'm not comfortable with waiting until AH/Calendar are in for city 3, I think we have to push that out sooner, as we're behind already. My current inclination is to finish this worker, then go straight to settler for the backline site. I could be talked into one more worker first, though. I doubt I could be talked into much else, but you're welcome to try.

[Mardoc]

Speaking of Nicolae, I'll leave this to the C&Dfather, but anyone else think this looks like an Academy?

Pretty good, pretty good. Ours is getting close, right?

Is he in God King yet? That would prove whether it's possible to train naturally or if this an event.

My question to the team: I think we should power ahead to city 3, perhaps as soon as the second worker completes, at worst after a 3rd. Given that, and the fact that we won't have any of the techs for the "optimal" city 3 (Cotton/Pigs/Gold) wouldn't it be a better idea to settle the backlines Deer/Fish/Pigs site with city 3, tech AH and Calendar, then settle the better site? I'm not comfortable with waiting until AH/Calendar are in for city 3, I think we have to push that out sooner, as we're behind already. My current inclination is to finish this worker, then go straight to settler for the backline site.

Yes, as long as we're going Hunting first, I agree we ought to go for Deer/Fish. Only question is...are you sure you want to stick 4 food resources in one city? Here's an alternate proposal, to at least start discussion:

I could be talked into one more worker first, though. I doubt I could be talked into much else, but you're welcome to try.

How many cottages do you have? How many could you work? Our worker/city ratio will be what, 1.5? Are you really happy running a cottage economy with no cottages?

[Man Behind the Mask]

There’s a lot to talk about for another “dull” turn.

Yep, all I'm saying is we shouldn't build that third - er, jobber - in City #2, since it would waste hammers under Pacifism. The capital could slip one in between workers.

So, in the popular parlance, the plan is:
1. Wait for Apprenticeship/Nationhood Switch
2. Build Warriors
3. Kill lizard and investigate ruins
4. ????
5.

PANIC!!

I think Lizards + Griffon seems the most likely of the plausible solutions posited.

I think I’m also favouring some kind of Griffon explanation. There are two other 12k jumps on Turn 18 and 36, when something could have been captured.

Speaking of Nicolae, I'll leave this to the C&Dfather, but anyone else think this looks like an Academy?

The C&Dfather really needs to find time to think about who has what technologies. That is almost certainly an Academy for Nicolae, and if there’s nothing in the log then I suppose the sage came from event or lair. GNP actually looks like it’s jumped again after the Academy – there seems to be a kink after the initial (expected) rise of about 14. This is VERY BAD, as it means he can use his first natural GP (could even go for a Prophet instead) for bulbing, and he will get to zombies much quicker. On the bright side, this will just increase the Epicness of our eventual victory.

I could be talked into one more worker first, though. I doubt I could be talked into much else, but you're welcome to try.

I’m with Mardoc. There are a lot of tiles that need improving at Hash Pipe, although you could work the high output Remnants for a couple of turns at size 2 to let the lonely worker catch up a little on city growth. Having a third worker at the capital who can help with a cottage before road-building to the new site (or getting a shareable cottage ready for when it’s placed – see below) while the settler completes would definitely be my preference.

I’ve been having a hard time disagreeing with this dotmap, apart from the fact yellowy dot is in the sea! You can even add a neatly fitted sheep city in the valley to the west. Green would be an absolute production monster with some Ancient Forest hill mines, and matches nicely with that coastline which would otherwise be difficult to fit in. Red would be much improved if we can get the Heron Throne, but is pretty strong for a coastal site.

The alternatives to Mardoc’s map are a deer, fish, corn city (I’d actually stick with green , but share the corn by moving red 1E), or a deer, pig, corn (green NW or NW-W) with a fishing village for later. The extra resource means each of those would be a little better at foodhammer units, but the latter is certainly worse for long term potential.

The choices are then which “red” (as Mardoc or 1E) and which order to go in? My gut feel is actually Green first. If we do go worker-worker, then that’s ~7 turns, and cottages/Academy should mean Hunting is due in about 5 turns more. Settler will be done at roughly the same time that finishes, but we should be making enough bpt that Animal Husbandry will be 5 turns or less. The delay before the pigs can be improved is small, and that plot is much closer to the capital. Only disappointment is that the corn is second ring, so we can’t be working on that before the borders pop. At size four, it will be kicking out 5 turn workers (no infrastructure required and working a couple of cottages). “Red” first feels less attractive: it’s three turns later to settle; increased maintenance; and needs a workboat built.

[Mardoc]

Ya know, I like the idea of moving red 1E. That trades coast for coast, and a peak for the shared corn. So the city is the same in the long run, but has the potential to work the corn when it's not otherwise in use (like, say, green is max size, working all cottages).

Actually, ideally we'd move green 1E as well; we just need to invent the 'Mountain to Mohammed' spell first .

[Gaspar]

Very disappointed you guys did all this without the appropriate episodic heading.

I'll have more to say in a moment, the save's in though I don't quite have time for it. I did get this message in my inbox, however:

Hippus Warriors have arrived on the hills 1W of the remnants of patria, establishing contact between our civilizations.

Amusing roleplaying greeting incoming.

Here's hoping he's not NAP'ed with the Balseraphs for a million years.

[Mardoc]

I'll have more to say in a moment, the save's in though I don't quite have time for it. I did get this message in my inbox, however:



Here's hoping he's not NAP'ed with the Balseraphs for a million years.

I, um, hate to be the bearer of bad news - but there's worse than that.



Not sure if we can blame Nicolae or Kyan for this. But regardless,

That said...according to Sareln's excellent odds calculator, BB promoted to Shock, being attacked across the river inside a city hill, has actually 26% odds to win (because all the modifiers just keep stacking: -10% rusted, but probably +10% culture, +20% Combat I, + 40% Shock, + 25% in city, + 25% across river, +25% hill, +25% Fortified, that's a total of +160%. Even if he loses, if we can get enough jobbers in place, they might be able to pull an Orthus and kill the Ogre on the rebound.