[SPOILERS] - Tredje and Mardoc are Sheelba of the Clan of Embers

[Mardoc]

Are you definatly confident that the orcish economy will survive another push? It was certainly teetering not that long ago.

Yes, actually. I wasn't confident until Coombe View came out of revolt and was that dramatically positive commerce-wise. Bear in mind we're Sheelba, too, so we get half price Courthouses. Add in our recent acquisition of Currency for trade (and the fact we've got open borders with both Iskender and Square Leg!), and you get to a point where new cities are either profitable immediately, or profitable as soon as they get their Courthouse built. The worst I've seen in the empire so far is 11 gold/turn maintenance cost, but 2 trade routes for 4, city center to bring it up to 5, add in a couple good commerce tiles and we're even with maintenance.

It does mean that Courthouses go up before Markets/Elder Councils, though!

Hope you can get a hunter hawk combo out to support the Sheaim invasion soon. Hawks are so brokenly good against human players.

Agreed, they are. I think the Sheaim might be gone before I get a hunting lodge built - we've only got 3 warrens actually done, and one of them is in Shazak, which is our only non-revolting coastal city. But it's certainly a goal.

I didn't want to wait for Hawks, though - something that Mist said in regards to PBEM3 seemed appropriate:

Scouting with hawks should not make much of an impact either, there's only so many ways you can look at the train about to hit you

Given the combination of the power of the Sons, and Serdoa apparently not preparing for them aside from the Death mana to Bob, even a little uncertainty shouldn't cause me too much trouble.

Ummmm just as a clarification question... Does anyone know EXACTLY what the Sheaim worldspell does? It does apocalypsy stuff, does it also raise the AC etc?

Ooh, I hadn't considered that. I believe it does not raise the AC since it's dependent on the current AC, but it has a chance for each forest/jungle of creating a Smoke, and a chance for each city of creating a fire which in turn has a chance of destroying buildings. Which would be painful for me, but happily, more painful for Iskender's Leaves econ, and both rivals' building-dependent economies.

According to the manual:

Does not affect Sheaim Territory
•Current AC / 4 chance per Tile to createSmoke in Forests & Jungles throughout the World
•Current AC / 4 chance per City to cause a Fire
City Fire means a 10% chance per
building of destroying each Building
in the City
Excludes most Wonders
•Deals Fire Damage equal to the current AC to units in Cities

EDIT: it looks like you are having a lot of fun with the sons! keep it up!

Thank you . Yep, this has been fun so far. It helped that I took over at the point where the Balseraph war was just breaking open; the Sons are the most enjoyable when they can do the sort of thing I'm doing to the Sheaim - hit widely separated targets with overwhelming force, immediately. And probably the least enjoyable when they were just being protection against Skeletons.

[Mardoc]

Two Sheaim cities fell this turn, and the only reason I didn't take the third was paranoia (afraid Serdoa could take it back and would raze it). He did manage to destroy a fire elemental outside of Graelingving, although I'm not sure why exactly. Maybe to suicide his units to get this over with faster?

You can also see he's whipping his cities into the ground. It's not enough to want to make me speed up, though, and risk losing the irreplacable Sons.

Also - the Heron Throne was built last turn...By the Sheaim . I suppose it made sense up until I invaded, and then he was just 1 turn away. Haven't found it yet, but I'm sure that'll be just a matter of time.

I'm definitely starting to understand the warmongers around here a bit better, looting is fun!



No Sheaim Worldbreak yet; I'm actually kinda wondering if I ought to remind Serdoa about it so I can see the world burn . (or at least Iskender's ancient forests...) On that note, I'm also wondering if I really care if the AC gets pushed higher - Blight and the Horsemen won't hurt me near as much as they'd hurt Iskender/Luchiurp; maybe I should actually try to push it higher? Certainly if Armageddon's going to happen, better it should happen now while I'm still at peace with the barbs. If I want to do that, though, I ought to try to have my settlers ready to settle right after Blight hits.

Pushing it higher will be easy, and a good deal of it will happen naturally whether I do it purposefully or not; I want to spread AV around my empire, after all.

[Bobchillingworth]

[...] afraid Serdoa could take it back and would raze it

You can't raze your own cities if you recapture them.

I'm definitely starting to understand the warmongers around here a bit better, looting is fun!

Yeah, it's especially fun when the map hands you four super units and nobody can do anything to stop you! =)



Have you found the Orthus Axe yet, btw? I'm not sure what the AI will do with it... I might have been feeling slightly spiteful



Oh yeah also, good luck! I sincerely hope you win this game, since Sons cheese or not Tredje played an excellent game (with your advice), and I think the Clan deserve to win. Also I really want you to kill Iskender

[Mardoc]

You can't raze your own cities if you recapture them.

Oh, that's good to know. Still too late to put into use this turn, of course, but maybe Serdoa will give me another opportunity next turn.

Yeah, it's especially fun when the map hands you four super units and nobody can do anything to stop you! =)

Have you found the Orthus Axe yet, btw? I'm not sure what the AI will do with it... I might have been feeling slightly spiteful

Gee, I can't imagine why you might have felt that way...tell me more .

Would it help any to know I was advocating we choke you, not Sareln, and I think your puppet spam vindicated me? Or possibly to know that was, in fact, the plan, up until you saw a unit (an archer, I think) on your borders and hit Tredje up for a chat?

But no, still haven't found the Axe. I *think* it's on a unit on the trireme, but you were out of sight long enough to put it somewhere else. Mind you, it's not the highest priority on my to-do list since I don't get to keep it .

Oh yeah also, good luck! I sincerely hope you win this game, since Sons cheese or not Tredje played an excellent game (with your advice), and I think the Clan deserve to win. Also I really want you to kill Iskender

We might deserve to win now, but if there were no Sons, I think it would just be a matter of waiting for you to pick a victory condition. Especially after we chose to choke Sareln instead of you.

Will definitely try that Iskender thing, sooner or later. Just need a few more techs first.

[Gaspar]

Everything looks good, Mardoc, don't have anything interesting to contribute. Though, if you want input on domestic matters you're either going to have to post more detailed reports or get me emailed the save on a semi-regular basis.

[Mardoc]

Everything looks good, Mardoc, don't have anything interesting to contribute. Though, if you want input on domestic matters you're either going to have to post more detailed reports or get me emailed the save on a semi-regular basis.

Well, I've got a good excuse to make myself do this, this turn at least:

[COLOR="DarkOrchid"]Hey guys,

I have no forces to make actually use of it (nor do I think is the AC already high enough to normally warrant its use) but as I am probably for no longer then 3 turns or so with you, I thought I use my worldspell as long as I can. Now, from the sounds of it, many units were damaged, but I wanted to ask you guys if you might be so kind to put in your spoiler-threads an overview of what really happened to your civs. Did any buildings get destroyed? Did smokes or fires start?

Oh, and Mardoc, can you tell me if I did see right that the Sons of Inferno do not get damaged at all by it? Or is that because they are within my lands?

Kind regards,
Serdoa[/COLOR]

But I'll try to amp it up in the future. Or maybe I could just set up a forwarding rule for this save...that might be a good idea too.

Edit: Ok, I sent you a request to allow forwarding. Mostly because, well - if I know to look at it/mention it, I've probably not got an issue. Where I'm much more likely to have a problem is where I just assume everything's hunky-dory.

Not that I'll deliberately back off on the updates, although the next week or so before Thoth crushes me in PBEM 3 may be quite busy for me.

Edit2:

[COLOR="SandyBrown"]Hi All,

Units within the Sheaim borders shouldn't be affected by the world spell. It will be interesting to see the effects. The AC was 29 last turn and so there is a 29/4 = 7.25% chance of smoke in forests and the same chance for fires in cities....

Fire damage equal to the AC to units in cities.

Shold be interesting.... I'll post some pics in my spoiler thread for you to look at in a few days.

SL[/COLOR]

Well, that's how I believe it *should* work. As of when the manual was written. But that assumes the manual had it right and it hasn't changed any since. It'll be interesting to see what actually happens.

After all, I was convinced that Sons of the Inferno were immune to For the Horde

[Mardoc]

War first, then census time.

With the war, I only took one city this turn, and destroyed 4 units - an adept, skeleton, warrior, and scout. I have found two of the three remaining Sheaim cities and ought to be able to hit them hard next turn. Serdoa's down to 54K power, which is probably mostly within my sight.

I think I will drive for Galveholm next turn, therefore, to kill his remaining army.



Worldbreak started 3 Smokes in my sight, one on the island, one by Stratus, and one by Renegade Hill. The damage to units looks much more impressive: 29 units were damaged by Fire, some in every city, generally between 1-32%, as predicted by the manual, almost. This could be very nasty if used in an offensive war. I haven't found any buildings destroyed, but I didn't exactly have an inventory. Nothing appeared in the log, anyway. If the manual was right, though, we only had a 7.25% chance/city of a Fire, which with 14 cities means our odds of being unscathed were ~35% - better if you don't count those cities with no buildings or a City Fire doesn't count when it misses a building.

Which means it probably didn't do much to the other rivals, either.

The payment from the Luchiurp started this turn, with 111g up front and 37 gpt. I think he might be leaving out one turn, but I'm not going to complain - it depends on when we get the 37 gold that we just agreed to - in T145 when he offered it or in T146 when we accepted. The combination of that and Jubilee coming out of revolt brought us to #2 GNP. I decided we need to sneak in Animal Husbandry - our cities are all extremely unhealthy, and we will have cows, sheep, and pigs all available. I'm debating between Warfare next, for MilState (now up to 20 free maintenance), or simply pushing straight on to Corruption of Spirit - which would after all grant us +2 beakers/temple, happiness, and +1 beaker for every city we spread AV to. I'm thinking it probably makes more sense to head toward AV for the moment; I want to wait on popping the Golden Age until at least all the Balseraph cities are out of revolt, maybe also some/all of the Sheaim, which is still not yet.

Here's what we're building - you could hardly tell we're at war . Still, with a pair of Warrens finishing next turn, we're in good shape to knock out some precautionary troops - Iskender's keeping his Priests for the moment, it appears.

[Mardoc]

I open the save and...huh? I'm at peace? We'll see about that!



After taking one more city (and discovering that Serdoa *now* gets all his Gate luck, now that it won't really matter), I figure out why:


Oh! I guess we're not in danger of Blight anymore either. My golden age trigger finger is getting itchy, but I hold off a bit longer.

Final Sheaim front:



I don't see any way he holds Galveholm next turn. Whether I finish him off depends on where exactly his last city is and if I find it with movement left on the Fire Elementals. Still - I give the Sheaim 2 turns, max, of survival, unless he's got yet another trick that wasn't worth bringing out until almost dead.

Looking at Sheaim culture, his last city has to be off to the northeast somewhere; I can probably follow that road to find it.

In domestic news - I finish two Warrens this turn, and start two more. Each warrens city will build a quick pair of warriors for a little more security on the Sidar front, then one will go Hunting Lodge while the other knocks out a Training Yard. Former Balseraphia is working to establish rule of law - everywhere is building a Courthouse, and I expect that to finish up within 5 turns, even if I don't hit Golden Age. After that, it'll be a debate between markets/elder councils, warrens, and Ashen Veil stuff. I'll probably end up with a mix of all of the above.

I had my naval city take a short break from Triremes to produce a work boat for the newly acquired barb city, and was debating going for yet another for Cevedes, when I discovered that although combat ships are not doubled by Warrens, apparently work boats are . Whatever, I'll take it. Back to Trireme production.

A couple other details: I noticed that Barnaxus has a Great Commander attached He's only got 2 combat promos so far, but that'll help keep him alive a bit longer, I should think. SL's life adept is coming south from the Standing Stones; presumably he already blessed those ruins and is on his way to the others I pointed out

Square: Hey Mardoc - I think I made a mistake and missed a turns money. I'll send another 37g along next turn.

This is good news, too!

And finally, Iskender's getting concerned about the Axe, it appears:

[COLOR="Silver"]Hey

Looks like my city expanded to two tiles north of Cevedes. Do you think wheat would be a fair compensation for that?

I've noticed you made peace with Keelyn. Does it mean you were able to recover the axe?

Iskender[/COLOR]

[COLOR="DarkOrange"]Let's wait and see on Cevedes - I think it'll be able to take back
those tiles in 2-3 turns when it gets above 50 culture. If it
doesn't, then yes, wheat seems fair.

I made sure my peace with Keelyn was the breakable kind, but I
couldn't do much of anything to her anyway at the moment, not until I
finish building a navy. I just saw no purpose in having war weariness
slow the construction program.

- Mardoc[/COLOR]

[Tredje]

Hi Mardoc!

Let me begin by congratulating you on dismembering Bob and now smashing through Sheaim lands. To be honest I'm not sure what Serdoa was doing. Perhaps he gamled that Bob would be able to stall you for a longer period, so that he could pursue whatever plan he had. I guess we can read his thread later to find out. Oh wait...

With the Sheaim dead I reckon the final battle is coming. Will the forces of light prevail, or will the orcish hordes run rampant across Erebus? I'm sorry for asking this, but could you in a concise manner run though the deals you have with SL and Iskender? I know you extorted some money from SL for a NAP-extension. How has Iskender been acting after it became clear that Bob would be destroyed? I would be surprised if SL and Iskender weren't trying to form some kind of alliance to stop you, and thus I think that preventing that is one of your main goals as of right now. Even if that means hitting Iskender before you feel completely ready.

If I recall correctly SL went for Empyrean. Any idea what kind of army he is trying to assemble? Is he close to getting Chalid? Rathas? Does Empyrean have synergy with a Golem army? What about Iskender? Does he have anything dangerous besides his PoL?

[Gaspar]

Hi Mardoc!

Let me begin by congratulating you on dismembering Bob and now smashing through Sheaim lands. To be honest I'm not sure what Serdoa was doing. Perhaps he gamled that Bob would be able to stall you for a longer period, so that he could pursue whatever plan he had. I guess we can read his thread later to find out. Oh wait...

With the Sheaim dead I reckon the final battle is coming. Will the forces of light prevail, or will the orcish hordes run rampant across Erebus? I'm sorry for asking this, but could you in a concise manner run though the deals you have with SL and Iskender? I know you extorted some money from SL for a NAP-extension. How has Iskender been acting after it became clear that Bob would be destroyed? I would be surprised if SL and Iskender weren't trying to form some kind of alliance to stop you, and thus I think that preventing that is one of your main goals as of right now. Even if that means hitting Iskender before you feel completely ready.

If I recall correctly SL went for Empyrean. Any idea what kind of army he is trying to assemble? Is he close to getting Chalid? Rathas? Does Empyrean have synergy with a Golem army? What about Iskender? Does he have anything dangerous besides his PoL?

Just want to quickly say two things:

1. Hey Tredje!

2. Agree 1000% with Tredje here. I think you have 2 choices. Either we go hit Iskender immediately after Serdoa with what we have, or you extort a NAP of a different length than your one with Square Leg from him. Cannot let them build up and hit together. How many turns do you think we are from Iron Working? If its like... 40, I don't know that its worth the wait, as awesome as Iron Ogres are.