[no players] The Hyborem Fan Club, a Lurker Thread

[Mafro]

Barbarians can capture and pick up items, but HN units (including many barbarians) cannot capture items.

For some reason Spiders aren't HN.

When you say "HN unit" you mean a player-controlled unit that has its nationality hidden, right?

HidingKneel says he saw a bloodpet with the Rod of Winds earlier...so it sounds like that unit could've gotten eaten by a giant spider, which then picked it up. What that still doesn't answer is whether or not the giant spider was under the control of a player...but so far it seems reasonable to think that it was not.

[Ellimist]

Barbarians can have the hidden nationality promotion as well. Animals are the usual example of this, except for Spiders for some reason. In FFH-14, the Ice Barbs had HN, and they destroyed Hyborem's Gela because they were unable to capture it. This is one of the only ways to destroy many items(which cannot be deleted.)

The Rod of Winds Spider could be a barbarian or it could be owned by a player. It should be easy to figure out though, because a barbarian Spider tends not to move around very much.

[Mafro]

In a way it's a shame there are exactly three players in real contention to win. It essentially means the game comes down to a 2-on-1 dog pile. A 2-on-2, 3-on-3, or 2-on-2-on-2 would be more satisfying. However, as it stands, someone's going to feel like they were ganged up against....

[Mafro]

HidingKneel's analysis of TBS's production is impressive. He estimates a max of 175 hpt, with 140-150 being more realistic. Looking back at TBS's T98 update, his base production is/was 152 hpt.

TBS is worried about HidingKneel
HidingKneel is worried about Jalapeno
Jalapeno is worried about TBS

Where does that lead, other than to a game of rock-paper-scissors?

[Commodore]

Sian is lizard, WK is Spock.

[Mafro]

The dog pile is looking like HidingKneel and TBS against Jalapeno. If that happens it probably hands the win to TBS, unless he is seriously underestimating his time to build the towers. Interestingly enough, both TBS and HidingKneel seem to have a talent for micro and deep knowledge of the game's inner workings, and yet both appear to have very different estimates as to how many turns it is to a ToM victory. Part of this may be TBS sowing disinformation as to his intent...and part of it may be HidingKneel's preoccupation with the vampiric menace. Either way, someone is making a miscalculation that will likely cost him the game.

Still, I could see HidingKneel ceasing hostilities against Jalapeno once the first tower or two is laid down. In that event he might not be able to attack TBS in time to stop the Tower of Mastery from being built, due to the expiration on his NAP, but he could potentially gift units to Jalapeno or otherwise support the vampires against TBS to prevent him from winning. That'd be breaking the spirit of the agreement, maybe even the letter...a bit of a quandary for HidingKneel, perhaps.

The bigger quandary, of course, is how much help to give to your soon-to-be enemy. If he gifts units to Jalapeno, for example, there's a good chance those same units could end up arrayed against him a few turns after TBS falls (assuming the other two ally against him and do so with enough time to prevent his victory). In such desperate times, I wonder if HidingKneel would remember to add a clause requesting that gifted units be returned to him some turns before hostilities could ensue between he and Jalapeno.

Anyway...it remains an interesting - and entertaining! - struggle....

[Ellimist]

...If he gifts units to Jalapeno, for example, there's a good chance those same units could end up arrayed against him...

FFH does not allow unit gifting.


I mostly agree with the rest of what you wrote though.

[Mafro]

FFH does not allow unit gifting.

Ah, now that I think about it I don't think I've ever seen that little gift box button...good to know...thanks!

[Bremen]

The dog pile is looking like HidingKneel and TBS against Jalapeno. If that happens it probably hands the win to TBS, unless he is seriously underestimating his time to build the towers. Interestingly enough, both TBS and HidingKneel seem to have a talent for micro and deep knowledge of the game's inner workings, and yet both appear to have very different estimates as to how many turns it is to a ToM victory. Part of this may be TBS sowing disinformation as to his intent...and part of it may be HidingKneel's preoccupation with the vampiric menace. Either way, someone is making a miscalculation that will likely cost him the game.

Still, I could see HidingKneel ceasing hostilities against Jalapeno once the first tower or two is laid down. In that event he might not be able to attack TBS in time to stop the Tower of Mastery from being built, due to the expiration on his NAP, but he could potentially gift units to Jalapeno or otherwise support the vampires against TBS to prevent him from winning. That'd be breaking the spirit of the agreement, maybe even the letter...a bit of a quandary for HidingKneel, perhaps.

The bigger quandary, of course, is how much help to give to your soon-to-be enemy. If he gifts units to Jalapeno, for example, there's a good chance those same units could end up arrayed against him a few turns after TBS falls (assuming the other two ally against him and do so with enough time to prevent his victory). In such desperate times, I wonder if HidingKneel would remember to add a clause requesting that gifted units be returned to him some turns before hostilities could ensue between he and Jalapeno.

Anyway...it remains an interesting - and entertaining! - struggle....

I think part of the mis-estimation is that HK is vastly underestimating the amount of mana nodes TBS is going to have access to. He's assuming a conventional "Build tower - spend several turns redoing mana nodes - build next tower" while TBS is planning more "Build tower - build tower - build tower - etc"

Hence why he's trying so hard to find the number of metamagic mages. If TBS only has one, he assumes it would take at least 4 turns to switch over all the mana nodes.

[Mafro]

Looks like Jalapeno's repeated promptings have revealed TBS' trap to HidingKneel.

It remains to be seen whether TBS has bought himself the time necessary to raise the Tower of Mastery, or if his enemies will be able and willing to commit the forces necessary to raze him.

The tension between the latter is...delicious....