WW29: Beautiful Day in the Neighborhood

[Serdoa]

So being mafia on a forum based game is very different. In real life it is more about a poker face than any thing else. Any one have advice for how I could have played better?

And yes I had to bus Serdoa because of the seer. He was a sure scan very soon.

Only advice: You should have told me that on N0. I would have agreed with that, but could have done more to give you better cover. Though I haven't really gathered how the lynch came back around to you after I was lynched. It seemed most believed MJW was scum and when he left the game somehow Meiz, zak and novice all thought one of the other two but not Goreripper is scum - and in the end all voted Goreripper.

[Jowy]

Zak did think GoreRipper was scum. Novice coming around at the end probably saved our asses, if Zak got lynched and I got killed next night, GoreRipper could have made it to the end.

[Rowain]

One comment about the town/scum ratio:

Since it started with a night the ratio was correct. 2 out of 10 (1 villager dead before day 1) . As said in the Lurkerthread Town having as many mislynches as there are scum is the right number. Having a third wolf would mean town has exactly 1 mislynch (which is usually used on D1) before being at LyLo.

What was unbalancing here is a) a true seer who removed 2 well possible mislynches (himself and Matt) and
b) MJW quitting removed another mislynch but without entering into night.


About the last day: Jowy thought Gore being scum. zak came to the conclusion since Meiz convinced him of his innocence which only left Gore.
But it wouldn't have mattered anyway: Once you think about it novice was highly unlikely to be scum which only leaves Meiz, zak, Gore to chose from = town had won it anyway.

[Serdoa]

Not to get in that town/scum ratio discussion again, but just to remind you:

If the other 16 are all villagers we need 6(!) mislynches to win (using our sacrifice doesn't change it). That's a lot of work to do.

That was a ratio of 16-4. Now we had 8-2. See the similarities? Yes we needed 3 mislynches with 2 scum and in WW26 we needed 6 with 4. We were both pretty upset about that when we started that game.

[Rowain]

Not to get in that town/scum ratio discussion again, but just to remind you:

If the other 16 are all villagers we need 6(!) mislynches to win (using our sacrifice doesn't change it). That's a lot of work to do.

That was a ratio of 16-4. Now we had 8-2. See the similarities? Yes we needed 3 mislynches with 2 scum and in WW26 we needed 6 with 4. We were both pretty upset about that when we started that game.

You fail to see the dissimilarity. In our game(26) the village had 1 more mislynch than scum existed (well not really but what we believed that time). In your game the village had as many mislynches as scum which is a good number. This things aren't multiplicative.
A setup where the village loses with the 2nd mislynch while there are 3 scum (that's what you and Gore are proposing) is blatantly unbalanced. Especially if you consider that usually a mislynch happens on D1.

Possible balanced setup for this game:

- 3 scum but no NK at Night0 Rough on the village but they have a chance thanks to Seer + Doctor. Although that also depends who got the PRs.

- 2 scum but no Seer.

[Meiz]

If debating between 2 or 3 scum, there's always the traitor (possessed) who works with wolves, but is counted as town and doesn't need to be lynched for town to win.

Another strenght of PR's is getting cleared by claiming. I'd be interested in trying a game where roles are not revealed on death, just the alignment. This gives a slight uncertainty for the claims and a chance for false claim gambits by wolves.

[Rowain]

If debating between 2 or 3 scum, there's always the traitor (possessed) who works with wolves, but is counted as town and doesn't need to be lynched for town to win.

I fear traitor might unbalance the game even more. For example D1 he claims to be the seer and scanned player x as scum at night 0. Risky yes but if he doesn't hit a real scum it will work great. (And anybody is free to guess whom I would call scum )

[Meiz]

That's something the town needs to bet on then :] Btw. usually the traitor even knows who wolves are and can talk with them. But you're right, that probably needs a bit more players to not be unbalanced.

[Serdoa]

Not to get in that town/scum ratio discussion again, but just to remind you:

If the other 16 are all villagers we need 6(!) mislynches to win (using our sacrifice doesn't change it). That's a lot of work to do.

That was a ratio of 16-4. Now we had 8-2. See the similarities? Yes we needed 3 mislynches with 2 scum and in WW26 we needed 6 with 4. We were both pretty upset about that when we started that game.

You fail to see the dissimilarity. In our game(26) the village had 1 more mislynch than scum existed (well not really but what we believed that time). In your game the village had as many mislynches as scum which is a good number. This things aren't multiplicative.
A setup where the village loses with the 2nd mislynch while there are 3 scum (that's what you and Gore are proposing) is blatantly unbalanced. Especially if you consider that usually a mislynch happens on D1.

Possible balanced setup for this game:

- 3 scum but no NK at Night0 Rough on the village but they have a chance thanks to Seer + Doctor. Although that also depends who got the PRs.

- 2 scum but no Seer.

Nah, I won't discuss that. We can go back and forth what should be changed in future setups (and I agree actually with the points you made for changes) but that won't change the fact that this game was unbalanced. That said, Goreripper and I didn't communicate well enough + I was not playing well so the town definitely deserved the win here, they showed good skills sniffing out the scum (and btw thanks to those explaining how they decided for me in that final run, that was good information).

So, before this devolves into a "uh, wolfs were so unfavored in this setup"-whining..

Congratulations to all town-players for a well played game and a deserved win. Was short but interesting - and incredibly civil, thanks for that as well

[zakalwe]

Thanks for that, Serdoa, and I don't think anyone doubts that you and Goreripper could have given us a real run for our money if the deck was less stacked against you.

I think I will remember the final showdown for a while; it was a pretty fun challenge to duke it out with Novice, Meiz, and Goreripper.