WW27 Game Thread: Once there were 12

[novice]

I assume the wife beating comment was because I came out fighting against the accusation?

Did you slip because you know that scum got some recompense?

No, that's not why I slipped.
Have you stopped beating your wife?

The wife question was because your question to me was an example of a loaded question, as is the wife question.

[Jowy]

Please clarify this. What would have led to two mislynches? Your reads? I don't mean to be snide, but I don't really get what you're saying.

Wolves voting for their scum buddy MJW will then naturally lead the suspicion to the three remaining players who voted for Mattimeo. We now know at least 2 of those were villagers, probably Azarius too, so perhaps even three. For someone who likes to talk about the natural flow of the game, it is surprising that you do not understand this argument.

What early game shenanigans? Also, picking three players and arguing that one of them is likely innocent is not a great way to prove that the other two are scum.

You and MJW distracting everyone. Novice's weak early game and sudden change when I brought it up. And I'm not trying to prove anything, simply sharing my thoughts. If I had proof of someone being a scum I would let everyone know loud and clear.

[novice]

Day 1 lynch:
Classical Hero (5): novice, Azarius, Zakalwe, MJW, Qgqqqqq
Mattimeo (3): Jkaen, Azza, Gazglum
Azza (1): Classical Hero
Jkaen (1): Serdoa
Zakalwe (1): Jowy
MJW (1): Mattimeo

Day 2 lynch:
MJW (5): Qgqqqq, Jkaen, novice, Zakalwe, Jowy
Mattimeo (4): Azarius, Azza, MJW, Gazglum
Azza (1): Mattimeo

Day 3 lynch:
Azza (4): novice, Mattimeo, Zakalwe, Gazglum
Gazglum (3): Jkaen, Jowy, Azarius
Zakalwe (1): Azza
Jowy (1): Qgqqqqq

unvote for the benefit of Mafia Helper

[Jowy]

Thought I should explain why I don't suspect Jkaen atm even though he was an MJW voter. He is in pretty much the same position as Azza was in my books. Their actions could fit for a scum, but they haven't really been caught doing anything scummy. So they aren't cleared, and could certainly be scum, but the odds are much lower because of the lack of scum tells. Speaking of Azza, I need to look over the votes. I find it really strange that Azza would get lynched before Gazglum. Gazglum was way scummier imo. Gotta check who voted for who and for what reasons, might give us a hint for today.

[Jkaen]

Speaking of Azza, I need to look over the votes. I find it really strange that Azza would get lynched before Gazglum. Gazglum was way scummier imo. Gotta check who voted for who and for what reasons, might give us a hint for today.

I find myself agreeing with Jowy. If we ignore feel and just look at actions, an Azza-Gazglum scum pair makes perfect sense, and we should lynch one of them.

If I add feel to the mix I wouldn't mind lynching Mattimeo, I don't think he's been very helpful this game.

Let's go Azza for now.

Why, Gaz already had a decent amount of votes, why would you throw the lynch into doubt by adding a third person into it

Related to that question, I am not sure I ever really got an answer to this.

[novice]

Speaking of Azza, I need to look over the votes. I find it really strange that Azza would get lynched before Gazglum. Gazglum was way scummier imo. Gotta check who voted for who and for what reasons, might give us a hint for today.

I find myself agreeing with Jowy. If we ignore feel and just look at actions, an Azza-Gazglum scum pair makes perfect sense, and we should lynch one of them.

If I add feel to the mix I wouldn't mind lynching Mattimeo, I don't think he's been very helpful this game.

Let's go Azza for now.

Why, Gaz already had a decent amount of votes, why would you throw the lynch into doubt by adding a third person into it

Related to that question, I am not sure I ever really got an answer to this.

I didn't mind throwing the Gazglum lynch into doubt, I was not at all sure that he was scum.

[novice]

I'll have little time for the rest of the day. Qgqqqqq can hold on to my vote.

[zakalwe]

I'm saying Jkaen/Jowy and Jowy/Mattimeo both make sense as scum pairs. I'm not saying you are scum with Mattimeo.

I see so due to the fact 2 of your likely pairings have Jowy as scum, and only 1 of them has me as scum, you are voting me...

This is a pretty silly retort. It's not like every possible scenario is equally likely. If Jowy is scum, I see two people who could easily be his scum partner. If you are scum, it is less clear who the other scum is. That doesn't mean Jowy is more likely than you to be scum. Although the main reason I chose to vote for you instead of him was that you already had two votes.

You are all assuming that the scum thought day 1 to keep MJW from going down. If I was scum I wouldn't touch that defense with a barge pole. You are asking for trouble defending somebody on day 1 who always run a high risk of getting lynched. plus day 1 swings all over the place anyway, why defend him as early as I did when there was always a good chance somebody would get bored and start a new train anyway.

Well, I was arguing earlier that the wolves may well have tried to do just that; keep cool, and wait for it to blow over. I don't buy the "I would never defend him" argument. I think you would, if you felt like that was what your village persona would have done. Knowing your usual play, it would certainly have looked odd to me if you went "yeah, that MJW guy is always a distraction, let's lynch him!"

To me, the thing that's suspect about your play is how you maneuvered yourself onto MJW early on day 2, after not suspecting him on day 1. You said "he keeps changing his story" which to me looked and still looks like a pretty unfounded generic accusation, as I couldn't see any inconsistencies in what he was arguing.

I've pretty much taken my town leans off of everyone who were on MJW, because it would have ultimately lead to two villager miss-lynches next.

Jowy - the reason I didn't understand your argument here, is that it didn't actually form a coherent sentence. I'm not questioning the idea that we should re-examine the MJW voters, if that's what you're trying to say.

Wolves voting for their scum buddy MJW will then naturally lead the suspicion to the three remaining players who voted for Mattimeo. We now know at least 2 of those were villagers, probably Azarius too, so perhaps even three. For someone who likes to talk about the natural flow of the game, it is surprising that you do not understand this argument.

Although, here it sounds like you should be looking for people who wanted us to focus exclusively on Azarius/Azza/Gazglum, not people who were voting for MJW at some point. Not necessarily the same set of people. Maybe you should strive for more clarity, and less sarcasm?

And for the third time, if you think the whole no lynch discussion was a distraction, then you certainly shouldn't blame me for it. You yourself contributed very much to that distraction.

[Jowy]

I've pretty much taken my town leans off of everyone who were on MJW, because it would have ultimately lead to two villager miss-lynches next.

Jowy - the reason I didn't understand your argument here, is that it didn't actually form a coherent sentence. I'm not questioning the idea that we should re-examine the MJW voters, if that's what you're trying to say.

Wolves voting for their scum buddy MJW will then naturally lead the suspicion to the three remaining players who voted for Mattimeo. We now know at least 2 of those were villagers, probably Azarius too, so perhaps even three. For someone who likes to talk about the natural flow of the game, it is surprising that you do not understand this argument.

Although, here it sounds like you should be looking for people who wanted us to focus exclusively on Azarius/Azza/Gazglum, not people who were voting for MJW at some point. Not necessarily the same set of people. Maybe you should strive for more clarity, and less sarcasm?

And for the third time, if you think the whole no lynch discussion was a distraction, then you certainly shouldn't blame me for it. You yourself contributed very much to that distraction.

What sarcasm? English is not my first language so this is all the clarity you get. You didn't have a problem with my English in the last two games. And I'm not blaming you for anything, I'm saying that either you and MJW planned to distract the village, or you got baited by MJW to distract the village. I'm not planning to blame people for bad play and then vote them off as revenge, I'm trying to catch wolves. It is a possibility that the distraction was planned because just last game we saw how valuable a distraction can be, and you're not the kind of person I would expect to get baited by wolves into being a distraction.

[Jowy]

NVM that, you DID have a huge problem with my broken English in WW25