RB Pitboss #1 SPOILER - Hatshepsut / India

[regoarrarr]

Email off to Broker

So I had a chat with shadyforce. One point that he made was something along the lines of that he was willing to sign a ceasefire with Elkad, even though it allows him (Elkad) time to recover and heal and loses the impetus with our tech advantage, and that you have a similar situation with Kodii.

I think that the preference would be for a ceasefire between you two, but I think I was able to get him to agree that if you fought Kodii, and the Lins agree to fight Exploit, that he (and he thought dsplaisted woudl agree too) would fight Exploit. We weren't sure if you and Kodii stayed at war, if the Lins would fight Exploit or if they would aid you against Kodii.

I think that your comment about cutting Kodii off from tech is a good one and I would be willing to do something along those lines. As I said in my earlier email - he is crippled and not going to be a factor, so whether or not you take him out now or in 20-40 turns, you're always going to be able to do so. After all, who is going to be in a better position to fight a war in 20 turns? Gotta figure your empire would be, right?

I should be around later tonight or tomorrow if your Internet comes back online

[regoarrarr]

Response from Kodii

There isn't really anything else I can offer him, although I had hoped he would just call it peace after he razed my capital.

However, if he does call it peace, it means he has made no gains on my territory, and that only Munro has made gains. Perhaps a counterproposal is that we call peace, turn against Munro, I give Urumqi to Broker and we split Munro's land?

[regoarrarr]

Chat with Broker trying to "broker" things between him and Kodii

Broker: greetings
Sent at 8:17 PM on Wednesday
me: hi
Sent at 8:21 PM on Wednesday
Broker: So whats been happening?
I tried to read emails but not exactly clear where we are
me: here's my understanding
kodii is hesitant to give up urumqi
he countered with the two of you turning on munro, and him giving you urumqi as part of that deal
dsp and shady are willing to work with you / us even if you are still at war with kodii
one thought i had is that you researched constitution
which is (by way of corp) a pre-req for infantry
so there's no way kodii can get infantry unless he researched const himself
or you give it to him
Broker: true
me: if you similarly research corp next (which seems like the logical thing to do, since i'm on rr)
that would make it even harder for him to ever get it
Broker: very true
My point with the war is I did alot of heavy lifting and have nothing to show for it. That does get tiresome
me: i understand
and i sympathize
but one point that shady made which i thought was good
was comparing your situation to the one he and dsp are in with elkad
Broker: I also hold no anomosity towards Kodi and it is not a forgone conclusion that I will destroy him if he conceeds
me: giving elkad (kodii) a break helps them
but shady is willing ot do that for the good of the team
now i know the situations aren't entirely the same
but i thought that they were close
Broker: I agree it does help them. Which is fine at this point since it allows us to focus on the real threat
me: right
same with you and kodii
Broker: I also am very close to being able to take urumke with some heavy losses
Daniel and Shady were stalled against elkad so it is not an exact mirror situation
I am fully capibable of pressing on and gaining more ground in this war
me: right
i know
what are your thoughts on working with kodii against munro / morgan?
if kodii included urumqi in that deal?
Broker: I would be willing to entertain a joint attack against them once exploit is dealt with
Sent at 8:29 PM on Wednesday
Broker: I am reluctant to sign a deal without knowing the landscape of things. I will consider the gift of urumki and the saving of troops lives favorably of course
me: what do you mea
n
Broker: Personally I would be more willing to work with Kodi than Munro nothing against Munro but Kodi is more managable. (not an insult)
me: ok
Broker: I am just reluctant to say. Yes I will stab Munro in the back now... Seems slimy to me if I am trying to get him in a dogpile and on the front lines
me: i understand
these types of things are never quite as clean as you'd like :-(
Broker: But I will say iit is a viable option after exploit is crippled and new lines are drawn
I would assume old groups wouldnt fall back in line.
me: that makes sense to me
so i guess at this point, the real question is are you willing to take a delayed handover of urumqi
Broker: There willl be different power brokers (no pun intended) trick is to stay near the lead
Sent at 8:33 PM on Wednesday
Broker: really a non starter for me righ now. But I would be willing to give Kodi some long term assuarances
me: like what
Broker: Well obviously saying I will attack munro is difficult because I just dont know how things will shake out. But I can say I wont attack Kodi
look at a map
me: how's this one
http://img163.imageshack.us/img163/8880/globeshot.jpg
from 40 turns ago
Broker: No I know the map. You know my borders if I dont attack Kodi ...
It was a wink
me: gotcha
Broker: Otherwise if I continue fighting I wont be much help with Exploit and I will end up destroying Kodi's ability to recover at all
me: so if we can't convince kodii
Broker: Oh and you question on Lins supporting me. I dont need it. I have been offering them troops
me: do you think the lins would be available to attack exploit with sunrise and i?
Broker: I dont know if they can with out some troops from me but I wont need any of thiers
Lins got the same impression of Exploit I did. They agree if we can effect a dog pile now is the time
me: yeah
it is
i just don't know that we can convince kodii
so what are we going to do if we can't
do we just let things ride and let exploit
win
?
Broker: Like I said a joint operation on Munro is very possible in the future I just wont put it in stone now
me: so what if you say that you won't give any techs to kodii until he gives you urumqi
and you turn on munro
Broker: You guys can go at him I will continue to fight Kodi and only provide teching support
me: somehow tie it up a little
i know you don't want to commit to anything set in stone right now
but would you be willing to agree to something along those lines?
Broker: I have troops in position right now
Tough pill to swallow and there would be no guarentee he gives it to me and it would just be tougher to take later
I really dont feel I am being unreasonable
I get his point but he has to understand it is a lost cause fighting me right now. Better to pay for peace then die
me: so are you willing to sign a longer term nap with kodii?
Broker: sure
I dont want to destroy him he is just forcing my hand. If I get what I want I will give him long term assurances
If he would have defended his capital instead of urumki I would have taken it and then asked for peace. I didnt expect him to leave capital open like that after all the fients towards it
me: yeah
Sent at 8:45 PM on Wednesday
me: okay well i'll see what i can do
i'm going to shoot for turning over urumqi with a longer term nap
with the idea of attacking munro in 10-20 turns once exploit is knocked around
Broker: If he looks at a map he should like who my next logical target would be once exploit is dealt with. I like the inland coast
me: meaning munro?
Broker: yeah
me: all right i gotta run
Broker: ok talk at you later
me: we need to figure out a plan for when we're going to do this (i.e. make it official / trade the techs / etc)
so work on that if you get some time
i'm emailing kodii
Sent at 8:48 PM on Wednesday
Broker: Ok I will try to come up with something
Sent at 8:51 PM on Wednesday

[regoarrarr]

And email to the folks

Okay - here is the synopsis of what I talked about with Broker.

His opinion was that he has the troops on the ground (or soon will) to take Urumqi by force if he has to. Now obviously I don't have any personal knowledge one way or the other if that is true. Kodii you'd be the closest, depending on your espionage resources. I will say that based on my dealings with Broker for the duration of this game, I have a pretty good confidence level that he is telling the truth on that, at least as far as what he believes.

He did say that if we were unable to come up with a deal between him and Kodii, that he still would support the anti-Exploit alliance tech-wise (of course, since he's getting the better end of that deal, at least for now). Also, the Lins also believe the time to dogpile Exploit is now, and would take part in the fighting on our side of the world rather than supporting Broker with troops.

He also mentioned that he would prefer to work with Kodii against Munro rather than the other (current) way around. He did not want to commit to an anti-Munro deal right now because he wants to focus on Exploit, but did mention several times that his preferred avenues of expansion are the inland coast where Munro is.

While he wouldn't commit to immediately jumping on Munro, he did say that he was willing to sign a longer-term NAP with Kodii as good faith that he wouldn't just restart your guys' war. But he wouldn't budge on Urumqi.

Kodii - since you were willing to cede Urumqi as part of Broker switching and attacking Munro with you, would you be willing to give it up now as a sort of downpayment? What would you want from him as good faith until the actual Munro war starts? What if he paid you some sort of gold / troops / other payment as "rent" for the lost commerce from Urumqi for the intervening turns? Something like that?

Hopefully we can get this all worked out in the next little bit as the game is going to get unpaused here probably later this evening

[regoarrarr]

A few things

Broker came up with a tentative framework

Operation Exploit

I will try to list actions.

Regoarrarr -- Continue teching RR and provide troops to attack Exploit and draw the bulk of his forces
Broker -- Switch to Corp immediatly after recieving missing techs and provide troops to Lins if Kodi accedes to peace terms. Otherwise contine war on Kodi alone.
DSP -- Provide troops to Munro/Morgan for the attack on Exploit and cease hostilities on Elkad. Continue teching to biology after Scientific Method.
Lins -- Prepare to attack Exploit and possibly finance techers (continue to steel if Kodi does not accede to peace terms)
Morgan/Munro cease hostilities on Kodi and Dsp and move troops to engage Exploit
Imhotep continue financing Broker and move to attack Exploit ( May not join have not heard from him)
Shady -- Provide troops to Morgan/Munro or to Regoarrarr as necessary.
Sunrise move to attack exploit and continue financing techers.
Kodi -- Acceed Urumki for peace or continue war with Broker. Peace will include some concessions for long term peace.
Elkad -- cease hostilities with Shady and Dsp and heal. Assist with troops or money or teching as it becomes possible.

Both groups would be brought up to date with techs with the possible exception of Broker and Kodi sharing if war is to continued.

Timing should be as soon as possible to prevent duplication and delay exploit in attaining infantry. Timing would also be dependant on the time necessary to move troops into position for munro, lins, sunrise. As I understand Regoarrarr already has troops in place.

Inclusion means an agreement to a 15 turn cool down period before hostilities can be initiated against any other member. Also any troops gifted in the battle against Exploit cannont be used against thier original owner and can be requested back after the battle is finished as part of the cool down period. Troops should be named to designate them. Also attacking members will treat gifted troops the same as thier own when in battle.


How is this for a framework?

Then got a message from Broker about Munro / Morgan.

Well just had a chat with Munro. While Morgan was receptive he isnt. In fact he is thinking of vasselizing to Explot for troop support. That does but a kink in the plans. What are your thoughts.

While that was going around, I got a message from Kodii, replying to my email from last night

If I can resettle the city he razed south of my capital (Cyanopsia), then I can agree to cede Urumqi.

Which I summarized back to Broker

Okay when you get back I think that makes things easier. You and Kodii sign peace and take out Munro on your way to Exploit. I got a message back from Kodii that if you are willing to let him resettle the site you razed south of his capital (Cyanopsia I think he said) that he could give up Urumqi.

I'll be around off and on today to firm things up. We may even be ready to seal things off before we pause so that you can swap off Steam before the turn rolls.

[regoarrarr]

A few diplo items

Email form exploit with additional terms. I am planning to decline

Hi Regoarrarr,

With time running out on the peace treaty between you and I, I decided to make one last attempt at peace. I have included Sunrise in this email since you said that negotiating a peace with him was a prerequisite to making peace with you. Sunrise described my peace proposal to him as "firm but fair". I am hoping that you will find my offer to you to be the same.

My offer is as follows:
- peace between you and I until minimum Turn 200
- peace automatically continues beyond Turn 200 but either side can cancel by giving 10 turn notice
- I will gift you 6 settlers which is sufficient to settle your entire northern border (it will take me a couple of turns to build the settlers but not many)
- on the same turn that I gift you the 6 settlers then you will gift me the cities of Sharonville, Evandale, and North Bend which will serve as our border
- I agree not to settle the areas directly north of your current borders

The net of this offer is that you will be up 3 cities and I will be up 3 cities so we both win. Your 3 existing cities have 1 wheat, 1 fish, 1 crab and 1 sheep (although my culture will take that shortly) within their borders. The cities on your northern border should have 1 corn, 4 fur, 2 sheep, 1 marble, 1 deer, 1 crab, 1 copper within their borders. With all the forests in the north those cities should be up and running with whatever infrastructure you desire in minimal time.

I believe my offer is fair but I await your response.

Regards,
Exploit

[regoarrarr]

Chat between sunrise and Exploit, pasting in here becuase Sunrise is a no-thread-updater

Exploit: Hi Sunrise. You got a minute to chat?
sunrise: sure
Exploit: It's Exploit by the way.
sunrise: is this krill or exploit?
ok, gotcha
Exploit: I haven't heard back from you soshould I assume the peace deal has been turned down?
I also wanted to know your intention for the worker in neutral land between you and I. Is he building a road or chopping the forest?
sunrise: the worker is not building a road
he will start chopping the forest next turn - i moved him in a turn early, but baring something unforseen those forests come into my culture next turn
Exploit: Hmm we seem to be fighting a culture war in that area since they would have fallen under my culture in 5 turns.
sunrise: perhaps you will take the tiles back...i'm not creative like most of the civs are, and I've not made cultural buildings aside from an initial chopped theater (only source of culture besides religion)
Exploit: As far as I am concerned, as long as the tiles fall under your culture when they are chopped then they belong to you. I just didn't want to see neutral forests in a contested area chopped.
sunrise: ok, i will make sure i dont chop any neutral forest
i alreadydiscussed chopping the forest hill your musket is on with regoarrarr, but we declined to try that because it would be dastardly
Exploit: lol! I probably would have considered that a hostile act and given warning to cease or prepare for war. Nice idea though.
So where do we stand on the peace deal?
sunrise: sadly, it doesn't appear I will be able to accept without a seperate regoarrarr peace, which does not seem forthcoming
I do think your terms were fair from your position, but I'd like to try to maintain some autonomy for a bit lonnger before submitting to being essentially a non-factor
Exploit: I'd love for you to maintain your autonomy but you are currently a critical factor in the game since it is your funding that is all that is keeping the other alliance alive. Unfortunately, that means my alliance has to take you out once the NAP expires. I wish there was something that I could offer to convince you to join our side.
You do realize that Rego is simply going to defend his own territory or attack me and do very little to help you survive, right? To be fair, I don't see there is much that he can do without leaving himself vulnerable.
sunrise: I certainly accept the possibility
I guess we just have a difference of opinion about the possibility for regoarrarr and I together to keep pace with your unit production
I don't mean to be full of bravado, but I suppose it's fair to say that I think I at least have a fighting chance
Exploit: Seems fair. We shall have to put our respective production estimates to the test then. You have been an honorable opponent thus far so I look forward to our battlefield encounters.
sunrise: well said
and perhaps either you or regoarrarr will be so sucessful in the next 17 turns or so that the point will become moot

[regoarrarr]

Email from dsp to sunrise, kodii, me and shady

Kodii says he's made peace with Broker, although I'm not sure exactly what the terms were. Have we agreed to bring him into the alliance? Does this include the Lins too?

He's currently researching Steam Power, so if we are going to bring him in we should get him to research something else.

Also, I need cash to keep researching at 100%. I've requested some from Kodii, Sunrise, and Rego, if you guys can spare it please log in and accept.

Sunrise, especially now that it seems like we've converted Broker, I don't think you should give any of your cash to Exploit. Does he have a NAP with you until turn 190 or is that just the Lins?

Then sunrise's reply

My chats suggest the Lins and Broker are on board. I also had a Exploit-initiated chat where he politely told me he planned to crush me come T191. Perhaps I will go out with a bang, but I won't be gifting any gold to him if this alliance can hold together.
My cash generating potential will fall as I draft my population away, however I can still sustain regoarrarr's research. Sorry DSP, but I won't be able to manage more than 50gpt over rego's needs.

[regoarrarr]

I thought it was time to upload my globe shot. Disclaimers are that I don't have everyone's latest maps, so it may be a bit out of date, and the borders are a bit tricky to draw, especially on water

Here is the one from T136


And here is the current one (T176), a nice round 40 turns later (totally because I planned it that way )

[regoarrarr]

Okay so while I was doing that, I thought I would try and assign everyone a real life country shape. I tried to go for ones with the right size where possible, but msotly was going on the shape, as I outlined in the pic above (though the disclaimers of it not being that accurate still hold)

http://kyleabaker.com/wp-content/uploads...-large.gif is the map I used.

regoarrarr - Brazil (it actually looks more like Brazil without all those signs)
shadyforce - Austria
dsplaisted - Pakistan
Exploit - Russia
Kodii - Belize
Imhotep - Guinea
Munro - Gabon
League of Lins - Germany (kind of a stretch but ya know)
sunrise089 - Ireland
Elkad - South Africa
Broker - Sudan (probably the biggest stretch - he was hard especially since he's cut in half in this pic)

Feel free to suggest better ones.