[Spoilers] Fintourist and Old Harry have nothing to see here

[Old Harry]

For setting up the iron city I want to road the forest hill NW of the iron instead of the hill - the forest might spread to the hill and that road will speed up a chop by a turn at some point. I think we'll then road the iron, and can settle on or next to it fairly easily. I still like settling to share the banana. We have a mountain range to protect this city from Yurimack, so m_h is our only real compettion over here, so I don't think it's vital to settle on the iron. So my vote is E of the iron, but I could be cajoled into S of the iron.


I'll log back in to offer m_h open borders (he played already so it won't be until next turn), while I'd like to explore m_h with BaII it may be better to bring him back to the new city. We should probably bring Flugauto back too. Once we have open borders with Ichabod and Slow should we cancel with m_h?

I won't give anyone promotions just yet and I'll leave building the scout in Dunkirk because if we built a chariot with a stable the GG medic would be 1 XP from an extra promotion, which could be morale...

Gallipoli is on 12 food now, working farm, sugar, banana this turn gives it +5:
eot100 +5 = 17/26 - farm, sugar, banana
eot101 +4 = 21/26 - farm, cot, banana (Cannae grows on sugar)
eot102 +6 = 27/26 - farm, sugar, banana (take sugar back from Cannae)
I think you're planning for Cannae to only work 1 scientist next turn and grow on the sugar, if not this might not work. After that I like the idea of putting 29 or 59 hammers into a worker and then whipping to overflow

Edit: Offered m_h open borders, changed tiles in Gallipoli and ended turn. Let me know what the plan for Cannae next turn is...

[Fintourist]

For setting up the iron city I want to road the forest hill NW of the iron instead of the hill - the forest might spread to the hill and that road will speed up a chop by a turn at some point. I think we'll then road the iron, and can settle on or next to it fairly easily. I still like settling to share the banana. We have a mountain range to protect this city from Yurimack, so m_h is our only real compettion over here, so I don't think it's vital to settle on the iron. So my vote is E of the iron, but I could be cajoled into S of the iron.

If we settle S of iron I agree that we shoud road Gallipoli-S-SW(forested hill)-SE(Iron).
If we settle E of iron we should road Gallipoli-SE(bananas)-SW(bare hill), because that allows us to settle the city 1 turn earlier. Settler will move during the T106 to Gallipoli and continue from there

- I like the eastern spot because it gets quicker start thanks to bananas and gets sugar in BFC. It's also less provocative if we conside m_h as a threat.
- However, I like S of iron spot, because it gets both dyes into our BFC and rice into first ring. It starts with less food, but the city placement helps in chaining irrigation to the rice tile once we have Civil Service. It also leaves open the opportunity to settle N of sugar later, which might be a reasonable jungle city as it can borrow bananas from Gallipoli. Of course the southen spot brings more ternsion between us and m_h even though BFC's don't overlap.
- The spot W of western dyes "x?" is possible with both settings although that makes the border area pretty cramped, if we go with southern spot we might consider W of that tile too. Anyways, that city can work the corn after we have taken the border city from m_h..
- Conclusion, undecided! 3 turns time to decide!

Once we have open borders with Ichabod and Slow should we cancel with m_h?

I don't think so. Slow has less cities than us, which means that open borders with those 2 is not enough yet. We might want to consider OB with dtay & TBS/Jowy also once we have Alphabet ourselves. Their island cities would bring us cash..

I won't give anyone promotions just yet and I'll leave building the scout in Dunkirk because if we built a chariot with a stable the GG medic would be 1 XP from an extra promotion, which could be morale...

Could our heroic Lunch become some kind of an amazing Woodsman III super medic? We probably don't want to bring him back though..

Gallipoli is on 12 food now, working farm, sugar, banana this turn gives it +5:
eot100 +5 = 17/26 - farm, sugar, banana
eot101 +4 = 21/26 - farm, cot, banana (Cannae grows on sugar)
eot102 +6 = 27/26 - farm, sugar, banana (take sugar back from Cannae)

I think you're planning for Cannae to only work 1 scientist next turn and grow on the sugar, if not this might not work. After that I like the idea of putting 29 or 59 hammers into a worker and then whipping to overflow [/quote]

I like the more food approach too! Let's go with that. Cannae needs to be working 2 scientist every turn from now until T115. Consequently it can't grow next turn yet, but it will need that improved sugar on T102 so that it can grow then.

Therefore let's do the following:
eot100 +5 = 17/26 - farm, sugar, banana
eot101 +5 = 22/26 - farm, sugar, banana
eot102 +4 = 26/26 - farm, cot, banana (improved sugar needed in Cannae)
Probably then this:
eot103 +6 = 19/28 - farm, cot, cot, improved banana
eot104 +0 = 19/28 - farm, cot, cot, improved banana ... worker 7/60
eot105 +0 = 19/28 - farm, cot, cot, improved banana ... worker 14/60
eot106 +0 = 19/24 - cot, improved banana ... worker 70/60 ... double-whip
eot107 +5 = 24/24 - cot, improved banana

Let's see if that overflow of 10 hammers is enough for making library double-whippable early enough or do we need to delay the whip by 1-turn. I just don't want us to stagnate too long when the city finally has a food resource that it can use for growing. Your thoughts?

[TheHumanHydra]

Thanks for the overview. I think we need more cottages. That's my only remark.

[Fintourist]

Thanks for the overview. I think we need more cottages. That's my only remark.

And we agree with you

From our core cities Cannae & Gallipoli will be dedicated commerce cities, BoP will help too.. Thanks to those silver pops I think we will also run bureaucracy at some point (not nearly as good as e.g. in PBEM45 we played) and we are probably going to cottage grassland tiles at Agincourt (or should we wait for workshops? I think not?) . Also our island sites and of course "the river valley" will have commerce production duties once those cities start growing. Improving various jungle dyes tiles will also help..

Btw, expansion in this game has been a huge challenge since that endless jungle makes our land extremely worker-intensive and at the same time we want to secure us a competitive amount of land, which requires settlers and military.. Case suttree is of course the best example so far:

Stretching to east this early, engaging early conflict that requires military builds, going barracks first in Hastings and even whipping it immediately after the city reached size 2.. They are all poor plays when we consider our short-term economy. But currently it looks likes that due to these actions we just took control of a very attractive area, which has room for 4 cities working ~20 riverside tiles. Well, time tells whether it turns out good or if we burn due to our greediness..

[Fintourist]

Just checked very quickly what suttree did. More or less nothing thankfully He has now 3 axes + 2 workers on that forest that we are "threatening" with Viqsi+Brick (axe+bow). If we want to continue being annoying we can move more units onto that tile and see whether suttree has balls to chop that forest and at the same time his tile defense bonus..

Of course there is a slight chance that this is a trap and he wants us to move units there so that he can road the forest and kill our troops with some kind of an enormous force.. Unlikely though..

So what to do next turn.. To be annoying or not to be annoying..

a) retreat
b) add maybe one bowman (Ceil?) and stay put
c) add ~3 units so that we seriously threaten to wipe his units if he chops the forest..

If we select b) or c) we can push our luck and take a ~80-85 % battle with our C2 Shock Viqsi-Axe if suttree chops that forest..

[Old Harry]

d) Offer peace?

Ten turns to consolidate the area and pop borders without worrying would be pretty useful. I think Jamestown could be a commerce city too - so would 2-pop whipping a library there on t111 and popping borders t116 be too late?

A savestack through to t116. Probably a lot of room for improvement...

We can build markets now, but I thought we'd wait until Org Rel before putting them in Agincourt and Cannae. Anywhere else? Agincourt could work merchants and Cannae just produce scientists?

[Fintourist]

d) Offer peace?

Yeah, let's do that.. Once again.. Although we have to do something (a-c or e?) before that..

I think Jamestown could be a commerce city too - so would 2-pop whipping a library there on t111 and popping borders t116 be too late?

It also has 5 grassland hills so it could also be our best production site.. Along with working dyes and couple of riverside towns.. So barracks won't be useless there either if that's your worry. I don't have yet a strong opinion though! We could build an exploring galley or WB there pretty soon too.

A savestack through to t116. Probably a lot of room for improvement...

Nice! I have played now twice until T115 so I also have ideas what we could do. I won'treally have time to look at it before Saturday though. I'm spending too much time with civ... It's 3.30 AM in Finland and I just finished my model that I have to present tomorrow 9 AM to the CEO & CFO of one of my firm's portfolio companies.

But yeah, I'll have time in the afternoon for commenting the next turn at least!

We can build markets now, but I thought we'd wait until Org Rel before putting them in Agincourt and Cannae. Anywhere else? Agincourt could work merchants and Cannae just produce scientists?

Probably too expensive for now! Starting market in Cannae would not be terrible though, but the city does not really have production to finish it any time soon. Later maybe Gallipoli and our cities at the river valley..

[Old Harry]

Turn 101

Looks like Pindicooter got the pyramids. They are fin/org, so does that sound likely? The island of france is a lot bigger than we thought, and here is another candidate to get Lord Parkin to Woody II...


On the war front we could add Ceiliazul and THH to our threatening force. Promo-healing THH to CII gives him 82 Hit Points and a 62% chance against an axe on flat ground, giving Ceil Shock gives him 96 HP and a 68% chance.. Meanwhile with CII Viqsi gets 90% odds and BRick gets 31% odds. If we're going all out to steal the two workers we might as well add Mero (who would heal to 63 HP and get 12% against an uninjured axe.) So I think we should move all of them down and offer peace again (for world map this time?) Meanwhile Yossarian can't get around TBS, so he's coming home to help out and one of the workers has moved to the hill east of Jamestown to chop (then mine). The other will put a turn into a cottage SE of Jamestown, then move to do the corn unless you think that's a bit risky and he should chop on the other hill?


Down south m_h rejected our open borders offer, either he's already got foreign trade routes (Ichabod?) or he just doesn't like us... I moved BaII away and we can re-offer. Going here should barb-bust, but won't give warning of an m_h attack (although the power graph will). In my sim I tried settling "another x" and it felt painfully slow to start, will try the x? next time. I also decided to risk moving Flugauto to uncover Suttree's banana city. He'll move back next turn.


Up north I followed your sign to build a cottage for Issy, I had him chopping forest into a lighthouse for France, then cottaging the river, but another tile for I is good. France grows onto the whale next turn.


Power - the fall is disapointing...


Demos

I haven't ended turn pending decision on moving everything against Suttree's workers and offering peace... I sent another open borders request to m_h though.

Hope the presentation went well!

[Fintourist]

Harry, don't be so hasty with micro! Why did you stop improving our sugar at Cannae... Now it will improved 3 turns later, and we get bananas 1 turn later improved too. Now we have to choose whether we grow Cannae or Gallipoli eot102, we can't manage both anymore without delaying philo bulb!

Also the worker micro at Isandlwana and Endor could have been done differently.. Damn you!

EDIT: I mean come on! We have 2 workers on a sugar tile with 2/5 plantation done and you move one of them to chop jungle for another sugar resource and the other one to complete a road?

[Old Harry]

Argh! I'm just not used to ending worker actions every turn, I keep assuming things are done... and I've been playing the later turns in the sandbox so I'd got t102 in my head