[SPOILERS] The Kaiser Strikes back! A Bigger Germany is better

[Mardoc]

me: seems like a silly question - but what happens if you leave a neutral center in the fall
does it still remain under your influence? (count for building units)
Sent at 4:16 PM on Saturday
me: i.e. France moves A POR -> SPA in F1902, leaving POR uncovered
does POR count as one of his centers?

Once you take a SC, it's yours until someone else takes it from you, whether you have units there or not. SC only change ownership after the Fall moves.

So, yes, France can do whatever he wants with his army, he'll own POR and it'll count for a unit until/unless someone else puts a unit there through a fall turn.

[waterbat]

Thanks again, Mardoc! You're doing a great job! From an outsider's perspective, how's the game going so far? Would you say its been interesting for the lurkers?

[Mardoc]

From an outsider's perspective, how's the game going so far? Would you say its been interesting for the lurkers?

Well, it's hard to say, for two reasons. First, it's only just beginning, and got off to a slow start due to the timing. Not a lot has actually happened so far. But second, you're one of the best updated threads, it's hard to actually know what's going on in the rest of Europe. I've enjoyed your thread, anyway; keep it up!

[waterbat]

we'll try. We're putting everything out there - i hope this game doesnt generate too much bad blood. Other teams can get off easy by not reporting all their scheming

Anyway ! I think letting Russia take SWE was actually very fortuitous. Now that they look so strong with 6 centers, it may be easier to get Turkey to help Austria push Russia out of RUM.

Its almost guarenteed that they will lose it this spring. Turkey gets the black sea without issue, Austria gets a fifth center. Also a Russian fleet is destroyed. At first I kept thinking that the unit it RUM would retreat into GAL -- maybe the fleet sailed up the Danube. - it is the Danube there, right?

Here's the worst case scenario:



Then in fall they can remove RUM with support from BLA. Most likely it won't be the worst case scenario - Russia will end up making a move on GAL or trying to hold BLA. Either way, a center will switch hands.

We should wait for the builds, but do you want to propose this to Tatan ? or maybe put the idea in Mattimeo's hands? I think having Tatan propose it is best.

As for the West - I found another great reason we traded SWE for no build in STP. I believe we can now force Rowain's hand to help us in NOR.

We propose Rowain take NOR and we take SWE like this:


We can switch back in 1903 if he wishes.

If he refuses:


This lets France do something different than trying to cut support in NTH. They can even convoy to the british isles.

Of course, we can't just strongarm him or he'll get English help. Its going to be obvious we can raid SWE - so he might obtain english assistance anyway. If we suspect English support from NOR, we can also support with DEN and be guarenteed to gain SWE. If we end up bouncing up there, it won't be the end of the world - we'll get our Fleet build in KIE and can continue in 1903. The downside is that the conflict will be out in the open, and most likely we'll have put England and Russia together.

Also - I think France would be very happy if we opened up this front - it just lets them coast even more.

[waterbat]

oh - i sent out a quick message to scooter from my phone pointing out that he couldnt help us into NTH in the fall as he said. Maybe he had some other idea about that and I am missing something.

Scooter,
im looking at the tactics involved in spring/fall. You said you could easily support us into nth in the fall, but we won't have more than 1 fleet in position. Our newly minted F BER will take 2 moves to get in position.

Do you have some ideas on speeding up this process? Our alternative is to try the quicker assault in Norway, but that's not a guaranteed result either.

Thanks,
waterbat.

[rho21]

his option was to move to SER, bounce, and then retreat SER. getting the same position he has now with much less risk.

You can't retreat to a territory where a bounce has occurred that season (whether or not your unit was involved in the bounce). Moving to Ser was still a good idea though, as that would have limited Turkey to one build if they'd decided to go there themselves (probably why they didn't).

[waterbat]

Doh! Thanks so much rho! This makes much more sense. I really should reread the rule book - apparently missed a few dozen major gameplay aspects.

Hmmm. Turkey and Russia both mentioning keeping Tt in the game. I was just really neutral from a game perspective - just trying to be helpful to TT.

[waterbat]

uh oh - Molach making orders for Tasunke. Being only build orders, we can assume that these were made without any kind of diplo.

[waterbat]

i got 10 out of 11 build right , i demand a sticker! Since not perfect, no gold star. perhaps a bear holding a sign with "GREAT" written on it.

Anyway, Rowain built an army in SEV instead of a fleet. So... he has conceded the black sea. That's not so good for Austria, but since Turkey would get the black sea anyway, it doesnt change too much.

It seems so easier to find moves for Austria. I would fire off a note to tatan encouraging him to lobby mattimeo hard on supporting him into RUM twice. in spring, and if bounced, in fall with F BLA -> SEV to cut off support.

He has other moves, of course, but that course of action seems the most straightforward.



hmm.. should we wait until spring moves are finished to talk to rowain?
If we move F BER->BAL and F DEN->SKA, he might see that as threatening. <shrug> im going to look at some different scenarios that involve F BER->KIE - this move centers around the idea we should be content to gain 0 centers this year in exchange for more pressure on Britain in 1903.

Also - every time i look at the board i wonder why we aren't moving on france. historical bias? we move A KIE->RUH and A MUN->BUR and get Italy to move into PIE - it would look nasty

[waterbat]

i really don't like the look of F BER->KIE setups.

Here's an example of what could happen in fall:



We lose a fleet unless we order it to move to SWE and support from DEN, escalating into a shooting war with Rowain. Not only the loss of a fleet, but now england can convoy with support into DEN in spring 1903.

To avoid this, we'd have a similar situation as the F BER->BAL option - we'd force Rowain's hand - either support us with F S SWE SKA hold or we'll take sweden.

I think the nail in the coffin for F BER->KIE is that even if we get Rowain's support and move F KIE->HOL in the fall, we still won't be able to force England out of NTH unless we again get Rowain to cut support from NWY. (assuming england support NTH hold with LON and NWY). That bit in the Sealion opening about getting Russia on-board (to bounce in Norway in s1901) or abandon it is ringing in my ears

You know, If England does this same move combination in the F BER->BAL setup (with A MUN->BER), we would be screwed as well. If we are supporting Rowain into NWY (for the trade SWE for NWY), the support gets cut, our fleet gets destroyed, Rowain bounces. However! Our convoy into SWE would succeed with support from DEN. This would net us SWE and Rowain would get nothing. We wouldnt get blamed directly , but it might be hard to explain why we supported into SWE if we expected NWY attack to succeed though