Nudist Progression

[KingOfPain]

No problem.

Not that I mind to be slapped with an iron trout if my plans don't work out, or that I would taunt someone if their's don't. It is always good to try different approaches if there is a chance they may work. Afterall, that is what set the RB apart from the mainstream.

If you will remember Nolani, I have tried the front door approach many time myself with success, but I kept quiet and let the team decide how to go about it. We tried the front door and failed 3 times before the team finally pulled together and won. If we didn't give that a chance, some of us would not have known it would work (and for a bunch of Noods) and missed out on one good game we had that night.

So all I asked and expected was the same courtesy we extended to you (when you pushed for the Nolani front door), and not run off like you did last night ;p

Anyway, I ran the mission with Half Moons right after, to see if the mission can still be worked that way. The first screen shows the village was cleared (no red dots on the radar) before I triggered Ben (by entering the village hugging left). The second screen is of Ben triggering the bonus.







KoP

[Lurker Wyrm]

From the perspective of someone that was completely out of it last night and had no clue about what was going on, it would be nice if we could decide things like this outside combat. All I really remember was some people saying left, some saying go straight for Benji, a lot of lines being drawn on the compass, Drasca running too far ahead (as per usual), KoP quitting, Zedf saying... something, and Hawk and Fox just sitting back and laughing at everything going on. If we're going to try something different from the "standard" method of doing the mission, it'd help to give a brief briefing before we reach a critical point in the mission (i.e. before we go across the bridge that leads to the village).

[FoxBat]

Well I tried this out once, and it worked ok for me. I drew the mesmer boss.

Once anyone in the party can "see" benji (on minimap or by holding down alt), it seems then that he starts fighting with whatever boss, and at that point you should run in and help him.

Of course the real fun for us nudists began once we had to defend the rotund confessor, with the undead sorcerers setting off 3 earthquakes on all of us at once. Me and drasca did discuss some actual two-monk healer teaming, maybe even bonding everyone in the party.... although there's another possibility we could exploit.

When you go on the bonus track, theres the offering pot that someone needs to pick up. Well just like holding a gear or a text, this person is going to have an unusual propensity for drawing aggro. Have said urn-tank keep a little distance from everyone else (or at most one other bonded melee attacker) to keep safe from the earthquake, and this should be relatively easy, as I (and maybe drasca) can bond and spam heals with balthazars on us. But note that the urn cannot be dropped or it shatters and reappears all the way back at the spawn point: this also means that you can't let the tank die (although that's generally not a good idea anyway)

One issue is our tanks have tended to rely on attacking to build adrenaline for bonettis, and this isn't an option while holding the urn. Maybe balthazar's spirit could help here, though who knows if it would be enough. Might consider some kind of armor or anti-ele stuff if avaliable to help survive earthquakes.

Of course, you will run into similar 3-sorcerer teams on the way to the bonus track itself... although hopefully we can manage aggro better there when we are allowed to take our time. I'm not sure if it was team member's fault or just the inherient difficulty of the monsters, but I felt I needed to be healing the non-tanks too often on that mission, especially the poison from the archers.

[KingOfPain]

The method was discussed after our first attempt the normal way and got party wiped. I would have reiterated what we were trying for, but I thought you knew what we talked about when you said you were with Drasca.

KoP

[Lurker Wyrm]

The method was discussed after our first attempt the normal way and got party wiped.

Don't forget I showed up late and didn't join the team until about 5 seconds before we went back into the mission.

I would have reiterated what we were trying for, but I thought you knew what we talked about when you said you were with Drasca.

Nope, all I heard was something along the lines of:
Drasca: let's go get Benji.
KoP or Zedf (don't remember who said it): No, hang left and go around.
Drasca: I see Benji, he's alive.
Drasca: Not anymore.
My siding with Drasca was more of a "let's go for the bonus" thing.

[Drasca]

I chalk up the loss as 'late and confused'. I'm not sure if wyrm was briefed on the plan either.

Also, I'd forgotten the tidbit that you must clear the village for the normal gate to open. However, the other gate-guard, the one towards the bonus, I believe only requires benji to be alive because he's Benji's brother.

Benji himself died to the warrior boss within two strikes. We'll probably want reversal of fortune, or whatever trainer only, but local boss cappable skills nearby to aid us.

[Zed-F]

How long Benji lasts depends heavily on what boss he draws to fight. If it's the warrior (executioner) boss, he goes down fast. IIRC he goes down quickly versus the elementalist boss as well. Most of the others he can survive a while against, and IIRC he can survive indefinitely against the monk or necro bosses. They can't damage him faster than he can signet.

[Hawkmoon]

Hey, this is some pretty constructive posting!
I haven't run any of the missions enough to feel like I know them very well, so I'm learning quite a bit from your comments here. My vote for next session would be to follow KoP's plan, hugging the left religiously as we enter the village, and try to equal Half Moon's success.
For the bonus portion of the mission, and the comment about the urn-holder drawing aggro, I would volunteer Arty to carry it. I can cast spells without a weapon, and I can load up on defensive Earth skills - armor of Earth, Magnetic Aura, and a couple of Wards. I may not do very much damage on this mission, but Arty should be able to survive being the "center of attention" with a Lifebond on him, and you guys dealing damage from a distance. How does that sound?

Cheers,
Hawkmoon

P.S. I don't know how FoxBat felt about it, but during the debacle the other night after KoP left, I wasn't laughing - I was shaking my head over the ridiculous infighting (how old are we, exactly?) on the team, and trying to do my part to make the best of a bad situation. The humor of it all was somewhat redeemed when we got hammered by those three simultaneous Earthquakes...

[KingOfPain]

I haven't repeated most missions enough to know them "well" either. I know the earlier missions better because I mostly solo henched them trying to learn and catch up to the rest of the RBers. There is much to be said by going solo, such as little tricks you would learn; the immersion factor is much higher too since you spend as much time as you want and in control of the pace and have to figure out where to go and what to do.

The normal way of doing the bonus (carrying the urn and fight) is actually easier for a normal team with a dura-tank and an energizer-monky. This is the same as the aggro-grabbing-item trick so abused in FOW with the Unholy Text. However, this is the hard way for us noods. I would always want to take the path with more challenging when we have the time, at least give it a try, so I will go with that.

The easier alternative is to clear the path to the destination first, then run back and grab the urn. This method is somewhat cheesy in my book but generally accepted because of some of the high end PvE area "requiring" such tactics.

My finally fantasy is to get a UW/FoW team together and take the quests as they come instead of always clearing the area first before taking the quests. I can dream...

KoP

[Seijin]

The tank/item holding method works if you have a tank that for sure can endure a lot of punishment or have enough buffs on him so that its like the enemy is throwing stones at a mountain. Without armor, he's gonna need a lot of buffs. Not to mention he has to GRAB aggro, so he can't just sit away from the party and just use something like dolyak signet, he'll have to move if enemies are coming from both sides. Otherwise the party will just get flanked from one side. I learned this quite well in SF, being the tank and having to move around to get the enemies attention away from the party. If you want the tank to take the EQ's instead of the party, he'll have to make sure to aggro the socerers before they aggro any of the rest of the party and start to cast EQ on them.

The whole benji bonus, I'm sorry I missed that, but I probably would have been laughing like crazy if I saw the team split and get frustrated and/or wiped. With the nudes, I'd probably always try the safest route possible to try and control what is or isn't aggroed. Even if benji is saved, I think he runs towards the action eventually, which will put the whole party into a group of undead.

The thing with the archers and poison, and anything that uses conditions or hexes that are easy to spread, they will spread them to some extent. So if non-tanks are getting hit with poison, its not really their fault. The archers will shoot poison arrows at anything within their range, or anything attacking it. In short fights, you don't see this too often because the archer might hit 1-2 people, then the team kills it.