Varn of the Illians - Serdoa and WK playing it cool

[Serdoa]

After my tests tomorrow, we can get the priests 4 turns early -> EOT 51.

I am pretty sure that there is no gold resource nearby but that we do have another neighbour. I am even sure that that neighbour is 5+ tiles nearer to us then the Sidar. I'll post an overview pic next time to show better how the land looks like and stuff.

[Serdoa]

T20 Calendar was finished end of last turn and so we first did our civic swap:



Yes, not only to Agrarianism but also away from Nationhood. Why Religion? I don't have popped a Savant or something similar, it is solely because the +10% on Nationhood don't work in our favor right now. We produce at most 5 hammers, so we never get the +10% on our production. But when we have overflow from a warrior, we do lose out on production as the game does take the overflow and divides it by 1.1. Till now my preferred city-configuration did finish every warrior at 16 hammers (and Calendar at 160 of 160 beakers, yeah micromanagement) but now that would no longer be the case as we will finish next turn a warrior with 4 overflow (before we popped Ancient Chants, that overflow was necessary to get the settler in time to get the second city up soon enough to get the planation online to get enough beakers to get Philo finished at exactly 300 of 300 beakers).

Anyway, everything changed with that tech-pop and I am happy that I have invested the time to build myself a now already half-automatic excel-table in which I only need to plug in numbers for the worked tiles and it does calculate for me how long my next tech will take, my next build and so on. Still some work to do (and obviously I have a hard time with calculations for further cities and their maintenance) but still kinda nice when you just change that one worked tile from 4 (farmed, aristo floodplains) to 15 (plains forest) and can see immediately the difference it will make. Otherwise I think I'd have already given up to micromanage so excessively as it is imo a pita to find that one hammer and 2 commerce needed when you have to always play 50 turns in the sandbox (and remember what you did and when...).

Ok, enough of me praising my own work, on to what you probably want to see, overview of the world

Oh, and while searching for the shortcuts and what you have to write in the ini to get that flying satellite camera going, I found another shortcut I didn't know of which ... well, see for yourself

Yes, if you hit Ctrl+B you won't see any units and stuff. Thats meant to make the map itself easier viewable I guess. Interestingly you'll get to see ALL unique feature names. Letum Frigus is nearby, though in the middle of the inner sea. Not easy to reach - but hey, I popped Fishing. Somebody can say "Octupus Overlords"?

Only thing, I seem to remember that Letum Frigus will give me the Aggressive trait but only till I switch my traits around - is that right? If so I'd probably should wait to T70 (I should be able to get OO till then... maybe) before I go for it.

[WarriorKnight]

Interesting way to find Unique features. I couldn't recreate it, but I wasn't playing around with ini so maybe that's the answer.

Still think OO early is a mistake though, even with free fishing and Letum Frigus across the ocean. When are you going to focus on economy? OO doesn't help that much (only gives culture, but your creative to start with anyway). IMO, after Philo going for RoK or CoL is a better idea so you don't completely stall the economy while conquering (CoL is safer since Clan like RoK and with Kandros may beat you there with your tech path). OO is better later on once you have the techs for Stygians, Cultists, Hemah etc.

And yes, Adaptive wipes out the free AGG trait (haven't tested it, but it makes sense), but 75 turns is a very long time. Maybe getting Sailing at some point and build a Trireme to sail a unit there is better economically than sending a Drown? (exploring it at say t100 would still give you plenty of time to abuse AGG, assuming of course that there's no-one over there that wants to take the bonus from you).

[Serdoa]

Hm, Ctrl+B worked for me even before I edited the ini. You do have to scroll out completely though, till the clouds start to appear. Before it won't work.

As for OO: You are right that we need something for the economy as well. But you are also right that there might be someone over there to take the bonus away. And I think that bonus would be helpful. So, basically I have to find out what is cheaper:

a) research Sailing -> settle on the coast (probably 1NW or 1NW,1N of where my warrior is in the last picture) -> build a trireme (not galley, I have no clue of FFH2-water-units?)-> get the bonus

b) research OO -> get a OO-temple -> build a Drown (I think you need temples for that right?)

The first approach should be cheaper in terms of beakers, but costs more in terms of hammers (though that spot seems at least decent, so it is debatable if the costs for the settler should be calculated when comparing). Thinking about it, I am not even sure if Sailing would not be overall the better approach. I have to invest more time to think about this.

[Serdoa]

Different topic: I checked score points for the last turns. They have evolved as follows (always points and in brackets the turn they got them)

Krill: 49 (17) -> 61 (20) -> 77 (22)
Sar: 38 (5) -> 61 (20) -> 77 (22)
Ame: 38 (4) -> 50 (20) -> 61 (21) -> 77 (22)
SL: 55 (5) -> 67 (21)
Mist: 38 (4) -> 50 (20) -> 77 (21) -> 82 (22)

Now I tried to decode that. For that I want to point to my PBEM7 thread and the tremendous work SilentConfusion did when he explained to me how the score-system works. The post is easily found via the table of contents in the 2nd post.

Using this knowledge I could calculate that

- every pop point is worth 5000/991 = 5 points (till the 23 which is worth 6)
- every land point is worth 2000/1473 = 1.357; 9 are 12 points, 21 are 28 points
- every wonder is worth 5000/290 = 17 points (except the 5th, 9th, 13th, ... which are worth 18 each)
- every tech is worth 2000/179 = 11 points (except the 6th, 12th, 18th, 24th, ... which are worth 12 each)

Again, I couldn't do this without SilentConfusions posting back then. Many, many thanks to you, even that I haven't seen you for a long, long time :/

Back to decoding:

Krill: 17 (wonders), 28 (Land), 22 (2 Techs), 10 (2 Pop)
Sar: see Krill
Ame: see Krill
SL: 17 (wonders), 12 (Land), 33 (3 Techs), 5 (1 Pop)
Mist: 17 (wonders), 28 (Land), 22 (2 Techs), 15 (3 Pop)

If I got everything right, then SL and Krill are the only ones not getting a tech since we are out of Stasis. Krill is researching something with a pre-req (Masonry?), so I am not wondering about that. SL though is researching something without pre-req, so I guess he is going for Crafting. Wonder what techs he popped then?

Oh well, I try to make soon an overview of the techs I guess my opponents have right now. And I can show the updated C&D-table if anyone is interested in it.

[Serdoa]

T21: The goblin you can see in the overview shot on T20 (NE of the wheat) moved onto the wheat as expected. Thats why I recalled the warrior I had moving down south back to the cap. Because I NEED that wheat. Without it all my plans are going to crumble (we grow a turn later, finish the settler a turn later, work the plantation in city 2 a turn later and miss out on Philosophy on T39 by 2 beakers...). So I attacked with the first warrior that goblin. Odds were exactly 50%



And we are victorious, earning our warrior 6 XP in the process. Those will be invested to make him C1, S1. That is not going to help against Barbarian units all that much, but I would rather be better prepared for a player trying to choke us then for barbarians (and god do I hope I won't eat this words in the next few turns...).

Apart from that, nothing special happened. EOT saw us growing to size 6, finishing another warrior. But I somehow am pretty sure that everyone already saw stuff like that happening, so I don't feel screenies of it are necessary (and yes, I am aware of the fact that probably everyone saw already a warrior winning against a goblin as well )

T22: We started our settler. We have currently 4 warriors and 1 scout. 2 of those warriors defending the city, 2 being out scouting, but nearby to be recalled on short notice. The scout itself is still making its way back home with the Timor Mask and I am dieing a thousand deaths every time I open the save, trying hecticly to scroll to him to make sure he is still alive and well.

T23: Again nothing happened. A goblin is 1NE of the cap, but 2 warriors are defending it. Also it is on a hill, so we look at a ca. 5.4 vs 3 str fight - I hope we'll win.

I also spotted a Spectre west of the capital on the mana node. I had hoped those had made their way to Mist but it seems at least one of them is here to play. It can reach my lands in 2 turns, potentially getting in a position to kill my worker. Lets hope it moves differently, because I have only two warriors which can move onto the tile the worker will farm in time and that would leave the cap undefended and therefore with 1 unhappy citizen. And we all know by now what happens if my spreadsheet isn't followed by the letter

[Serdoa]

And to add to the work 1 post above the last, here are the scores of T23



Increases of 16 for SL = Land points. He settled only on the second turn of the game (T1) so he also got his land points for getting to 21 land tiles 1 turn later

Increases of 11 for Krill = Tech. Due to Stasis I am unsure of how many beakers he really has accumulated, but he got the tech EOT22, so that means 23 turns of play. 14 of those turns should have been Stasis, that leaves 9 turns of GNP. His GNP started with 14, 2 of that being culture means 12 beakers a turn. That was for 4 turns. Then he had 1 turn with 15, again 2 for culture means 13 beakers. After that Stasis hit. Till T19 (being the real 20th turn of the game, because of T0 at the start). He accumulated again beakers for 4 turns, each turn 13 beakers. That gives

4 x 12 = 48
5 x 13 = 65
--------------
113 beakers

He is researching something with a pre-req and nothing is cheap enough for that. So I guess he got an event giving him extra beakers towards the tech he researches. And even for the cheapest tech, Masonry, he needed to get 27 additional beakers. Thats already quite some for this stage of the game, so I am pretty sure on him getting Masonry.

[Serdoa]

Well 4 days later, we have played 2 turns :/

T24: Nothing of importance happened except that



Only 20 turns later then Krill got his

Oh, also a Goblin sits next to our capital. Hopefully he attacks into the city.

T25: Remember the goblin? Well, that peep of a peep moved onto the wheat tile.



I am pretty sure he is not there to attack NOW into the city, but to pillage. So, I attacked with my warrior and lost (anticipated as I used the one without promotions at 50% odds as the one with promos had also only 73% odds and I'd rather keep a warrior with C1,S1). So, I am down a warrior. I also have one unhappy in the cap as my warrior sits on the wheat. I will move back and should neither lose turns on the settler nor on the PoWs. But there is another goblin on the way and my other warriors are out scouting. I might have to change the build to a warrior, though I am not sure if I can even finish it soon enough... maybe that will be a short game after all. (And no, I don't see me sitting with my warrior in my capital and wait for the goblin to pillage me to death...)

[DaveV]

I am pretty sure he is not there to attack NOW into the city, but to pillage. So, I attacked with my warrior and lost (anticipated as I used the one without promotions at 50% odds as the one with promos had also only 73% odds and I'd rather keep a warrior with C1,S1). So, I am down a warrior. I also have one unhappy in the cap as my warrior sits on the wheat. I will move back and should neither lose turns on the settler nor on the PoWs. But there is another goblin on the way and my other warriors are out scouting. I might have to change the build to a warrior, though I am not sure if I can even finish it soon enough... maybe that will be a short game after all. (And no, I don't see me sitting with my warrior in my capital and wait for the goblin to pillage me to death...)

Goblins can't pillage. Likewise for skeletons and lizardmen.

[mackoti]

I didn't know that either....I am so good at FFH