Adv 53 - Alpine Rocket

[Swiss Pauli]

A quiet, builder era saw Taoism founded in Kumbeh in 100AD and also, I now realize, some major in AD 275 I settled a GS in Timbuktu. Although Kumbeh was only producing 27 bpt in 1AD, it was only just starting to develop its cottages. An Academy here would have been by far the better play. I don’t think I even checked my cities before settling him which I think cost me at least 1000 beakers, possibly nearer 2000, over the course of the game

Ramy requested I turn Hindu on T127 so I complied for the relations boost though I planned to switch out again five turns later. This also prompted me to check for WHEOOH each turn with J & Toku and, just as I switched out of Hinduism, I got a hit:



War was declared just two turns later:


A typical closed-borders-rage-DoW rather than the more serious Stack of Doom variety. This shouldn’t be a major problem, but for the fact that I still hadn’t connected my copper. The worker detailed to do would take 3 more turns, so I simply had to get Ramy’s spare iron even though it cost me horses, ivory, banana and deer because the variant rules forbid me to pay cash

Toku dribbled another sword/chariot pair out of Sakae (and towards his own cities!), but I was whipping and chopping an army out of my eastern cities that would destroy these units and claim Sakae for Mali (losing only one unlucky Maceman and a catapult). By this point, Toku was marching a siege stack towards Awdaghost, so it was time to make peace, snagging his world map as part of the settlement:



During the Japanese War of Disgruntlement, Astronomy and Sci Meth were learned, but I did lose the Mausoleum to Hannibal A Hindu Apostolic Palace was built so I made it my religion and switched to Caste System and Pacifism to get the Great Scientists rolling.

[Swiss Pauli]

No need to ask what I did with the GS from Physics

What is Ramy up to in Thebes!?! Nine pop in AD 800. He's smoking stronger stuff than I am.

None of the AIs anywhere near Liberalism at this point:

Spamming out the missionaries and growing its cottages:

[Swiss Pauli]

Cities: Swiss 12, T-Hawk 10(?)
City sizes: SP 17, 17, 11, 10, 9, 9, 8, 8, 8, 6, 5, 2. T-H 13, 9, 5 (only cities visible).

BPT: SP 838, T-H 578 (No Oxford for T-H who is 1t from Edu)
Techs: SP: Astro, Sci Meth, Physics (in 1t); T-H: HBR, Engineering, Nationalism, Constitution, Democracy.

Military: SP: 4th in power with a small stack, T-H: a serious Elepult SoD
Relgions: SP - Hindu (2 Hindu, 1 Budd, 1 Confu). T-H - Confu (3 Hindu, 1 Budd)

Verdict: SP steaming ahead on tech and pop as T-H has to divert resources to contain serious attacks from his neighbours. Whilst there’s a strong element of chance in AI war declarations, I feel that T-Hawk’s religious isolation has made a significant contribution to his AI woes.

[Swiss Pauli]

After Physics was done, I backtracked to pick up Currency and was surprised that it yielded around 80 bpt! Should have picked it up sooner I suppose. Monotheism was also added for Org Rel in builder phases. Justinian put a bump in the road by requesting I convert to Buddhism, so I agreed before switching back 5 turns later. Picked up Guilds on T164 for Grocer-health and on the same turn Hannibal artist bombed Sicca and stole its banana. Needless to say I forgot to cancel the banana I was trading for a few more turns

Toku comes on T168 to ask me to go Buddhist but I send him packing and prepare for war. Economics and the GM (saved) on T170. Unlike the trade route boost from Currency, Free Market only yields 20 bpt. Having also trousered Constitution thanks to a low odds Great Artist GA, I switch into Merc-Rep which pinches happiness at my two largest cities, but at 57 additional bpt its a fair trade-off.

Cuman gets another low odds GA on T174. Grrrr. Saved for another GA, and Taj completes on T175. Ramy is on his way to Liberalism, so I have to abandon my attempt at Industrialism and check out with Radio. Better to be lucky than good: I’d considered Corporations and search cvifanatics for some info too, but I simply happened to click on the GM to see my options and so noticed Cereal Mills was available



Yield was 7 food and 4 commerce per city; not gamebreaking but welcome nonetheless. Founded in Kumbeh as Timbu was tied up and had also hit its happy cap. I’d decided to put the Hermitage in Djenne because Memphis was pressing it culturally (Ramy going for a not-enabled CV, perhaps?) but suddenly my cities went unhappy. Elvis stole my silks! Had to grab drama for theatres & slider but then 2 turns later Egypt vassilizes to me and I got my silks back anyway

T194 saw Aluminium discovered and connected, so Apollo was started in Timbu. T198ish:



This time I’m well prepared (though he did snag a couple of railroading workers when he declared), so I whack his incoming units GG upgrade a CR3 mace to infantry and then go on the attack, taking Nara on T204. Unfortunately, I took more damage than expected in taking the city and, impatient, went on the offensive too early so it took a full 6 turns of troops building (infantry then tanks) and tactical manoeuvering before I could take Satsuma and pronounce him gassed. Razed a tundra junk city before making him kneel before me and hand over 210g for peace for the lulz.

On the space race front, I went and bulbed half a dozen GSs on Computers and Fibre Optics. From belated reading T-Hawk’s Adventure 48 report, Computers is not needed for space BtS really did simply add more stuff for me to forget, didn’t it? A newly born GS shaved a turn off Fibre Optics before yet other was used with the saved Artist to trigger a GA for the final parts. Switching to State Property, some chopping, and retooling Timbu with workshops synced the last 3 parts for a 1610 launch.



Nothing left to do except put me feet up and enjoy my Alpine Rocket!

[Swiss Pauli]

Liberalism: SP - Radio, T-H - No.

BPT 1150 AD: SP - 1841, T-H - 1036 (both civs in Golden Age)
BPT 1470 AD: SP - 2322, T-H - 1564
BPT 1600 AD: SP - 3055*, T-H - 3856 (both civs in Golden Age) *1585 figure
BPT 1740 AD: SP - n/a, T-H - 5383

Fairly linear progression from Swiss compared to T-Hawk’s hockey stick curve.

Cities 1150 AD: SP - 12, T-H - 12?
Cities 1470 AD: SP - 14, T-H - 25
Cities 1600 AD: SP - 14, T-H - 32
Cities 1740 AD: SP - n/a, T-H - 32

This explains the BPT development quite nicely: just look how T-Hawk’s beakers jump as he adds cities to his empire by conquering Byzantium then Egypt.

Democracy Inaction

T-Hawk was unsure whether his early Democracy strategy for Emancipation fueled cottage grow paid out. In this game, I’d say not: because there was no need to balance the budget, this scenario was always going to have an early launch date and, because Emancipation’s benefits accrue over time, they will be smaller here than in a regular game; size matters and T-Hawk’s empire didn’t get huge soon enough to maximize returns; Democracy isn’t needed for a Space win, so it has to cover its considerable beaker cost before delivering a net benefit; going directly to Democracy delayed Oxford considerably in T-Hawk’s capital, an opportunity cost of hundreds, if not thousands, of beakers.

That said, No Tech Trading meant that Constitution had to be researched so grabbing Democracy with Liberalism might have worth considering as opposed to sandbagging Liberalism for the biggest tech. In this case, we’re talking about 8000 beakers in 80 turns (assuming Liberalism on T150 and tech tree being completed by T230) which is an eye-watering 100bpt so instinct tells me not (but with discounting 8000 beaker tech costs aren’t always what they seem, so perhaps the picture is not so dramatic).

[T-hawk]

T-Hawk was unsure whether his early Democracy strategy for Emancipation fueled cottage grow paid out. In this game, I’d say not ... going directly to Democracy delayed Oxford considerably in T-Hawk’s capital, an opportunity cost of hundreds, if not thousands, of beakers.

Yeah, you're right. I missed the fact that 100% science slider would make Oxford more valuable than usual, which is really odd because I correctly gauged that Academies would be more valuable than usual.

I'm just never satisfied with an Oxford rush, because those universities are so dang expensive. 200 hammers takes 10+ turns of building at a time when I still need more workers and forges and military and everything. Whipping is painful since by now those cities are up to size and working bunches of cottages.

Of course, the right answer was probably a combination. Just Lib -> Democracy and you get both Oxford and Emancipation quickly.

Thanks very much for the report and the comparison legwork. My curve went hockey-stick because of conquering rather than any sort of exponential building, of course. I intended all along to conquer just short of domination as soon as it was feasible; just didn't turn out to be feasible until cannons and grenadiers, and then there actually wasn't much time for those later cities to be productive. (It actually felt a lot like a Civ 5 game: tech running independently of gold; tech running ahead of the ability to use it; crazy warmongering AIs; and the end of the game cutting off the growth curve just as it really hits stride.)