The Dark arts - C&D Master Thread

[Shoot the Moon]

I've never seen the top cities screen used this way ever, and I haven't seen the equation documented either apart from a code snippet. I had to dig into the Python files to really find the values.

So I think I'm the first one to use the top cities screen this way - or at least the first to document it.

[Boldly Going Nowhere]

Agreed. I have to say, I'm really impressed with the amount of effort and dedication you've been putting into this game. Very good job!

[scooter]

kjn, just wanted to pop in here and say you're the man. Great work.

[Tyrmith]

You are the Ultimate Weapon! :catapult: (always wanted an excuse to use that smilie)

[kjn]

Thanks all!

[kjn]

T22 - 3120 BC

Cliff's Notes: WPC and Apolyton researched Animal Husbandry, and the Germans and CFC grew to size 3.

Demos and top cities:

Four teams increased in score this turn: WPC and Apolyton (6 points) and Germans and CFC (3 points).

This meant we dropped to 2nd in production (new top 6) and 4th in food.

Global soldiers rose 4000, and top soldiers 2000, with no change in our ranking.

Thus, I think both Apolyton and WPC has researched Animal Husbandry. 180 beakers fits nicely to 13 turns at 14bpt. I had expected WPC to have researched AH a turn or two earlier since they used their lake, but they have probably done a bit of research-swapping. I expect Apolyton to have improved their cow in a few turns.

I had expected a warrior build or two as well, but no sign of that on the demos. They might have been masked by losses, but I doubt it.

CivFr is probably on a settler or worker build right now. If they've gone for a worker, it probably completed this turn or will next turn.

I have annotated the top cities screen with the identity of the teams.

Apolyton is below us, since they grew last turn and was below us then.

The Germans are above us, so they have an extra 1C they can pick up. I think they're on a worker build, using their forested plains hill, and has a riverside corn (if we work the flood plains instead of the FPH - as we should this turn, we're on top of the cities screen).

CFC is at the bottom of the pop 3 teams, since they lack two 6-strength tiles - they only have one.

CivFr is on top of the pop 2 teams, thanks to their extra culture.

Another tidbit: further confirmation that it was CFC who got the forest growth early in the game. 55 in worst health comes from 4 unhealth (3 from pop, 1 from flood plains) and 5 health (2 difficulty, 2 fresh water, 1 from unknown sources). Of course, it might be a riverside grain too.

[kjn]

By doing some major tile-swapping I have not only figures on every food, production, and GNP, but also the total output (raw food, hammers, and commerce) of all the top four cities, ie the Germans, Apolyton, CFC, and CivFr.

F+P+C

29: Germans
28: Apolyton
27: CFC
26: CivFr

GNP:

16: 9 (8 at 16 or better)
17: 7 (6 at 17 or better)
19: 5 (4 at 19 or better)
20: 4 (3 at 20 or better)
21: 3 (2 at 21)

Production:

2: 9 (8 at 2 or better)
3: 6 (5 at 3 or better)
5: 2 (1 at 6)

Food:

9: 8 (1 at 8, 7 at 9 or better)
10: 7 (6 at 10 or better)
13: 5 (4 at 13 or better)
14: 4 (3 at 14 or better)
15: 3 (2 at 15 or better)
16: 2 (1 at 16)

Putting it all together:

GNP

16: 2
17: 2
19: 1
20: 1
21: 2

Production (total 24)

2: 3
3: 4
6: 1

Food (total 95)

8: 1
9: 1
10: 2
13: 1
14: 1
15: 1
16: 1

Now, if we take this together with our earlier data on tiles and demographics, we can work out the following, together with some guesses:

Germans - 13F 6H 10C
Plains hill city tile: 2F 2H 9C
Riverside corn: 6F 1C
Grass deer: 5F 1H
Forested plains hill: 3H

At a guess, they're building a worker right now.

Apolyton - 16F 3H 9C
Plains hill city tile: 2F 2H 9C
Lakeside corn: 6F
Grass deer: 5F 1H
Lakeside banana: 3F

CFC - 15F 2H 10C
Plains hill city tile: 2F 2H 9C
Lakeside corn: 6F
Farmed lakeside banana: 4F
Flood plains: 3F 1C

CivFr - 14F 2H 10C
Banana city tile: 3F 1H 9C
Riverside corn: 6F 1C
Grass deer: 5F 1H

Probably on a settler or nearly completed - maybe even finished - worker build right now.

This lets us compute possible final GNP values for the top four civs right now:

Germans: 17 / 19 / 21
Apolyton: 16 / 18 *
CFC: 17 / 19 / 21
CivFr: 19 / 21

* No available double-discount tech

Now, provided this analysis is correct (a big if), then:

Apolyton must be researching an un-discounted tech right now, since there is no GNP slot at 18 right now. Mining seems like the most likely candidate, followed by Mysticism.

If CivFr is on the Pottery path (ie researching Wheel) with 19 GNP, then they block CFC from taking that slot by researching Pottery, and vice versa. Since CFC just researched The Wheel, I think they're on to Pottery, but not CivFr. The same is true of the Germans, which is one of the big reasons for why I have doubts of this analysis - they have also researched The Wheel.

[kjn]

T23 - 3080 BC

CivFr gained 8 land points. Apolyton gained 2 points, which fits going from size 3 to 4. CivPlayers gained 3 points, which fits going from size 2 to 3.

This pretty much confirms that Apolyton was rival best in food output the last turns, with 16F or 10 net. Since it took them four turns to grow from 2 to 3, I imagine they built up a surplus of at least 6F to roll into the next growth phase.

We will see an increase with at least 1000 in power, and a population increase to 48000 (best) / 16875 (average).

I really love the automation I managed to put into the C&D spreadsheet. And now I will have to log in and check things.

(I think I've found the best balance between image size (bytes and pixels) and legibility now. 960x540 was quite hard to read, but 1280x720 seems to work decently.)

Cliff's Notes: Apolyton grew to size 4 and built a warrior. CivPlayers grew to size 3. CivFr received their land points from their T3 border expansion.

Top soldiers is now 16000, which must be Apolyton. They have 2000 in pop, 8000 in tech, and 6000 in 3 warriors. The fact that they built a warrior also shows in that the rival worst approval rate didn't move: the new warrior canceled out the demand for military protection, so unhappiness remained constant.

I'm a little unsure about how Apolyton has worked their tiles, since they built their new warrior in 6t, not 5t as I would have expected. It might be that they farmed their banana, and worked that tile on a few turns instead of their deer, but then I'd have expected them to have 12F on sometime during T18-20, which would mean CivFr didn't have that output.

BTW Sullla - after the tile check I left our third citizen on the FPH, since that's the tile that should be worked this turn. The units are unmoved.

[Lewwyn]

Try using the new screenshot tag. Link at the top of the forum in the usual QotM spot.

[kjn]

Yeah, I thought about that, but 1920x1080 (or 1280x720) downsampled in the browser to 800x450 will be quite illegible, so I see little need to include that. We all know how the demos screen looks, so there is no value in an overview image. Using the spoiler tag also means that the footprint of the page becomes smaller - better for browsing with devices using limited bandwidth.