WW16: The Outlaws and The Olives

[Meiz]

#1446, Lobster...

#1449, Fork

#1450 Lobster

[Gaspar]

Actually, thinking about it I don't know if it's that off. The issue is that he refers to 'the village' as something external, but I'm used to some oddities with non-native speakers. If he had said, "Bad break for the team" would it stick out as much?

Catwalk is truly fluent, so I don't think this applies to him. I've never noticed those kind of errors in talking to him. I had the same vibe from that post that you guys did but I still think Rowain is a superior option.

[Lewwyn]

Hehe. Wow. I had just written a lengthy response to Lewwyn talking about how, based on my ongoing reread, the single most important thing I noticed was how that Catwalk's posts seemed crazy at the time but were much more reasonable if you looked at them all lined up in a row, due to his consistent emotional curve. I might be terrible at this.

I'm just starting to go back through again myself, but I think that's why everyone is reluctant to stay on Catwalk. Yes, they jump on for a bit then get off when they think, "This just has to be Catwalk being Catwalk, right?" AT least that's what I've been telling myself and I'm telling myself no more. Anyone can be consistent. A wolf can act consistently scummy and say they are just trying not to get night killed.

So, do you think it's a real slip-up? It's not a determiner issue because you can't swap out any others for the 'the'. 'our' would be a villager pronoun but that would be painfully off.

It's a possible slip up unconsciously distanced from the village, but there you see even in my explanation I called it "the village" so I'm not going to hang my case on that. I think there are much scummier things.

Also, I'm glad you stopped blowing smoke up my ass Lewwyn, I was getting suspicious.

I really liked villager Injera back in... WW11 or whatever it was, and every game since I've been looking for him. Sorry I can't see him anymore right now. Day 2 was too close to last game.

[Catwalk]

What did you miss about that pindicator? It's a "crap, we lost two townies post", what puzzles you about it? I do think that most theories concerning how wolves and townies would react to day and night end are useless, though.

Lewwyn, what exactly do you suspect me for? I'll remind you that you've found me scummy in just about every game we've played together (and the same has gone the other way, although I have tempered myself lately).

What are the suspicious votes on Sareln you are talking about? This is the sort of comment that feels bad to me. You have a very meaningful conclusion that Pindicator or me was being protected due to the suspicious votes on Sareln, but you don't explain what are those suspicious votes.

Ichabod, what I meant by that post is simply that I found most of the Sareln voters somewhat suspicious regardless of the Sareln vote:

Sareln - 8 - Mattimeo, Arromir, tasunke, Merovech, Molach, Pindicator, Twinkletoes89, Serdoa

With half a suspect in Tasunke as well, too crazy to read but generating extreme noise in a very confident manner. He seems to be a bit embarrassed by that now, though.

Arromir for lurking outrageously and simply not contributing.

Merovech for dismissing suspiciion casually because "he knows he's town", and for his part in the lynch of thestick followed by suspecting everybody who helped lynch him.

Molach for having done a lurker wolf game before.

pindicator still stands out to me for not casting his vote on a suspect that had a chance of hanging, although he did later own up to that not being a good idea. Not sure if changing your mind is more scummy than stubbornly sticking with your position, both can make sense from both townie and scum perspective.

TwinkleToes for several reasons, including his dogged insistence on novice being scum (not just insistence that we shouldn't clear him but that novice actually is scum). He later confirmed his stance today by saying it'd take a lot to convince him to vote anyone else today.

I'm not saying these hunches are enough to hang any of these, I just found the sum of suspicion pretty big overall. I'm also not saying it's proof that Ichabod or pindicator is wolf, I just found it an interesting theory to pursue further. And I did cast my vote for one of the suspects on that list.

I still don't think saying "bad break for the village" is scummy, and I think it's an extremely weak argument for lynching. Is it that uncommon to use that kind of phrasing? And Lewwyn, you pretty much always think I sound scummy (I did notice your comment on the "village" argument).

I will be gone for a birthday party most of the day.

[pindicator]

It's a possible slip up unconsciously distanced from the village, but there you see even in my explanation I called it "the village" so I'm not going to hang my case on that. I think there are much scummier things.

That's because you're comparing something to the village
See? I did it too. But that's different than how Catwalk used it.

Anyway, i agree there are plenty of other scummy things with Catwalk.

• How he kept trying to get Mattimeo to reveal if and who he targeted with his power.
  
• His proclaimed ditching of independent thinking and piggy-backing onto novice.
  
• His last second vote question at the end of day 2, which Serdoa latched on to during Night 2.
  
• His Day 1 record: he defends [url=

  I agree thestick has messed up, but I just don't believe he's mafia. The fact that noone is really interested in changing strengthens my suspicion that the wolves are content with him hanging.

  ]thestick[/url], votes mattimeo & bigger.
  
• How most his posts today are fluff: chatting with meiz about his PR
  
• How he was kicking dirt on Bigger at the end of last night.
  

There's a lot, and probably some stuff I missed. Lewwyn's right about the quantity. Zak even told Catwalk he lost a life early in day 1; how many lives does he get?


@Gaspar - what reasons do you say rowain is a better lynch? I've already stated I'm far less sure on the rowain scummy factor, but you seem a bit more


x-post with catwalk

[Ichabod]

I don't want to go too far into the woodwork here, but this just isn't what I tried to say at all. I never called anything you did "totally scum" or anything similar. I didn't vote for you- and never said I did- because I thought you should have picked up on better reads. What I meant was that I perceived that your thought process was dominated by things that didn't take into account what had happened the day before.

The "totally scum post" I was referring to is the one I made about gaspar on day 1 that made Zakalwe make his case against me. You never called any of my posts totally scum. I was just referring to that post which almost everyone found suspicious (the exception, apparently) being you.

I agree with others that this game has been quite a bit more mean-spirited then previous games, and I'm trying to not get hot-headed here, but this is just insulting and incoherent.

Sorry if I insulted you, it wasn't on purpose. Be or not a wolf, I really don't want to insulçt anyone.

[Catwalk]

Most of my posts today are fluff because I've been posting a whole bunch. I've had fun with Meiz because I like having fun, I've also been doing scum hunting. Everything else is recycled material. Have you read my rebuttals?

[novice]

I still don't think saying "bad break for the village" is scummy, and I think it's an extremely weak argument for lynching.

quoting this so I can agree with it and Meiz can fork it.

[Injera]

I'm just starting to go back through again myself, but I think that's why everyone is reluctant to stay on Catwalk. Yes, they jump on for a bit then get off when they think, "This just has to be Catwalk being Catwalk, right?" AT least that's what I've been telling myself and I'm telling myself no more. Anyone can be consistent. A wolf can act consistently scummy and say they are just trying not to get night killed.

No, that's not it. It's not Catwalk being Catwalk, it's a person that looks unreasonable on the surface, but if you look at everything in a line it fits a reasonable pattern.

I get that the piggybacking is bad, especially if you're going to ignore it when you choose. It's anti-village. And God knows I despise the idea of throwing off independent thought, which is why I read that the same way you did. But big picture I'm not seeing anything that says, "This guy is a wolf" as opposed to, "this guy is an earnest villager." Maybe I'm grading on a scale.

I really liked villager Injera back in... WW11 or whatever it was, and every game since I've been looking for him. Sorry I can't see him anymore right now. Day 2 was too close to last game.

I meant it when I said that Injera is gone. He's not coming back, what you saw in the Injerawolves is my base personality, and yeah, playing like shit for two days has brought out the same response. And I try to grasp at things and figure them out, which makes me retreat. Same job, different alignment. I have two posters to get through with my reread which I'm not going to hit tonight, so, yeah, Day 3 is shit too, and the only thing to show for it is a 25k text file that no one will ever read. Hooray WW.

[Ichabod]

Lewwyn, dammit. You stole my thunder. I started putting day 3 posts into my spreadsheet and on the very first one of the day.



Sometimes you see a post and you wonder "how the hell did I miss that the first time?"

Catwalk

I can't agree with this argument. I use this kind of language and I remember mislynching Rowain in WW3 for a similar reason (I was certain I caught a wolf slip like that, but he was villager). I wouldn't make anything based on this post, either towards a villager tell or towards a wolf tell.