Diplomacy Master Thread- Helping Your Opponents Beat Themselves

[regoarrarr]

I mean I concede the point, but if you start saying that, then you can start saying things like Well we shouldn't count Theology in the other teams' counts because we have Paya and won't ever tech it, etc. etc.

[Bigger]

not only that - we haven't got any benefit from paper, we won't build a university for awhile so we won't benefit from education for awhile, etc.
liberalism is a useful tech that we would have to research even if someone beat us to the first-to bonus (maybe not immediately, but soon enough).

[Gold Ergo Sum]

I mean I concede the point, but if you start saying that, then you can start saying things like Well we shouldn't count Theology in the other teams' counts because we have Paya and won't ever tech it, etc. etc.

Exactly. The point of a beaker count isn't to assess how useful those techs are to the team at the time. The point is to determine how much research the team has accomplished by any means necessary. Even if Apolyton finishes Education this turn, we will still have 50% more beakers completed than them, and double anyone else.

[Ubercannon]

Well it's not a big deal I just don't think people should be getting too complacent yet.

[scooter]

Well it's not a big deal I just don't think people should be getting too complacent yet.

I think the most important reason to know about these counts is because other teams are fully capable of calculating these things too. If teams haven't figured it out already, they should very quickly start to realize we are an out-of-control runaway that is going to be extraordinarily difficult to catch if they don't dogpile us sooner rather than later. This makes it an important thing to be aware of with regard to diplo, where it's going to become increasingly difficult to keep people in line and each NAP we manage to sign becomes increasingly valuable.

[scooter]

Sent to WPC:

Tatu,

Great to hear about pushing out more units. We'll of course be making our own preparations soon too - we've already begun churning out cats, and we should have some strong supporting units too . The good news is that even though we had a no-scouting clause with the German team, they seemingly forgot about that and started poking around in our borders. We of course took that as license to scout out nearly all of their cities, so we'll be able to share with you whatever map intel you need. Turns are moving slow so we haven't mapped out a specific invasion path yet, but we'll be working on that in the next week or so. Either way, we'll just want to make sure both of us hit around the same time.

Let me know if there's anything you need from me!

Thanks,
scooter - Team RB

I went ahead and ditched the second paragraph as requested.

[Boldly Going Nowhere]

I think complacency is far from our mind, if my own paranoia is any indication.

--

Looks good, scooter.

[scooter]

Quick draft:

OT4E,

Thanks for the clarification! Hopefully we don't sound too paranoid, we recently had a neighbor completely forget about a no-scouting agreement and they walked right into our land. Just thought we would play it safe here. I'll pass the word on to our turn player so we can get Open Borders turned back on.

Thanks!
scooter - Team RB]

Any objections?

[scooter]

Ok, let's talk about this post next as it got lost in the shuffle.

Now that we have Paper, should we try to get any map trades?

WPC is the obvious candidate, since that will make sure we both have good visibility on the German lands, but I'm not sure it will benefit us much otherwise. Maybe some vision on Univers' borders and WPC's remaining land, but not much else.

Univers? We have zero visibility on their land, and I think it might make it easier for us to get some communication going with them, but I don't think they have good map data on CivFr or CivPlayers.

Apolyton has already said no, even though I think their map data is the best of all the teams (they have OBs with everyone).

CivFr would be great, but I'm not sure they'd be willing. The Germans had effective scouting early on, it seemed, so they're a possibility but I would be careful about doing too much diplo with them currently. The Spanish is an outsider possibility, but I think a worthwhile one.

Last, good news with CivPlayers! We can re-open borders this turn, I think.

General thoughts:

1) I think we should line up a trade with WPC, but we should try to do it after making another map trade or two (if we are able to that is). May not be the best to pass their maps on to everyone else.

2) I say we send out messages to CivFr and UniversCiv and try to get map swaps with them. Neither of them were really receptive to diplo, and this might be a way to get "the foot in the door" with these guys as they've more or less ignored us.

3) By asking around, we may even get confirmation from one of them on who Apolyton's map partner is. I think it's useful to know that info considering it likely signals a bit of an alliance. If someone admits they are bound to not trade maps, we have our target.

4) Might be worth asking CFC as well. Not so much because I care about their maps, but more because I would bet they are Apolyton's partner. I can ask Caledorn by chat, which is a more likely to find this info out (if he sends an official message, more likely someone doesn't let him tell us). Any objections to me trying this now?

5) The crazy Spanish team is another ideal team to swap maps with, only because it's a lot of territory we haven't uncovered yet. If CFC hesitates to agree to a map swap, we may be able to sweeten the deal if we can tell them we will give them Spanish maps.

That's my initial thoughts. Let's open this up to discussion.

[Gold Ergo Sum]

Your thoughts seem pretty much dead-on.