[SPOILERS] Cornflakes and Q Eat 'Em for Breakfast!

[Qgqqqqq]

Ok we are going to be keeping OR/Slavery/etc. for a turn because a) I'm not in a great rush to switch, and b) theres a couple of missionary builds going through this turn, and I'd forgotten why those+Theo don't mix
Anyway
The Battleground:

Unfortunately the alt key also brings up the odds so you can't see the units in azzas last city.
They're the same as listed earlier, except he keeps whipping catapults.
Against his 23 catapults, 8 praetorians, 2 macemen, an axeman, and a archer we have 11 maces and 3 catapults to the north (NO WAY I'm doing a composite with all these stacks ) and 3 maces, 7 axes and 7 catapults to the south.
I'm waiting for Azza to play (I really should go before him...) and then I'll move them up - splitting the northern stacks into two, and putting most (all?) of the south onto the forest tile.
I'm wondering if I should put those HA that can reach on the tile two back to have some none collateralled defenders or not.

Anyway we settled Ulundi:

Really torn on whether I move onto the forest or the jungle next turn...
I think I'll probably make the workboat in azza's old eastern city, and then chop out a granary here.

I took the liberty of making this trade to AT.

I know you want to get a good deal but whats more important is getting guilds ASAP - thats 1 hammer on every workshop is going to be super useful, and we cna't risk having to bargain.

I took a shot of this because it was really interesting:

Just suprised at a T155 Barbarism and paganism - especially from Commodore!
As I was doing this Commodore logged in and kicked off a GA, swapping into Vassalage and OR!

I had already snapped a pic of the demographics, so here's the before and after for Commodores GA:

[img]https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/125384613/Civ4ScreenShot0110.JPG[img]
Yes we move to no.1 GNP after BC kicks off a GA
Thats most interesting because it tells us that Commodores 100% (probably) research value is 338, only 12 ahead of our 0% value.
Our 100% GNP is about 600
Also best production goes up by 60, and we can clearly tell that Commodore is that, as well as beating us in everything else.
BC are also 30 CY ahead of us, which should be alleviated as we whip two more settlers next turn.

MY GP planning is horrible BTW, I keep trying to whip the places where we want GP from - I've switched the whip to Paradigm instead of Volcano, wheere it was at the start of this sentence.
These two settlers will settle either the fish and the cow spots or the border with TT, depending how light on workers I'm feeling (cow/fish spots need little setup).

I plan to run EPs on AT until we see research, then reasses and go on either Commodore or TT.

I'm building the Sistine chapel in the AT border and either dumping hammers into or building the parthenon in Sheep, depending on your feedback.
The max hammers setup is to get as much hammers while we keep the OR bonus.
TT got lib too, taking gunpowder. (I doubt he'll appreciate that as an afterthought, but in the meta its not that big a deal - he was definitely a cert for it.

And here's the graphs (pretty useless without commodores):






And for the lols:

We've played 1989 hours!
Also, I wonder what the razing record is...before getting in a parkin situation of course.

[Cornflakes]

Keep the HA's back.

Don't worry about "getting a good deal" ... I've been making trades all game that aren't really good deals

[Qgqqqqq]

Oh yeah while I was logged on Comm offered me guilds for nationalism

[Qgqqqqq]

Just realised I didn't post an update for earlier.
I got on for the turn roll, basically just moved the troops up. Should've checked the cities but jowy was online and I don't like holding it (and I know I spend ages online). Anyway, somehow id fudged the setup, because neither of my settler whips counted as being swapped to last turn(???).
No idea why, id definitely switched ti turns last night. Still, onwards and upwards.
In light of that I swapped without any whips, though it means the cities will be slowbuildinh settlers most of the GA...but it doesn't really matter, as those cities are working all hammer boosted tiles from the golden age, and its not like we're wanting for commerce.
Just means we'll need a extra turn growing our globe city before drafting...
Anyway, I setup the cities for starvation.
It'll especially hurt in potos (the second city) as its behind and will need to catch up, and also its starving off river cottages...
In retrospect, I think that's been one of our weakness this game, not enough specialization, too much focus on overall good improvements and not ones needed at the city. Evidence: both our globe and our heroic epic ended up with villages, and we have no real national epic location.
Moai wasn't really planned more backup, and even at Blimp we're growing cottages.
Anyway, I'm logging in tonight, anyone (including lurkers) have picture requests?

What do we offer to 2metra for nationalism?

[Qgqqqqq]

Logged in to AT accepting our offer, revised for whales instead of his map.
I'd vastly prefer map but whatever.
And our workshops have matured
Okay, they're only like this for the GA, after that we need chemistry...and maybe state property?
Setup at start, unfortunately a copy of the azza starting units failed.

FIrst I blockaded down, 3 accuracy+one vanilla.
Then I suicided the remaining cats, with one withdrawl.
This was probably a mistake really, as very little damage was done because of the enormous amount of catapults.
An unusual situation really, I should've simmed this attack, just assmued he'd move out.



72% odds on top unit. Yeah, this isn't going to take long.



Lost at low odds









Also lost a few HA at 70% odds, and some decent odds axes.
No flankng damage whatsoever.
Out of units to attack, but no decent enemies remain.

Full list of exchange.

I'll post about economy later, we're on banking (2 turns) at the moment.

[novice]

You can't flank units in cities.

[Qgqqqqq]

Well that explains that.
I still have never flanked a unit...

Apparently I promised to post about economy
Okay so like it shows we're on banking, due in two turns at 100%.
We should be able to get there without running out of cash, but if not I'll adjust the tiles.
In the azza conquests we're mostly chopping out courthouses, they have a few improved tiles so might as well get rid of the costs.
The latest one, Bergman or something pops borders this turn (just, working plains iron while building culture with a forge and religion. A perfect 10 culture that lets me hire merchants with the other two happy pop ).
All of them cost a lot, but we'll get that back soon enough.
Other thing I hate about tech trading is all my work on economy is wrong.
We have the best economy in the game, easily, and if this were no trading we'd probably be favorites, but that doesn't help. I just can't adjust for the meta appropriately, as I know every 5 commerce tile I work over a bare farm is wrong, because it isn't our economy that needs work, its our cities number, our pop, even our army if it comes to that.
Heck, even the courthouse whip I did to save 8gpt was probably wrong, because it lost us tiles in return for economy. And that may even cost us, as I think people are seeing our tech and deciding they shouldn't be trading. And meanwhile Commodore is growing, growing...
Ok that rant is mostly brought on by tired insecurity, so anyway...
Our next GP are coming out of Potos and Volcano. I'm trying to get Potos out first because it has such beautiful tiles, but its a struggle. We likely won't fit it in by the end of the holiday.
We're still on the sistine chapel, working all mines and trying to grow - difficult when I need to work two artists or risk the pig flipping.
After sistine I can't fit in hermitage sorry, its workers and settlers all the way. (I could one turn raze an undefended AT city next turn...pity its probably the wrong meta. Especially considering we just took his techs.)
I continue to be indesicive about city builds - I must have changed moai 4 times this turn. I think its on spies but I'm not entirely sure
I did get it and the other one to grow in the same turn and still work the new mine
I also continue to be indesicive about which GP we'll get - I think we want a merchant, but we might get the economics one anyway - and then again we want a merchant for corps...and so on.
I think we probably want to go economics after banking, but maybe printing press would be better?
I also have no plans for OU - I know, I know we're behind on National wonders (still time to build the national epic!) but honestly we have enough things to try and build this game, without adding that to the list.
The capital is growing nicely, picking up all its tiles.
Porcupine finally stagnated on workshops mines and the river tile. Making 2 promo galleys until iron is on the network (I.e. when azza dies), maybe mix up some catapults.
This is pretty much just a train of thought, I'll try to do individual cities tomorrow. Please tell me requests as tomorrow will be the last updateable turn from me for a while.

[Qgqqqqq]

Lurker Question:are corporations allowed for this game?

[Cornflakes]

So Azza didn't attack out? good call on attacking now rather than waiting for knights.

(I could one turn raze an undefended AT city next turn...pity its probably the wrong meta. Especially considering we just took his techs.)

I go excited when you said this because I thought you were talking about SWAT, so I logged in ..... If it was SWAT I'd say do it, but since it's just a new 2-pop city that isn't in a cultural battle, no don't declare war.

I also continue to be indesicive about which GP we'll get - I think we want a merchant, but we might get the economics one anyway - and then again we want a merchant for corps...and so on.
I think we probably want to go economics after banking, but maybe printing press would be better?

Printing Press is good, but it's also rather expensive for the benefit. Economics, with it's first-to bonus would be better. If Corps are on then rushing Constitution (which I wan after Economics anyway) > Corporation may be best??? State property and corporations don't mix, right? If we're planning on doing Sid's Sushi for the food benefit, might it be better to pass on SS and beeline Communism instead since we're planning to be workshop heavy in new cities? I'm not very experienced with Corporations. Our Ikhanada does give us a significant edge on maintenance ...

I think we want 2 different GP that we can use for a GA in about 20 turns. Then if we get the Economics GM + Communism GSpy we just have to generate one more GP in the next GA to fuel our 3-man GA.

Galleys from Porcupine are good (even when we start wasting overflow) until we get ability to build knights. Catapults can come from anywhere, maces we have enough of already (and can draft). 2-promo galleys are unique. Then maybe alternate with knights. I'd like to get at least 8 galleys.

DON'T TRADE NATIONALISM TO COMMODORE!!! He's in a GA now, and we don't want to help him with the ability to swap into Nationhood at the end of his GA, make him research that ability himself.

[Cornflakes]

What do we offer to 2metra for nationalism?

Don't. He's refused 250-gold + map, and upon further consideration we're planning to attack him next so let's not give him draftability unless he offers us a sweet deal.