[Spoiler] First rodeo: Jalepeno takes the bull by the horns.

[jalepeno]

Turn 70

Ok, time to see how things look after my brief hiatus (thanks again to Q for keeping things rolling smoothly). First up, we finished masonry last turn...

and construction is only a 3-turn tech. Sweet!

I see that Q's been rather hard on the animal population.

We now have a trade connection to Yell0w.

I want marble! Great Library anyone? Seems he's also finally grabbed BW and built the brewery already (ale not visible in screenshot).


It might be worth going cartography soon for better trade routes, especially since it would only take a couple turns of road building to connect to TBS as well.

Overview of our lands

The north: Settler for C6 finishes next turn. Don't mind Networking's grass forest; grew EOT and will be working another mine (and improved banana) next turn.


The core:


The south: C5 (sign removed - middle of ivory, corn, silk) gets settled next turn.

Demos

Still doing ok. HK's leading the settling race right now, grabbing each successive city a couple turns before I do, which has put him ahead of in food/GNP. MFG is good, and another GM finishes next turn. Academy comes in 11 turns - can't come too soon for me! Everyone but TBS (and Sian?) is in aristocracy now.

[Qgqqqqq]

I forget - has the dungeon opened yet?
Send the 2xp warrior to the east dungeon next (IMO )

I think we should wait on cartog, to see if anyone else will do it for us. I mean, each of theirs will only be +1c per city, so maybe only +10 (?) cpt - not anything to rush for.

Can we get the Great Library without minor libraries?

[jalepeno]

I forget - has the dungeon opened yet?
Send the 2xp warrior to the east dungeon next (IMO )

1 more turn for our GE I'm planning to wait on getting a couple moroi down by C5 before popping the next dungeon. Just need to make sure a bad result won't delay settling the southern border. (we've also got a goblin fort to clear out)

I think we should wait on cartog, to see if anyone else will do it for us. I mean, each of theirs will only be +1c per city, so maybe only +10 (?) cpt - not anything to rush for.

I think trade routes with TBS will be more than +1c as his capital is now at size 20 (). At +15cpt, the payback for carto is ~13 turns and that would improve as more cities are founded and grow. We'll want it before trade anyways; I'll reach out to see if my next door neighbors have any carto plans.

Can we get the Great Library without minor libraries?

No, but I only need 2 more, and they're only 3-5 turn builds in my core cities and more happiness will be hooked soon. I could time them to finish when the GS for my academy pops (saving gold ahead of time of course). Then trade for marble and build the GL. At the same time burn through warfare, philosophy, & military state, so that I can build the epics with marble as well.

[Qgqqqqq]

My last point was me confusing the Calabim ban on Eldar Councils with Libraries
How powerful would it really be for us? Won't we generally be eating that pop/working aristofarms?
And of course, we delay vamps more

[jalepeno]

My last point was me confusing the Calabim ban on Eldar Councils with Libraries
How powerful would it really be for us? Won't we generally be eating that pop/working aristofarms?
And of course, we delay vamps more

The biggest benefit of the GL would be the +5 GP points. Stick the national epic in the same city, work another scientist, and voila, 18 GPP/turn. That would let me put GP generation on autopilot as they just flow in. Could provide extra beakers in the capital or culture on TBS border too. That one city would be the only one working specialists (and not many), so it wouldn't make a big difference empire wide. I might build more libraries to help with tech anyways, but probably won't grab the great one unless I can get marble in a decent trade.

That last bit is what worries me the most. I certainly don't what this to happen to me...

...
Final verdict: it's all my macro game. I could have won this war, easy, if I'd had a stronger empire and hence Sorcery 5 turns ago. Lesson learned for next time!

At this point, HBR, trade, and feudalism are all we need for vampires, but the empire must be ready to build/support the army before we tech to it. So what do I need to get ahead of time? Warfare will definitely be worth it, as military state's production bonus and increased unit support are really important, plus it unlocks the NE. The HE (and command posts) would be great, but then I have to tech mysticism (still don't have it lol), philosophy, and military strategy. cartography is just about the last economy boosting tech I'll want, but it's useless if my neighbors don't want OB (haven't heard back yet). KOTE + necromancy will be amazing for spectres as I'll have around 6 nodes in my territory, but I could just as easily grab those while building/feasting vamps. Only other tech on my want list is animal handling for hawks. Oh, and archery someday for lumbermills.

As for current game situation, I've near the top of food/MFG, but middling in GNP (~140 and someone is now over 200). Building another moroi should make me #1 in power. I've got 4-5 more city sites to grab, and then I've got to conquer some barb cities (one of which will be really tough) to open up more expansion. Lots to think about! (good thing Yell0w's giving us so much extra time ).

Current plan: tech carto->HBR->trade next (dependent on OB agreements with neighbors) to get some extra commerce from trade routes. Build the brewery in Paradigm (will finish about when it gets it's academy in 10 turns). push expansion hard; the sooner cities get built, the sooner they'll finish manors and be ready to help with vamp production. meanwhile, build catapults in networking to take down barb cities.

[jalepeno]

Turn 71

Time for our GE to come striding out of the dungeon!

No engineers in this dungeon; it's so poorly constructed it can't even stay standing.

There was good news however, as a 7th city was settled in the illustrious empire.

The big win here is the 2 extra happy resources. Also a gateway to my southern borders: in the top of screenshot, you can see that my border settler has 5 more turns to go.

Demos

I'm feeling pretty good about these. Yell0w's golden age inflated GNP is a bit intimidating (now in aristocracy and pacifism - definitely getting the most out of the golden age). Of course, my costs are probably twice his (he's still on 4 cities).


Here's what the world's strongest army looks like.


The thing is, even border cities only have 1 unit in them, plus I've got a couple units on roads. Building moroi now so I can get away with fewer units. Because the world's strongest army costs a pretty penny.


Military state would be worth 6gpt right now and that's only gonna go up. Actually, the civic upkeep is the biggest surprise for me - aren't I organized?

[Qgqqqqq]

I don't think GLib will be worth the investment, especially as we won't want more then one sage (GA) and we need so many hammers to get it. At the end of the day, we're only getting 5-6gpp from the library itself, the rest come from sources we can get independent. Edit: ok, I missed your conclusion there. Glad we're thinking on the same lines.
I think we should get vamps then necromancy and then double up for techs like warfare, animal husbandry and a religion.

[jalepeno]

I don't think GLib will be worth the investment, especially as we won't want more then one sage (GA) and we need so many hammers to get it. At the end of the day, we're only getting 5-6gpp from the library itself, the rest come from sources we can get independent. Edit: ok, I missed your conclusion there. Glad we're thinking on the same lines.

I think we should get vamps then necromancy and then double up for techs like warfare, animal husbandry and a religion.

Yell0w wants a [probably very long] NAP before opening borders or trading marble, so the GL question might be moot. I'm simply not willing to tie myself down for the next 50 turns, not when I'll have Vamps in the next 20-30. No response from TBS either, so looks like carto should be skipped.

As for techs, I agree except for grabbing warfare before feudalism so that I can be in military state while building the army. That'll mean +25% (apprenticeship -10% -> MS +15%) production bonus building units, and vamps don't need starting xp anyways. The support savings will be important too. Techs: construction, HBR, warfare, trade, feudalism, mysticism, KOTE, necromancy, animal handling, philosophy, AV, priesthood. Construction finishes in 2 turns, academy in 10. Question is, when to start saving gold for the academy? 8 turns seems a bit much, but nothing on the list is required immediately and I'll need a big bankroll to get through feudalism, let alone to the end of the list.

[Qgqqqqq]

Again, the savings and production bonus will be good, but don't matter until after we get feud, as that will be when we really start building a military. While I understand that the production bonus will be needed to really churn them out, we won't be using it in the period between getting warfare and getting feud (or,at least, not much) while if we get feud first we can still start producing them while waiting for the production bonus.

[jalepeno]

Turn 72

So much for any talk about the Great Library...

He's definitely not the person I wanted to be getting any goodies.

And then Yell0w decided to mess with my micro.

I don't have anything in range to cover the workers from his scout.


He's probably just heading for the dungeon but...why move a warrior inside your borders right next to two of my workers? He doesn't gain any scouting info, plus he knew they were there.


His warrior has would have odds on my bloodpet in the area, so next turn he would have a shot to gank 4 of my workers. Peace talks notwithstanding, that's too big a risk, so I moved them away in both spots. I also inserted a bloodpet in the queue of the nearest city.

I sent him an email expressing my displeasure with his moves and asking him to please NOT pop the dungeon that's directly on my borders. His response:

Dear jalepeno,

concerning my warrior on your border: just maneuvers, he's heading west and has no business with you, also there was one of your warriors right next to your workers, and I've had to cover my workers before as well. I'm sorry for the inconvenience nonetheless. Though I guess a war declaration to get two workers, would be quite stupid, especially coming from a civilization which runs pacifism right now... come on. And we having peace talks right now.. so I wouldn't do that.

I discovered this dungeon about 40 turns ago and 2 warriors already died trying to open it. This time I've got a whole group of explorers and they will open it. I can understand if you consider this an aggressive move. Be aware that my cities are close by as well. This map isn't very big and thus we will have shared borders on at least two sides. As I said I think I have a strong enough group there to open this in a save way, you still might want to get extra security in your city just as a precaution

Concerning the Marble. I'm in no need of horses nor sugar I'm afraid. We will find a good trade though I am sure.

I hope everything is alright and I'll inform you next time I move military units near to your units.

Best regards

Ok, just a big misunderstanding...but how does him seeing the dungeon 40 turns ago justify opening it right on my borders!?!? I'll have 4 bloodpets and 2 moroi there before he finishes popping it...the bloodthirsty warmonger in me is very tempted to wipe out his explorers. He can't say I didn't warn him. And as he says, he's still in pacifism/apprenticeship, so -30% units in a 4-city empire. On the other hand, I wouldn't gain anything from this besides some XP and a lot of ill will from my nearest neighbor. I'm most just pissed because of how much he screwed up my worker micro.

So things are getting interesting, but the turn every other day pace is starting to really bug me. It's not that bad, but neither Sian or Yell0w ever offer explanations for why they hold it for so long.