Sorry I completely forgot to post after the last turn. I assume you kept the scout on top of GJs? Only 2 turns to poly now... Can't believe we might actually get it!
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[Spoilers] REM and AdrienIer's thread of football, spamming and blaming it on the mod
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Awesome, if we pull off landing that city and poly we have a good chance!
Also a great day for civ for me as I have found where the teamer guys have been hosting their games  teamers ahoy today hopefully!
I've been thinking about our next ~30 turns, and what our plan would be assuming we get hindu and plant right in the face of GJ. He'll hate us for it, can't blame him for that. Hopefully we'll found the copper city soon after that, so we can defend for some time. But what next ? So far we've sacrificed our economic growth in favor of stuff that'll help our expansion. Due to our weird initial position that was probably the right choice, but the time has come to grow some cottages, found cities for their tile qualities instead of strategical importance and get out of that last place in score (of course so early in the game it doesn't matter too much but no one wants to be in last place for too long in a snowball game like civ).
So city 5 should IMO go to the silver site, it's pretty easy to get a workboat out to help its initial growth and the silvers will help our development a lot with a higher happy cap and the commerce we'll get out of it. City 6 will need to be between MCG and (future) Nou Camp, 2S of the fish, else we won't be able to reinforce the front line fast enough if GJ attacks. Tech wise AH and Pottery will be important (after archery for immediate defense), and then sailing. Then we'll be facing a choice again, going the writing route, or maybe masonry priesthood for oracle ? It'll probably be gone by then I suppose. So most likely writing maths, then maybe IW or monotheism for OR and a path to monarchy.
Yeah I expect some harrassment from GJ for doing it. Not much we can do about that though! I think it is the right choice, otherwise in 50-60 turns, we will have an awkward border to defend and he will have 1 solid choke point to defend. It would be pretty grim.
Tech path is easiest to discuss. I think forget the oracle. I cannot see it being around by the time we are likely to play for it, and as the marble is tundra it will take a long time to quarry, plus we will likely need hammers to defend against GJ probing us. So definitely hunting next, and as archery is cheap now I am ok going that after. Then either An hus or pottery. I think pottery before animal husbandry might be a better tech route if we have archery for defense, we can delay chariots a bit, plus no garentuee there will be horses. Then I think we should carry on down the writing/maths route. IW we can ignore for the time being as we will be going quite defensive, and better to get our UU cata in play then purely city attacking swords. Sailing should be slotted in there somewhere for the instant trade routes and 30 hammer lighthouses. If we are going archery, then I think we can actually found the silver city as city 4, before the copper city. Copper city is quite far from all our other spots so worker support will be awkward, and pre borders it does not have any food, just the copper. It will take a lot of worker turns to road to it, and mine the copper, where 1-2 archers will prevent GJ doing much to us except from using the wheat on city 3. The silver city can have a WB from the cap to claim the fish instantly and can be whipped 2-1 until there are the squares mined for it to be useful past size 2. The other option for city 4 would be one of the sheep locations, as they are closer to where our workers will be.
Defending with archers is risky, remember that GJ is aggressive so with just one promo he gets 50% odds against an archer in a hill city. I could go with settling the silver as city 4, but only if we go AH after archery to get chariots in line.
Turn is half played, the problem is that we now have 3 workers and not too much to do except roading. The western worker should perhaps mine the grassland hill ? The eastern ones will need to road towards city 3 but is it the next priority ? My current state of mind is mine the hill and insta road the tile where Neuer currently is, and avoid chopping more than 2 or 3 forests before maths cos' it's a waste of hammers. I'll do that this afternoon if you can't stop by and stop me.
I kinda agree and disagree with you there. Regarding this turn I think we should do this:
 Firstly poly NT! At worst a dice roll chance to get it. therefore I think we should overflow into a workboat. We can get 12/30 this turn working a 2/1/0 forest. Then the unnamed worker (named Joe Hart after his lovely penalty save in the game of 4 penalties yesterday) goes to chop that forest. Whilst I agree it is nice to hold onto forests, chopping the work boat is needed there, the returns will be bigger than saving a forest and we are a long way off maths. Then one of the workers should go into the forest 2NE of MCG and one road 1NE of MCG. We need to start the road to that next site. It is gonna take a lot of worker turns and be a pain. We know that tile is safe from barbs with where our warriors were at the start of the turn (they can't spawn in the first square of fogged area outside your vision) so moving to the 2NE square not only starts the road but also spawn busts for next turn. EDIT actually scratch that. Send Hart to mine for 1t as otherwise we start having 1gpt for units outside borders. Then if we get poly he can move to chop it NT, and be joined by whichever worker roads the tile 1NE of MCG to chop the forest as soon as it is in our borders. I think after we should overflow the hammers into another worker there, then switch to growth on a warrior and 2-1 slave the worker when able. Regarding archer defence, that is true, but he has to get the copper under cultural control first, then mine it, then road it, then think about building a unit there. That is a lot of turns. We can dig our archer in nicely who will be valuable against either a chariot or axe or spear. plus axe on hill vs agg axe isn't that great for odds for defense anyway. I think we need to try and pick up the eco and city 4 picking up some silvers will be the best way to do that. If he gets copper online fast then maybe rethink. Also chariots are only so so here. 1 spear as stack defence makes chariots useless against a stack of a few axes 1 spear, it would more be disruption than anything. Now one thing we need to discuss is next turn do we want to show GJ both warriors? I think one should move there definitely, but 2? 2 looks rather aggressive and may make him speed up a settler production to claim that site, which even with our good road network I do not want to leave to chance. What do you think? I have visions of him 2 worker roading onto the copper, getting 2 warriors ready to be there next turn and causing mischief... Probably over stating his production a bit there (especially as his cap is size 5 and needs MP) but need to think of everything.
October 19th, 2014, 07:34
(This post was last modified: October 19th, 2014, 07:34 by AdrienIer.)
I do think 2 or 3 chops will be needed for the WB and getting a settler faster but I'd rather hold on to some of them for future wonderbuilds. Hart is mining the hill, Neuer and Courtois have started roading. Our settler is due in 3 turns, plus the time it'll take to get it there, for GJ it could take 2 turns to get up the hill so we should perhaps play it low, but what truly worries me is his power graph that has spiked a lot recently. Could he have teched archery ?
No they don't have archery. They have had a 4k, 2k, 1k and 4k increase since we last analysed. The 1k is growth again. The 2k is without any score increase so I assume a warrior. The first 4k is with a score increase, so I believe either the wheel 4k or an hus and a warrior 2k each. The wheel makes more sense though. The last 4k is hard to explain. It comes with no score increase or decrease and we know they haven't whipped. 2 wars? I cannot see them going war first build in the new city and working a mine to get it out ASAP. Seems a little unlikely.
So definitely no archery as that is 6k one off, but I am unsure what exactly they have built... They cannot have built a chariot as they can't have both the wheel and an hus. Going by numbers I cannot see how it can be anything but 2 warriors last turn, but that doesn't feel right. http://www.civfanatics.com/civ4/strategy...aphics.php You're the math graduate. Any possibility I am missing? I have thought of sailing and a galley build but that just seems far fetched. Barracks is 3k which wouldnt fit in with no score increase for the pop adding 1k. Think of it as simultaneous equations. We know the end point and we have a list of things it could be, and have to slot it all together :P |