WW35: Not Another TPS Report [Game Thread]

[zakalwe]

Instead, he's got me at ~90% scum, so he wants me to bust my ass off, proving my innocence by proving that you are scum.

If he has both the time and conviction that he claims, there should have been a last minute post hammering home all the reasons why I'm scum, in the event that he dies.

Jabbz

[zakalwe]

Why did Q claim to have scanned Lewwyn, if he killed Mattimeo? Both a tracker and a watcher could catch him in that lie.

I think Mattimeo was killed by a ninja.

[zakalwe]

Jkaen, Jabbz knows that he's busted. He's not going to talk me out of voting for him. So now he's waiting to see how you will react.

If I were scum, I would have killed Jabbz and tried to pit Molach against you.

[Jkaen]

Shit just lost an argument due to the shitty Internet here. Zak seemed very quick to accuse me with no basis.

Last night I was already thinking you were the last scum. Voting for you after Molach's flip didn't take much thought.

Hmm. Jkaen, how would you feel about jumping back down the rabbit hole and lynching Jabbz?

Jabbz wanted Fenn to shoot me instead of Q.

Today, he's being surprisingly open-minded. Frankly, I expected him to be completely blinded by confirmation bias at this point, judging by his recent play.

Zak, this makes no sense, you go from saying voting me didnt take much thought to talking about joining up to go after Jabbz. You say he is being open minded, then that he isnt saying anything.

The whole logic last night was we assumed it was either Q or Jabbz lying. We find out it was Q, so whats the logic behind his lynch now?

Zakalwe

[zakalwe]

The logic was that at least one of them was lying. There's no reason why they can't both be scum. Remember, both Q and TT were scum. This is just more of the same.

Last night I was thinking Jabbz was town and that he was utterly convinced that I'm scum. I had a strong town read on Molach, too. So you had to be the last scum.

But when the day started, Jabbz didn't act at all like expected. He was so sure I was scum that he asked Fenn to shoot me instead of Q. But his opening post was very open-minded. So I reconsidered, and decided that he's actually not suspecting me at all. He's just scum with Q and the rest of them, and that's why he asked Fenn to shoot me. After I accused him, he's been silent, because he wanted to see how you'd react.

[Jkaen]

Would like to hear from jabbz at this point i admit

[Jabbz]

Allright. Last stretch, just a little over 24 hours to go. Lets get it done.

[Jabbz]

Allright, this is a damn good place to start.

When the night ends I'll be busy so my first posts tomorrow will likely come some 6-8 hours into the day.

For now, I'll start posting some general defense. (No accusations in this post. That's on purpose.)

First and foremost, consider my general activity level. People who have played a lot with me, such as Meiz, will recognize that as my town game. As scum I am much more lazy, simply because I can't find the same motivation.

Citing someone not in game, whom we can't question regarding your activity. Cute. Further, if you're in a game with 5 scum, a new style, a very active (at the start moderator), and a high number of players, there is more for you to get involved with. This is nothing but a fluff statement that has absolutely no meaning in the discussion today. Nice try though.

That massive reread and reevaluation that I did over the past few days would not happen if I were scum. In general, I've been digging into everything and everybody. I was the first to question Jabbz on his doctor claim, but I was also the first to question Q's claim, asking him why he asked to be jailed. I wanted TT to claim in full, before Azarius, and picked apart his claim when he did so. On day one I had a spot-on analysis of one of Lewwyn's scumposts, and helped to put him under great pressure. I had Novice on my radar early on and voted quickly to lynch him, before it was clear that he was doomed. If anyone could get away with "believing" his claim it would surely be me.

You also did the same with virtually everyone. You gave yourself cover, so that no matter who was town, and who was scum, you could point at a post and say "see! I did X! I am not scum." You never really committed to anything until it was clear that things were going south. I'm sure I could dig up a number of posts where you lay the groundwork to later claim both Jkaen and I are both scum and town, so you could push, or defend accordingly.

I gather that the case against me will revolve around my "cooperation" with Q. Yes, he had me in his pocket for much of the game, but I was reevaluating him on several occasions (and posting my thought process). But he played very well and had me fooled. Towards the end I was still willing to see him shot by Fenn, because that seemed to give us pretty good chances overall. I kept going in circles and felt that at least one of Jabbz and Q must be scum. I think that shows pretty clearly in the posting I did after Fenn's push. Jabbz would of course not struggle with that uncertainty, but it did seem like Molach was just about equally unsure as me. All I can say is that I am impressed by Fenn's confidence.

See above. This is exactly why you use this style of play. Unfortunately it leaves a trail, if someone pays attention to the posts that are both positive and negative towards players on an individual level.

If you think Q and I were working together so blatantly, why all the distancing that we've seen between the other known scum, and between me and them? Holistically, it doesn't make sense. Compare Q's interactions with TT to his interactions with me. He was playing me, and leaning on my arguments when that was convenient. That's not how scum buddies play. Compare his night 1 and day 4 reads on me that I posted earlier. Like Fenn said, he was starting to set me up for a mislynch. When I called him on it, he backtracked, and soon enough he was again leaning on me with several "what Zak said" comments. Looks very obvious in hindsight, as always. But it's not collusion.

Actually it looks like something planned in advance. You called him on it and he backtracked? How gentlemanly of him. Its almost like you two have an agreement of sorts. You must have loved the communication with 4 other very talented scum. I think the only reason we are going to win is because you couldn't do it at night as well.

Actually, let's return to day one. I called out Q for his first post and called it terrible. Several votes followed (but not Novice). When Lewwyn logged in, he made a strong push for Q, saying this was a definite "vote to lynch". But next time he was on-line, he completely wimped out and didn't elaborate further on his vote, saying there was no point. What changed? I had moved on, that's what changed. The danger had passed. Lewwyn thought I was about to drive through a lynch on Q and wanted in on it, but then I took a different turn and ended up on Jabbz. That's when Novice decided to join me, and that's when Lewwyn backed off Q and started his attacks on Ichabod and Meiz (and me). So that makes Jabbz look like town, and it also makes me look like town. I was the bull in the china shop, stirring up shit if you will, but I would argue in a good way. Scum were reacting to my moves in a way that indicates we aren't on the same team.

Bolding mine. Absent day chat, they were taking their lead from you? Also, again note my above statement, you do the same with everyone.

Since I kind of let it slip towards the end there, I guess I'll clarify that I don't actually suspect Jabbz anymore. I consider him 99% cleared. My last post was a silly feint that I probably should have dropped. I don't know if he is serious about unconditionally voting for me tomorrow, but I certainly have no interest in lynching him.

This, then a few short hours after day starts, which he "wasn't going to be around for" he suddenly with little to no provocation jumps back on me? Sorry Zak, your style is slick, and it took me a while to catch on to exactly what you are doing, but you're going to fry tonight, in the fires of a thousand shorting motherboards. Give it up, and we won't instagram each stage of your torture.

[Jabbz]

Yes, turns out I'm a little less busy than I thought I would be.

This is no surprise at all. It's a way for him to get the jump on the day, drop some shit, and then move on. I don't know about you Jkaen, but I full expected this.

Is there anything specific about my play that you think is scummy? That would make it easier to defend.

I think if you reread everything after Fenn's push for Q, in particular, you will see a big difference between me and Jkaen. I actually tried to reevaluate and posted many points both for and against Q. So even though I landed on the wrong conclusion, it was an honest effort. Jkaen just stayed silent and we got very little insight in his thought process.

Jkaen hasn't made any enemies in this game. That's usually how scum operate. If I'm scum, why would I work so hard to antagonize you? The reason we clashed is that I'm town who was struggling to trust you. If I were scum, you would not find me so annoying.

Pushing hard for you Jkaen. He knows I have tons of towncred, so he is trying to make me lynch you. He didn't have the help of other wolves for the first time last night, and he is now forced to come up with everything on his own. It's not an insane hinderance, he is a damned talented player, but it shows up in a few posts.

See posts 1540-1545 for a case against Jkaen.

http://realmsbeyond.net/forums/showthrea...#pid521145

A case that was completely ignored by Q.

Look! I'm town! I posted all these things bad against Jkaen which Q ignored. But what about the parts where he claimed you didn't look so bad? Want to bet I can find them? I'd be highly surprised if I didn't. After all, he has been grooming me for a lynch since day 3 when I claimed doc, and he knew he has a strongarm in the hole. Also, still pushing Jkaen.

Shit just lost an argument due to the shitty Internet here. Zak seemed very quick to accuse me with no basis.

Last night I was already thinking you were the last scum. Voting for you after Molach's flip didn't take much thought.

Still pushing Jkaen.

Hmm. Jkaen, how would you feel about jumping back down the rabbit hole and lynching Jabbz?

Zak, if you're town then doing nothing but stirring up shit all game, making no original claims, and supporting every bad decision made is a pretty bad approach. I wont likely be on before end of day resolution. Fenn, I hope you kill zak, he is just trying to get town points so you will kill another town, and hand him the game. Peace out folks.

Jabbz wanted Fenn to shoot me instead of Q.

Today, he's being surprisingly open-minded. Frankly, I expected him to be completely blinded by confirmation bias at this point, judging by his recent play.

Four hours after being 100% adamant about you, he tests the waters on a vote for me. Mind you, he is VERY active in pursuing you. He sees that I am not switching my vote, so instead, he goes to you. He knows I'm on to him at this point. His only chance of victory now lies in convincing you that the guy who claimed when not under pressure, and was vindicated by the presence of a strongarm is scum, because you sure as shit have a good feeling he is scum. He tries to sully me a bit more to muddy the waters, but I'll deal with that in the next post.

As to me being open-minded, yes I am at this point (when I made the first posts of this day) because of the gravity of the situation. I am now casting the vote that will likely decide this game. Every townie wins if I chose right. So yeah, after 14 days of play, I'm going to do my best to do a full analysis, not just a knee jerk reaction because I have a gut feeling this guy is scum.

[Jabbz]

Jabbz wanted Fenn to shoot me instead of Q.

Oops, missed addressing this line.

I wanted Fenn to shoot Zak because the case against Qg would have been easier by far to make. I had my good arguments for why Qg should die, one of which I believe I'll be addressing in response to Zaks absurd ninja argument. Qg would have been a damned easy last day lynch and win for the town. I was positive Zak was scum. I haven't wavered in that since day 2. I just could never find anything solid to stick him with until now. Fenn would have made the last day easier if he had taken out zak, because this discussion would be over already, we would have locked in our votes on Qg, and Brick could have called victory for town.