[SPOILERS] Cheater Hater hates bad advice. BGN gives only bad advice.

[Grimace]

Rule #1 of any crisis: Things are never as good or as bad as they seem at first glance.

[spacetyrantxenu]

You definitely should remember the power of drafting. It came in handy in PB18, you'll recall, and that was just maces.

Also, amphibious knights attacking into rifles, it's madness. No one would do that!

[Cheater Hater]

You definitely should remember the power of drafting. It came in handy in PB18, you'll recall, and that was just maces.

Also, amphibious knights attacking into rifles, it's madness. No one would do that!

You had a million Knights though---seriously, how many Knights did you end up having on those boats?

Another thing about johns's crazy war declaration--it means I'm stuck in a three-way turn split

Based on Civstats it appears that Whosit burned Worms as expected (considering I abandoned it), but Nuremburg held (or Whosit didn't attack it). Now I just have to wait to see if Magdeburg holds--I left most (if not all) of the Rifles in it, but pulled out everything else--we didn't discuss the western front much in the chat/BGN's prior post other than "move some out, but not all", so I just had to make my best guess.

[spacetyrantxenu]

You had a million Knights though---seriously, how many Knights did you end up having on those boats?

Oops, I had a post written up a few weeks ago as I read through your PB18 thread, but I had forgotten to post it. I just added it to your thread over there. I don't remember the number but I think the boats were almost full as I sailed up your east coast after attacking Annie.

Edit: PB18 spoilers for players still alive over there, so to BGN and any other current PB18 survivors.

http://realmsbeyond.net/forums/showthrea...#pid540459

[Cheater Hater]

Well, it's an interesting turn I guess--Whosit front, johns front, and domestic pictures are all available.
Good News: No unexpected things on the Whosit front--Worms got burned, but other than that Whosit's stack has just disappeared into the fog. I'm honestly wondering if I should try to make peace with Whosit so I can focus on johns. I do have to worry about all my northern cities, but my Knights have shown up in Nuremburg so I can play some zone defense if necessary.
Bad News: Magdeburg did get burned, but I feel like I got horrible luck or something--I had something like 6 Rifles, 2 LKs and a Spear in there, and I only killed ~13 units (9 Cats, 4 Knights). I forgot to check the actual combat odds, but it feels bad even with bombarding the city to 0% defense and all the collateral--he even got three Cat retreats and a Knight retreat.

I don't think I should lose anymore cities unless something catastrophic and unexpected happens on Whosit's turn--all of my cities on johns's front are safe (since the main stack isn't in range of Vienna and none of the other cities have two-movers in/near them), and thus the only fear is what Whosit has waiting the the fog. After that, I'll get the Great Person out of Vienna (which is guaranteed not to be a merchant or scientist), pop my 3-person GA, swap to Nationhood and Slavery (nothing else, right? I'm already in Theocracy), and draft a bunch in all those marginal eastern cities. Other than those drafts, how much should I be whipping/drafting?

Other than that, the major thing that happened this turn was I attached the first GG (I got another one on the johns attack at Magdeburg which popped in Bas-Tyra I haven't used yet) to the warrior in Rillanon, promoted it, moved it to Nuremburg, and upgraded it. Other than the free extra Rifle, this also unlocked both HE and West Point for me. Where should I build those (I'm assuming I want them together), and should I start them now or after the war? After Rillanon, my best hammer cities are Bas-Tyra and Prague, and since I want Wall Street in Bas-Tyra (for my shrine), that leaves Prague as the default? Or should I try to make a hammer city with a bunch of workshops somewhere and build the stuff there?

[Cheater Hater]

T197: Whosit, johns, Domestic
Neither johns nor Whosit have made any major moves, so instead I moved up a bunch of troops at Johnny Oro. He only has 10 units in range, and I moved up 5 Rifles, 1 Mace, and 6 Cats, and I now have the super Knight stack in range (20 Knights), along with the 2-move GG Rifle. I haven't done any sims, but if I can't take and keep Johnny Oro with that stack I deserve to lose the war.

I don't know if you're still around BGN, but I should I be looking towards peace with Whosit?

Also, I did pop a Great Artist and used the 3-person Golden Age, swapping to Nationhood/Slavery and doing the three drafts (but no whips yet). I don't know what my plans are with johns after taking Johnny Oro, but I don't know how much more I can do without getting Whosit out of this war and building/upgrading a lot more Cavs.

[Boldly Going Nowhere]

Sorry, not around in any condition to help with civ. Knock out whosit by any means possible then conquer johns. Don't stop pushing until he's gone. Need land. Draft, whip, kill.

Good luck.

God help you if you take my advice with 100% sincerity. But you need land. Don't be afraid to waste your poor commerce cities for a proper army.

[Cheater Hater]

Sorry, not around in any condition to help with civ. Knock out whosit by any means possible then conquer johns. Don't stop pushing until he's gone. Need land. Draft, whip, kill.

Good luck.

God help you if you take my advice with 100% sincerity. But you need land. Don't be afraid to waste your poor commerce cities for a proper army.

I mean, it's not like any advice you give is going to matter--Adrien/Old Harry have declared on me now
Are you sure I can't just concede to Elum now? I can't defend a 3v1, even if I have Rifles and some opponents don't have Muskets, and even if I don't lose that many cities I'm hopelessly behind Elum in tech, especially since he'll get Observatories soon.

[GermanJoey]

Yes, you can't concede now.

[Cheater Hater]

Well, I skipped a turn, so we have a lot of pictures to dump here: T198, as well as four T199 folders: Adrien, johns, Whosit, and Domestic. Let's go through all these in order:

Adrien: I lost Strassburg obviously (even though I managed to kill a lot of Adrien's units attacking out first, he just has 500 units in that stack), though my hope is that I can keep Luxemburg since I stuffed enough units into it. The turn has rolled, and I kept it through that at least, since Adrien wasn't going to attack in with just Knights. Next turn will be more interesting if Adrien decides to move up the stack, since I can theoretically hit it with my Cats. If I had to guess, Adrien wants to wait until his Cats/Praets catch up, so I have a couple turns to shuttle units over.

johns: I did capture Johnny Oro last turn as expected, and still have a bunch of units in the area. The big problem is that johns has moved his stack into Fistful of USD, and it can actually hit Johnny Oro this turn if he wanted to. Right now Johnny Oro has a ton of units in it, but most of them are damaged. I shoved a bunch of other units in there (as well as other things like upgrading my GG Medic Chariot to a Cav), and hopefully it'll hold (just because my top defender is a CG2 Rifle).

Whosit: Still nothing--he rejected my peace deal, but I still haven't seen him move any stacks up.

Domestic/other stuff: The big news in the turn is that Elum finally declared...on ipecac
That's basically the worst case scenario for me as far as Elum's actions are concerned--not only does it mean Whosit doesn't have to worry as much about getting attacked from Elum, it means ipecac is tied up and can't resume the war with Adrien. Unfortunately I'm starting to lose city visibility on ipecac (which obviously isn't my highest priority right now), so I can't tell how much Elum is committing--I see a couple Galleons, and a bunch of ipecac troops on defense, but I don't have visibility right on the land border.

Right now I'm just waiting on johns to play, so I can see what's going on with all three fronts :/