Caster of Magic "Watch List" spell and ability balancing

[Asfex]

1.You must able to kill great drake to animate it and gain control permanently. animated units is not so powerful as original - it can not heal and can de dispel eviled,and target for different life spells.
Just try to play pure death wizard against a strong life opponent - and you will see that permanent control under undeads is not overpowered.
2. The way you want to improve balance is to remove the unic ability, (like "get control permanently") but this way is similar to remove any magic from this game - and make this like non-magic strategic game. I disagree with this approach.

[Seravy]

2. The way you want to improve balance is to remove the unic ability, (like "get control permanently") but this way is similar to remove any magic from this game - and make this like non-magic strategic game. I disagree with this approach.

Wait, wasn't the ability to keep the units unofficial? It has been a very long time ago but I thought it was 1.2 and below only, and an update removed it.

Wiki says :

If the reanimated unit was part of the enemy's army at the start of the battle, it will never make it out of the battle alive. Such a unit will automatically be destroyed once the battle is over. It is not possible to keep this unit at all after the battle. Casting Word of Recall on the unit in an attempt to circumvent this will simply cause it to be destroyed automatically.

Insecticide isn't mentioned, so I assume this is 1.31 behavior.

"get control permanently" is fine, Spell Binding also does that, however
-This is automatic, no resistance roll is done so any unit can be taken 100% chance
-The spell is very undercosted compared to the unit gained. Even if I consider the "undead" trait and say an undead Wyrm is only worth half as much as a normal one, I still get a value 500 unit for only 50.

To "get control permanently" of an enemy unit, in an automatic way without a resistance roll, a fair cost would be more in the 200-500 range than 50, considering the unit needs to be killed first. Such a cost can only be paid overland so it's not suitable for a combat spell.

Using it on own units is fine because you already had to pay for it, you are only extending the unit's lifespan a little.

Take a look at Spell Binding, it costs 1000 to take something that also costs ~1000 and it's very very powerful. Animate Dead would take units that cost 1000 for 50.

Posted by Asfex - Today 09:47
1.You must able to kill great drake to animate it and gain control permanently.

It works in a chain, at least in my experience. You get one drake somehow first, maybe get lucky on Word of Death, or use Death Knights or have a good hero . Then you use that drake to kill another and get that one. You keep doing this until all enemies are killed and you still have at least one drake remaining. You then move to the next node, and kill everything the same way. As long as the units are roughly equal strength, the one you animated will be able to kill the next so you can always replace it with another.

[Asfex]

"Spell Binding automatic" I think you like this feature, becouse you make dispel magic automatic ....
I do not like this approach. However, i agree the spell binding is underpriced.

About death - yes, its a death specific to make "chain of undead". Death is a "rush" , till it encounter life wizard, then it becomes suck. Death can win everything and fast, except life...
This idea is implemented in vanilla.
If you decide death can live with life - you must redesign all: balance bless, righteousness, make -1 toHit penalty from prayer, counter high prayer, make protection from dispel evil and holy avenger... Make alternative for healing..
Do something with high resistance enemy units.... and invent something to protect from "Death And Life wizard"... Do you have concept? Or you just remove the advantage of death over all other schools of magic, whereas death can be beaten by life?

[Seravy]

"Spell Binding automatic" I think you like this feature, becouse you make dispel magic automatic ....
I do not like this approach. However, i agree the spell binding is underpriced.

About death - yes, its a death specific to make "chain of undead". Death is a "rush" , till it encounter life wizard, then it becomes suck. Death can win everything and fast, except life...
This idea is implemented in vanilla.
If you decide death can live with life - you must redesign all: balance bless, righteousness, make -1 toHit penalty from prayer, counter black prayer, make protection from dispel evil and holy avenger...
Do something with high resistance enemy units.... and invent something to protect from Death And Life wizard... Do you have such concept?

I like "automatic", it's the cost that is the problem. Animating a 500+ cost unit for 50 and keeping it is too powerful.

I need to play a game with Death where there is a Life wizard first. In my previous game no one had Life Books and I was completely unstoppable.
I assume a working tactic can be using drain power, warp node, mana leak and city curses to deny resources, and overrun them with undead and zombies. Even if they will get killed the AI has to spend lots of mana on it while you get them for free with Zombie Mastery, so they'll run out of mana eventually.
Alternatively, you can take over the remaining 75-80% of the world, offer some tributes and maintain peace until Spell of Mastery.
Only works if the Life wizard is alone though.
You might also find non-Death books and win using other spells.

I might need to change some Life spells too but haven't had the chance to test this situation yet.

If all else fails, you can summon a champion, create or find some artifacts, and win that way, too.

[Asfex]

of cause, death mage can use other way to reach victory, but death school can not offer help against good life magic in vanilla.
Also, useing undeads and dark ritual with inspiration and prosperity, death channel with altar of battle, berserker with healing and invulnerability - it seems too strong combination,