Dare you enter the Whizzard's Realm? Magic and Mysteries abide.

[El Grillo]

Mining Inc is +1h per resource on Standard. I'm not entirely sure how the corporate cost modified are applied, I can certainly take a look at that. If they are indeed reduced by courthouses, I think Environmentalism would be the better choice. As for food corps, Sid's Sushi gives fewer food per resource, but there are simply a ton more sushi resources on the map (also why it costs more gpt). With courthouses and representation, I think running merchants with the excess food makes up for the higher cost, and that's without even considering the culture.

EDIT: After WB testing, Environmentalism's maintenance costs do get reduced by Courthouses.

[ReallyEvilMuffin]

Ok. Currently control or shortly control over 24 mining inc resources, and 27 sids sushi resources vs 16 cereal mills ones. Very little food difference surprisingly...

[El Grillo]

Sushi is 0.5 food per resource, Cereal is 0.75 food per resource. Unfortunately, those windmills on the metal islands would need to be swapped to mines.

[ReallyEvilMuffin]

Sushi is 0.5 food per resource, Cereal is 0.75 food per resource.

Aye, 12 food for cereal, 13.5 for sids. Also note sids ones are much harder to protect and in a protracted war hard to keep up... But refrigeration is further away.

[El Grillo]

The good news is that the ruleset bans using air unit bombardment to pillage tile improvements. You're right that nets are much harder to keep protected.

[ReallyEvilMuffin]

The other big thing is our next civic switch. Note we have 5 turns of peace with mackoti left. Not next turn, but the turn after we can swap civics again. Clearly we need out of draft and I would say back into beuro currently. Only an extra 13ish gpt but it is around an extra 32 commerce, which then goes to an extra 100sci through the modifiers. Also the hammers would be nice too.

What other civics do we use? I am thinking OR over theocracy currently as whipping out a lot of buildings all over, and we have a big army. Indeed if we are adding much currently it will be adding machine guns which don't really get much from promotions. At least 5 turns.

But do we also try and plug for caste? I think that that would be a mistake and prompt mack to fly at us personally...

My plan - switch to OR/beuro, keep slavery as insurance. Whip out buildings in the netherlands and some levees. Also bank/market/grocer in the planned corp HQ (thinking Baradur, as we could chuck a shrine in there. Currently worth 30 gpt, and gaining all the time as I convert the new Dutch cities. Through the modifiers would probably be worth it) we could even get Wall Street in there which would be a good idea. Or we could get it in Hogwarts and use that as a merchant city boosted through the Wall street.

[Nicolae Carpathia]

Agreed with most of the statements. Only point is I think we shouldn't float too much gold, any bonuses to gold/research come from multipliers to each, while bureau boosts commerce, which is agnostic to both sides of the slider.

Also, our priority for the two cities bordering Peaks will be to pop the out the borders, to minimise the salient it forms. And if we have the opportunity, he should try and snipe Peaks, we have better units and it would be useful to clear out his trash units (because even for the next few eras, 'phracts are useful for clearing up redlined units and absorbing hits). And if he wants to cash in his population and slam them into first striking Machine Guns (Peaks is an excellent spot to put a few), he is welcome to do so. And with our EP advantage, we'll be able to see if Mackoti tries to swing something around the back. So a short limited war to grab a nice chokepoint city that makes full use of our Machine Guns. Let's keep some combat workers around just in case Mackoti burns the roads leading up to Peaks.

Also, we still don't have a Shrine? If that's the case, maybe it's not worth putting Wall Street in Baraddur, because the payback on it may not be as valuable as burning it as part of a golden age sprint ahead to the next timing.

[ReallyEvilMuffin]

Agreed with most of the statements. Only point is I think we shouldn't float too much gold, any bonuses to gold/research come from multipliers to each, while bureau boosts commerce, which is agnostic to both sides of the slider.

Also, our priority for the two cities bordering Peaks will be to pop the out the borders, to minimise the salient it forms. And if we have the opportunity, he should try and snipe Peaks, we have better units and it would be useful to clear out his trash units (because even for the next few eras, 'phracts are useful for clearing up redlined units and absorbing hits). And if he wants to cash in his population and slam them into first striking Machine Guns (Peaks is an excellent spot to put a few), he is welcome to do so. And with our EP advantage, we'll be able to see if Mackoti tries to swing something around the back. So a short limited war to grab a nice chokepoint city that makes full use of our Machine Guns. Let's keep some combat workers around just in case Mackoti burns the roads leading up to Peaks.

Also, we still don't have a Shrine? If that's the case, maybe it's not worth putting Wall Street in Baraddur, because the payback on it may not be as valuable as burning it as part of a golden age sprint ahead to the next timing.

Note your first point - yes it does multiply commerce, however then that multiplied commerce goes through 210% of research multiplier buildings instead of 50% multiplier buildings, so a net effect of being more efficient way of using the gold. We have quite high expenses now mind with the conquest cities coming online often without a courthouse. Full tech is around a 250 gpt loss, so we will have around 5 turns of full tech gold that we can burn. I have done the calculations in my head and I am 95% sure that we can turn on tech next turn and still get corporation in 3 turns.

Re peaks - not a bad idea. It depends on what he does with it. However I think it is a poor idea to try to hold it. He has full naval control of that area, and his city is only 3 tiles away so for a fair while he will have cultural control right up to the city. That is a recipie for loosing a lot of troops should the war continue. The issue is if we take that, we are unlikely to get peace from him, and El Grillo is right in that he can very cost effectively whip a lot of population into troops. However we will be the ones that can war/peace - do we do just that and hope he gives us peace? We should get a fair idea of his intentions when the time is near. He is blasting roads left/right/centre, but mainly because I am getting most of the cottages first. We will have plenty of workers in the area as I will be rebuilding the tile improvements there as a priority. I'm trying to whip up some possible fast strike force out in the west too actually for possibly some cheeky razes, but I'm sure he will garrison up in time.

Of course we don't have a shrine yet! No GP. We've had 3 GEs (for AP/Taj/SM) 1 GSci still held for the planned GA and the next due in 2t from Hogwarts a mishmash of probabilities, but over 50% GE mixing with spy/prophet/sci/merchant points. Sci is next most likely if it isn't a GE.

Really depends what we get in 2 turns from Hogwarts, then about 12 turns from Whizzards Tower. That's also a mashup, but around 50% GP. Theoretically could be all Gscis.

[El Grillo]

GG, it's been fun! I must admit I was looking forward to seeing if the corporate mining economy could compete with Kremlin State Property. At least this way you never had to obsolete the monk economy :D

[ReallyEvilMuffin]

GG, it's been fun! I must admit I was looking forward to seeing if the corporate mining economy could compete with Kremlin State Property. At least this way you never had to obsolete the monk economy :D

Yeah I really wanted to see the corporation powerhouse in action too! Pushing the 20 odds hammers through the beuro multiplier would have been fun and we had plenty of gold to spread it. Although it was only a 50% chance!

We would have been struggling to get out of nationalism as we were needing the barracks happy in a few cities, although we would be gaining incense at the roll. RMOG declined our peace deal.

If Mack had sat blocking us being able to navally take that last RMOG city we would have been crippled by war weary for the rest of the game - probably would have had to have built jails in every city to combat it, and fighting in the ex Dutch land would have added to our war weary too. So we had challenges, but a larger and more modern force.

He had more hpt output and like double food, but with the new cities we would quickly have been on top again before we consider possible mining inc. our tech rate I believe was at least equivalent if it better and we were definitely ahead in beakers. We also still had our 1 man GA with the GS to throw.

I wish it hadn't have been called off, it was by no means a done thing at all but I reckon we could have pulled it off. I would have tipped it about 2/3 1/3 odds of winning in our favour personally.


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