RBP3 - [SPOILERS] - Team DIM (Mehmed of HRE)

[Ilios]

Welcome back Dazed!

The thing with the Iron city, is that it is completely safe, and won't cost us a lot in upkeep from the outset.

But I have been toying with the idea to put the National Epic in Singa, and that Sheep tile will come in hand for sure for that. So I was thinking, maybe it would be better to use the settler from singa to claim red dot first. (once the wheat tile is irrigated, it will have two 5-food tiles), and use the Incan settler to claim black dot, as it won't cost us a lot in upkeep.

Green dot will have to take a back seat in that case, but should be claimed once Singa has been fully converted to a GP farm city (meaning we should add a few more grassland farms)

I'm just worried we don't have the military yet to push that far east, but I guess we'll just have to take that gamble (once DIM is ready to pump units, we should alternate the Horse Archers with an occasional Longbow).

[dazedroyalty]

I definitely understand te concern about defense. I'd we look at who's near the double sheep location, what would be our threat level? For that matter, where do you think our greatest threat potential is right now? Do we expect any response from other allies of Egypt if we raise his holy city?

[Ilios]

I definitely understand te concern about defense. I'd we look at who's near the double sheep location, what would be our threat level? For that matter, where do you think our greatest threat potential is right now? Do we expect any response from other allies of Egypt if we raise his holy city?

I think the threat level would be low initially, as I don't plan to personally commit troops to the raid (instead, I plan on gifting two Horse Archers to India they can use however they want), because the more people are involved, the less chance there is of miscommunication, stupid moves, etc.

The problem with the double sheep site is that it will take a while to become economically viable and will be a logistical nightmare for a long time. I'd rather not plop cities down without the military to secure them and the workers to improve them.

I'd rather stake our claim in the east with the Sheep/Stone site (which we should be able to found in about 5-6 turns), as both resources are in the first ring. We should have workers there improving the city right after founding.

Once that city is up and running, it will be a good base of operations for further expansion plans in the east.

[Ilios]

Ok so Inca founded another 2 cities in the same turn. So while some of CUDDLE are busy increasing economic infrastructure or gearing up for war, they are happily claiming land, with the knowledge that they will get the fruits of our research.

I am not amused, and I plan on discussing this with them. Multiple Settler/Worker donations and Settling rights are all to be discussed before I give them Civil Service, and that will be the last tech I will be handing out for free.

For the moment, this is what every member contributes to the cause.

India: Military hardware and lead attacker on Krill's lands
Ottomans: Paper + Drama
Portugal: Feudalism
Byz: Machinery and eventually Guilds
Aztec: Missionary spam to fuel Shrine gold

That leaves two Teams not really pulling their weight.

Inca: nuff said..
Rome: I think I plan on asking for some military hardware as compensation for Civil Service

[dazedroyalty]

Ok so Inca founded another 2 cities in the same turn.

This is irritating. I'm sure they think they're "taking advantage" of opportunities but the truth is that if the alliance comes out on top, the first targets are going to be the teams that didn't pull their weight!

I am not amused, and I plan on discussing this with them. Multiple Settler/Worker donations and Settling rights are all to be discussed before I give them Civil Service, and that will be the last tech I will be handing out for free.

Agreed.

Rome: I think I plan on asking for some military hardware as compensation for Civil Service

I don't see how they can refuse to give something in exchange for any tech, much less Civil Service.

[Ilios]

Ok I sent this over to the team:

CUDDLE,


It would seem that the information I received from several sources regarding the number of beakers gained for bulbing a tech with a GP (other than GS) is not entirely correct. I was told that you get 1000 + number of population x 10 beakers, while in fact, at least for the settings of PB3, you get 1000 + number of population x 2 beakers. This means that I will not be able to bulb Civil Service this turn with the Great Merchant.

I take full blame, as I should have played safe and kept research at 100%, even if that would have meant wasting beakers.

I have cranked research back to 100%, and with some careful microplanning, and if Portugal could give me Feudalism this turn for the discount, I hope to be able to get it next turn (T106).

If someone could check the calculation, I currently have 132 raw beakers per turn, with 140 beakers invested in Civil Service (costing 1440 beakers) so far, and the Great Merchant giving 1062 beakers. Feudalism and CoL give an extra 40% bonus (discount?), and Civil Service is currently known by 6 other teams.

I could increase beakers by a tad more, but that would mean switching workers to more scientists and starving some cities of food and production, so if someone could let me know if my configuration will be enough to get Civil Service next turn, I would be much obliged...


Ilios - DIM

Any lurker that could help me out with the calculation?

[Ilios]

Ok we got this from Ruff:

Sorry about that. I was concerned about the 1000 / 1500 (GSc) but missed the pop x 10. I think it is pop x 3 for a GSc and (as you said), pop x 2 for others.

The easiest way to check your calcs is to use the Great Merch to bulb the tech (unless you have pop growing next turn, but only 2 beakers isn't worth it) and then mm'ing to get the number of beakers needed. Discounts and Pre-Req don't come into play with bulbing.

Re the maths, I think it is raw x (1 + pre-req bonus (20% each) + known bonus).

Known bonus = 30% (known / alive) = 30% x 6 / 14 = 12%

So your beakers towards the tech are 132 x (1 + .20 + .12) = 174

1440 - 140 - 1062 - 174 = 64 short.

With Feud ... beakers towards the tech are 132 x (1 + .40 + .12) = 200

1440 - 140 - 1062 - 200 = 38 short.

Ruff

So by hiring another Scientist and building research in 4 out of 5 cities, we manage to get 156 base beakers, which finishes Civil Service next turn. Having to build research sucks, but I really want to switch to Slavery and Bureaucracy next turn.

Needless to say, we're n° 1 GNP this turn, with n° 2 trailing far behind...

[Ilios]

Email from Ottomans:

Hi DIM

It's been a while, so we'd just like to share some thoughts/idea's etc that we've thought of and would like to hear your opinion on them.

Firstly, we would like to create a road network so that our mighty civilizations can quickly reach each other, for whatever reason that would be for. Fortunately, the city of MB makes this project much less difficult. Looking at the map, it seems the only tile that you have to road in your borders is the grass hill 1SW of MB which connects to our borders. Is there a possibility that you could road this tile sometime soon? We can quickly finish the road on our side of the border to complete this marvel.

Secondly, we were wondering if you have a sentry net up on the E side of the lake between the lake and your city. Usually it wouldn't matter but we are paranoid of a English stack being sent our way and there is a route where it could slip by you by hugging the Eastern side of the lake. Given that you are much closer to the area of interest and have an active NAP with England, is it possible that you could watch the area between Singa Malta and the Great lake for PAT stacks? (BTW, thanks for the head's up on the English HA)

Finally, we'd like to share with you an idea that we've been thinking about recently. As you know, India is planning to send some HA's over to Egypt's Hindu holy city. What we are thinking about is that we quickly build an army while India is building/organising/sending the HA's and attack Egypt's border city at around about the same time in a co-ordinated strike (exact date unknown but we are guessing ~T115). While this is still in the planning stages, we think that, if we can pull it off, India's attack on Egypt is more likely to suceed or at least we can distract some troops from that front. While this would be very helpful, we aren't sure that we can make enough units in time for this plan to suceed. We would probably need some assistance from yourself and/or Inca to pull this off. What I am asking is are you willing to help us in this mission by contributing some units to us (most likely HA's since they can get to us quickly)?

Anyway, just wanted to hear your opinion on these things. We look forward to your response.

Enough Talking!
WarriorKnight of A4

Hmm, I think we could possibly spare another couple of HA to arrive on time, but nothing more. I really would like to start building up our defenses...

[dazedroyalty]

It's so much more challenging to get enough military in MP because we can't rely on those predictable AIs.

As to helping the Ottomans, I'm not sure about what we can do. The last thing I want is to overcommit our alliance forces to multiple objectives and then fail to realize any of them. I'd like to hear/see some more intel before deciding that was worth it. I can see the benefit of harrassing them on their backlines so Egypt doesn't just have paper defense in place. However, I think the main thrust and most of our contribution needs to go to the primary objective of razing Krill's shrine!

[Ilios]

This is what I sent back:

Hi guys,



I think I should be able to finish a road within the next 5-10 turns (need more workers!)


We have Tricky there, our intrepid first warrior, now Woody 2, whose double function is fogbust/sentry. It will remain there, so you can expect a heads up should we spot anything.


That's a tricky one. Because of the Civil Service mishap, we will only be able to start spamming units from our HE City from T110 onwards (we need to build/whip/chop Forge, HE and stables all in three turns...). If you do plan to attack around T115, I'm not sure I could get those units into position in time for the attack. I'm currently very light on units, and both of my spare Horse Archers are currently on their way to India.
One of them is to your north, which I planned on gifting to Ruff for him to run over to India. I'm not sure if he would arrive on time for the attack, so I could move him south to your lands, but I'd need to know when exactly India plan on attacking.
I'd gift you the Horse Archer currently in your borders, but I could only do that if you have a HE unit yourself.
Anyway, let me know what you think.


Regards,


Ilios for DIM

Basically, there is no way we can provide anything for a strike force which needs to be in position around T115, because our entire spare army (2 horse archers...) is on it's way to India.

I'd really like to use the next 10 units DIM will build as garrisson in our cities, to avoid overextending, especially with the new eastern cities.

I suggest a couple of Horse Archers for mobile defense, and then alternate Spearmen for maximum overflow into Longbowmen.

Midas can provide some back up unit building as well, after it has built a worker. I've had to three pop whip the forge, as there were 3 unhappy faces because I needed to move the lone remaining warrior to cover an axe I used to kill a barb axe, only to find a barb warrior next to it.