American Politics Discussion Thread

[Mjmd]

Furthermore, this is a pathetic red herring for the real and directly proven efforts of the Republican party to publicly and overtly overturn the election, as Mjmd has documented at length.

All your "rebuttals" to Mjmd and Miguelito have followed this template:

Sure, we have direct hard evidence of the right restricting voting rights, outright rejecting results, conspiring to rig elections, and trying to stir up a putsch when that all failed, BUT that doesn't really matter because the left might have done [X] similar thing, and since we'll never know for certain, we ought to receive it as a respectable possibility that merits consideration. 

Note that even if the hypothetical was in anyway true or had standing, the argument is still just a sad whataboutism that ignores magnitude.
The layers on this fallacy onion just keep piling up.

Thanks Ginger for saving me time, going to be a busy day.

T-Hawk your arguments just aren't logical. You can't compare a "maybe hypothetically" to a "THEY DID IT!!!!". You can't justify overturning a government because you think the other side is bad and MAYBE did something you can't prove..... I can't stress enough that this is at the pillar of transfer of power that I'm trying to save. Political parties naturally lead to an us vs them mentality. Your basis for overturning a democracy can't be that low or the democracy won't last.

[Charriu]

this is a textbook example burden of proof fallacy. 

“Do you think that they didn’t?” —providing no evidence that they did, just an assumption of intent and character

I'm not talking about proof here.  I'm just talking about general perceptions.  Do you think that election workers on the side that thinks Trump is so horrible would not commit fraud to keep him out of office?

You do realize that election workers are usually from both sides of the aisle. So if you accuse election workers of fraud, you always accuse both parties to commit fraud or knowingly let fraud happen.

[darrelljs]

Now I'm not really sure what the case is for rewarding people living in a small state, or in a rural area for that matter, with a more valuable vote over other citizens, generally I would think one person, one vote is a pretty intuitive rule for rule by the people. Also no idea why an election for a single national office should be held by the states, each according to their own ruleset, but you do you.

Essentially it was a compromise to get the Constitution ratified.

Where I really think the system is a catastrophic failure and why I'm writing, because I haven't seen it pointed out, is the combination of winner takes it all with the elector system.

Again, civics was looooong ago for me, but the framers were interested in preventing government overreach by making it nigh impossible for anything without cross party consensus to pass, and set things up accordingly:



Of course that was ~250 years ago and things have, um, changed.

Darrell

[Mjmd]

I've never watched this youtuber before, but we were talking inflation and supply chain, so thought it might be interesting for some if you have 20 minutes. At the very least it provides an incredible insight into why and how all the cheap stuff from Asia gets to the US.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8d5d_HXGeMA

[Charriu]

Ah Wendover Production. They do good work with their videos. Well researched

[Mjmd]

So I think my main fault with it is they just kind of glazed over fast the part where when supply chains are delayed, it then actually causes more problems. IE your order is delayed, so it reduced on hand inventory, so you order more AND in a faster time frame, and then that causes more problems via further increases in traffic. We had to do some basic games in a supply chain class and that was one of the lessons that really stuck with me is how absurd multi step supply chains can get, especially if just one part overreacts or doesn't manager their one section well.

I did like how it showed how economies have scale have both produced lower costs but also limited ports and options. I know here in Wisconsin a cargo ship docking can cause a news story if it wasn't expected (which has happened during all of this), but the economies of scale / square cube law, just means the great lakes ports aren't very viable sadly.

[Mjmd]

Biden FINALLY made the speech I've been waiting for him to make since he got elected. Its about time and hopefully not too late.....

[superdeath]

Biden FINALLY made the speech I've been waiting for him to make since he got elected. Its about time and hopefully not too late.....

What speech?

[Mjmd]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QWaNkcfFnNc

[superdeath]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QWaNkcfFnNc

Good speech, but honestly aint going to change any minds. Those that are so anti-Biden/democrat/liberal/ect that every word from them is a lie or a huge conspiracy, aren't likely to change their minds. Im not a fan of the guy, but ill give him/his party props for a good speech.