American Politics Discussion Thread

[T-hawk]

Oh come on. We all have seen what happened there. People were smashing windows in to get into congress, they stole stuff from congress, broke into offices, smashed cameras and other equipment from media outlets and you want to tell me this was a peaceful protest expressing general anger?

You are describing vandalism and petty theft, not some treason or insurrection. Occupying a building is not overthrowing a government.

Oh, and the media celebrated far higher levels of destruction when it was for BLM virtue-signaling.

[Mjmd]

So KNOW that members of the proud boys and oath keepers did pre plan disrupting the count. We have some convictions including some guilty pleas for seditious conspiracy. We don't how much connection with the white house there was. Lots of messages to and from Roger Stone are known which is why he is a target of the Jan 6 committee but again exact amount there is still being determined. But yes a small # were there to overthrow the election.

But yes MOST of the Jan 6 rioters probably didn't know exactly what they were going to do when they woke up that morning. It was probably a case of mob mentality leading to rioting again for most.

Now a lot has been made of BLM vs Jan 6 rioting and let me just point out the obvious that this is a case of tu qouque. IE rioting is never good and one side rioting doesn't make it ok for someone else to do. It also is a case of equivalancy as is usual wth tu quoque. On one side we have people mad about racial inequality and treatment up to and including perceived racially motivated killings. Along with a perceived lack of police accountability. On the other side we have a riot started by people believing election lies and that their democracy was in danger.

So how do we address these?

Well on the BLM side acknowledging need for peaceful protests during the day instead of night from community side would help. Government action would be addressing racial inequality and addressing lack of police accountability. Police have an incredible difficult job; it doesn't meant there can't be police accountability. There are probably some other programs and laws gov could do, but general idea is address the problem in a way leading to greater freedom and more gov accountability. Libertarians can't disagree with that goal.

So to avoid Jan 6th style riots we need to do something about the election lies being propagated with no facts to back them up. That means BOTH sides need to quickly denounce people who are propagating. News organizations who are propagating with no facts, should also have a healthy dose of scorn and future skepticism thrown there way from all sides. Sadly somehow we are in a situation where the responsible republicans who have tried to do this have been ostracized from their party and primaried and threatened ect. That means it is up to the voters of all political persuasions to use the 2nd pillar of democracy in accountability and vote anyone out who isn't willing to stand up to these type of lies out as fast as possible.

I'll note for both that mob mentality education should probably be a normal part of high school social studies curriculum.

[Mjmd]

I almost appreciate republicans like Kari Lake. Just coming out and saying you don't believe in democracy and only accept result if you win......

This is why this isn't just a get rid of Trump and it will be better kind of deal. The idea has festered and infected. And half of America is just fine with that    .

[superdeath]

I almost appreciate republicans like Kari Lake. Just coming out and saying you don't believe in democracy and only accept result if you win......

This is why this isn't just a get rid of Trump and it will be better kind of deal. The idea has festered and infected. And half of America is just fine with that    .

Each side believes the other side is full of crazy nutjobs.


The left see's nothing but MAGA supporters and the right see's nothing but trans blue haired communists. Its practically hard-wired into their brains at this point. Hell i cant even argue any politics on facebook with anyone without being told im either a complete supporter of liberal/biden policy "a libtard" or someone who blindly follows republican anti-XYZ things.

If we had a competent 3rd party for the VAST majority of people that actually want to vote for something that isnt super polarizing, i could see the country move forward without sacrificing liberties.

[Jowy]

I almost appreciate republicans like Kari Lake. Just coming out and saying you don't believe in democracy and only accept result if you win......

This is why this isn't just a get rid of Trump and it will be better kind of deal. The idea has festered and infected. And half of America is just fine with that    .

Each side believes the other side is full of crazy nutjobs.


The left see's nothing but MAGA supporters and the right see's nothing but trans blue haired communists. Its practically hard-wired into their brains at this point. Hell i cant even argue any politics on facebook with anyone without being told im either a complete supporter of liberal/biden policy "a libtard" or someone who blindly follows republican anti-XYZ things.

If we had a competent 3rd party for the VAST majority of people that actually want to vote for something that isnt super polarizing, i could see the country move forward without sacrificing liberties.

As a complete outsider, Republicans are actually f'n out of their minds. Even our most right wing party detests American Republicans. Just recently one representive that started rambling on about Covid conspiracies had almost the entire hall walk out, and got kicked out from his party afterwards. Those theories and rhetoric are straight from the American Republican brainrot that spreads through the internet. I hope it is never found acceptable here. It might seem normal if you are from America and don't know any better, and I can't blame you on that. But I'll guarantee it's not normal.

[Mjmd]

I almost appreciate republicans like Kari Lake. Just coming out and saying you don't believe in democracy and only accept result if you win......

This is why this isn't just a get rid of Trump and it will be better kind of deal. The idea has festered and infected. And half of America is just fine with that    .

Each side believes the other side is full of crazy nutjobs.

 Each side normally sees the other as the stupid idiots who are crazy yes. The difference this time is there is a side who isn't willing to perform the key function of democracy and transfer power to them.

Democracy's don't make sense. Imagine living in a house with your whole family. A vote comes on who will lead the household and your idiot relative who drives you crazy takes over the household and completely changes how everything is done. And you just let that happen. Crazy idea!

Democracy's aren't the best form of government due to consistent governing. They are the best forms of government because they solve the problem of transfer of power and accountability. We are in a situation right now where the transfer of power is under attack and there doesn't seem to be accountability from the voters.

[darrelljs]

To be fair what she said was “I’m going to win the election, and I will accept that result”. You could take that as a statement of confidence, but given her track record if she does lose I'm quite sure she'll blame cheating (with or without evidence).

Darrell

[Mjmd]

To be fair what she said was “I’m going to win the election, and I will accept that result”.  You could take that as a statement of confidence, but given her track record if she does lose I'm quite sure she'll blame cheating (with or without evidence).

Darrell

No to be fair about it. Its the most simple question that a candidate 100% should be able to answer with a simple YES after being asked once let alone three times. Honestly its horrifying its a question that has to be asked at all.

[AdrienIer]

The left see's nothing but MAGA supporters and the right see's nothing but trans blue haired communists. Its practically hard-wired into their brains at this point.

That's kinda true, but factually you can look at the new faces of each party. The republicans who win primaries (I'm not talking about old faces retaining their seats) are for the most part super MAGA. I've yet to see any kind of communist in US congress, the most vocal ones are social democrats like AOC.

[Mjmd]

I talked about proving mens rae back in September. The Jan 6th committee had some additional examples they went over in October. Just as a reminder this is literally all Republicans giving this information. The immediate Afghanistan withdraw is what made the news reels, but there is a lot more in here.