American Politics Discussion Thread

[darrelljs]

The hyperbolic meter in this world is pegged at 11/10.

Darrell

[greenline]

ask why all the neighboring muslim countries want nothing to do with them

By that logic any country hemorrhaging refugees is filled with "truly reprehensible" people.

Darrell

To my knowledge, no refugees from, say, South Vietnam or the Boer Republics ever tried violently overthrowing the government of their host country to try and make it fight wars on their behalf, like the Palestinians did in Jordan.

(Talking about the Palestinians or any group of people in this way is a generalization, yes, in the same way talking about any group of people in aggregate is a generalization.)

[BING_XI_LAO]

Its not like China isn't building lots of solar and other renewables, but their incentive structure if memory serves skews towards the cheaper up front coal plants. I don't want them live like rats but I do want them to do better, just like I want the US to do better.

BTW the first 2 articles mention police violence against the protesters and your third article talks about various types of punishment dealt out to environmental protestors. Those were your articles......

Your argument in general seems to think its either fossil fuels or nuclear and you are just ignoring every other renewable. Its going to require work; most things do. There are US states mostly Democrat led but even some Republican states that are moving pretty well towards renewables, but we need to do better. Its not either stone age or burn the planet.

At this point China is building more renewables than coal. They build enough coal to power California and then some each year, but they build several times that amount for hydropower, solar, wind. Also some gas. Also some nuclear. Basically they are building every type at an enormous scale that's probably equal to the rest of the world combined. Oh, and grid batteries.
I used to think renewables were a scam, but now that the technology has improved dramatically (individual 20 MW wind turbines) and cost has halved in a few years, it's reached the tipping point where it's no longer a hoax/cult but actually functions as a source of electricity. The next question is whether it's viable to shift from baseload that's provided by gas/coal running whenever the solar-wind conditions are poor, or whether batteries and other energy storage can be economically adopted yet.

[BING_XI_LAO]

I'm sorry Greenline, who started the war in Ukraine? That is what this whole argument has been about.

The Kiev Junta and its American controllers. They amassed a 100,000-strong army to invade Donetsk and began artillery bombardment preparation in February 2022.
This is proven by what happened in the last week of February 2022. Russian forces swept in deeply all the way along the border, from Kerson to Kharkov to Kiev, with the SOLE exception of the core Donbass area where the Kiev junta's "Anti-Terrorist" invasion force was assembled, and stopped the advance dead. It took TWO YEARS for the frontline to move back one settlement from Donetsk, at Avdeyevka. The Kiev regime is not interested in defending its country, they're interested in invading Russia. First the Donbass, now they've expanded the scope of their aggression to Crimea, Belgorod, and liberated Taurida. Perhaps even Pridnestrovie in light of recent bombardment. No live and let live. 

If the Ukraine was a real nation, they would simply make a concession - "okay, these are not a core part of our nation, these are regions transferred by the Communists we claim to resent decades ago, and they are mostly populated by Russians and by people who think Ukrainian is a type of Russian. So we will let them go. And we still exist as a nation regardless of whether we ally with Russia or USA." But the Ukrainian nationhood, like the USA, is not based on history or people, it is based on the ideology. And because ideology is universal it is forced on others, because it is political it uses violence to do so. Because all politics ultimately functions through violence - I mean REAL politics, not the democratic party-political dress up games.

The USA invaded and occupied the South in the War of Northern Aggression - now the South Will Rise Again, it's just Novorossiya not the Confederacy. Not to mention many other US interventions of which Iraq was the worst - because the US' very conception of nationhood is ideological, it is contrary to drawing the distinction between "our home" and "their home". Because there is no "we and they", only "democratic and authoritarian". But the authoritarian is defined as illegitimate, so everyone should be forced to be "democratic" (controlled by unaccountable capitalist oligarchs). So there is no limiting principle on the West's aggression, which is why it thought it could make Afghanistan, a rural landlocked islamist mountainous country, into a feminist democracy and literally spent 20 years trying to do it.

The fake, artificially imposed, history-free, and above PSYCHOLOGICALLY INSECURE nature of 'Ukrainian nationhood', is even worse than the US case. They are all Russian-speakers but force themselves to learn an idiot-sounding polish-bastardised, recently-formalised dialect. That's the level of LARPing these virtue-signalling, narcissistic Pharisaic chucklefucks are operating on. The ideological definition of nationhood prevents them from drawing the line between "ours and theirs" in the same way that it prevents Americans from understanding that Taiwan is a Chinese province which they are occupying. Because under the ideological framing, Taiwan isn't an island next to China which was setttled centuries ago and which to this day is inhabited almost exclusively by Chinamen - it is instead a "democracy". Similarly Ukrainians cannot admit that Taurida was settled by Russians and was never Ukrainian, they cannot admit that they have no history, no real national autonomous church, no language, no legitimacy. They cannot admit that they are Russians, they are venal in their hearts and addicted to being something "Western" so that they can imagine they are "better or wealthier" than their own kinsmen - the Pharisee capitalist liberal bourgeois mentality. 

The Ukraine's entire history will enter history books as having spanned only 35 years, during which it went from being the most stagnant post-Soviet state, so bad that it was a global hub of child trafficking, followed by becoming a proxy army of slave troopers controlled by a Nazi-Jewish warmongering cabal with the Jews in offices in Kiev-Lvov (Reznikov, Shymhal, Kolomoisky, Zelensky, several others but I forget their names since anti-semitism is boring) and the Nazis of Azov, 3rd Assault Brigade, etc. acting as blocking detachments who murder the conscripted Malorussians who try to escape or surrender to their fellow Russians. The total eradication of the Ukrainian state will make the world a better place when it finally happens. DAMNATIO MEMORIAE.

My hatred for democracy is based on so many different things. The FAKE, WORTHLESS 'public discourse'. The disconnect between 'debate' and 'votes' and how power is actually wielded. The TOTAL LACK OF ACCOUNTABILITY. The decaying infrastructure and standards in every aspect of life. The complacent snobbery and arrogance directed at China, a 5,000 year old civilisation now reclaiming top spot, just because they don't have our degenerate and useless government form. The 'morally-justified' warmongering and aggression. The fact that democracy requires my views to be illegal and that I would literally have more freedom of speech in China or Russia than I do here. For me, democracy means getting my social media accounts deleted for political statements while my SJW welfare parasite sister lives off others' taxes and tries to get me fired for having the wrong opinions. Democratic ideology inherently leads to individualist and hedonist immorality because it redefines truth as being determined by opinion. This is also what created the 'transgender' child mutilation death cult, because under "democracy" authogynephiliac sexual fantasies are treated as more "real" than physical existence. Because opinions are believed to have inherent worth under democracy ideology, therefore "I want to be a woman" must have some validity, and it's time to start forming fake vaginas out of ballsacks and fake penises that look like frankfurters sown together from skin flayed from the arms. Westerners have philosophically dedicated themselves to metaphysical untruth because of democracy. The entirety of democracy is a blame-shifting fake-partisan dress-up game and it doesn't really exist.

But perhaps the most concentrated form of how self-contradicting and insane "freedom democracy ideology" is, are these videos of Malorussians being hunted down like animals and "enslaved to fight for freedom" by the Western-backed, illegitimate, terrorist nazi-jew Kiev junta:



And the cherry on top, is that these "ideological" regimes in the US and the Ukraine are headed by Jews who simultaneously support their ethnically defined, settler ethnostate (I don't use those terms as an insult, instead I am envious that they are allowed this) in Israel, while it prosecutes a blatantly far more brutal war (against an equally genocidal but far less competent opponent, so I care not for the victims, but it's the hypocrisy I point out here). There has been more outrage in the Western regime media, and also in this thread quite possibly, over the "Bucha massacre" that was a mixture of fake, Ukrainian nazi executions, and artllery collateral, than over the mass deaths in Gaza.

Meanwhile the useful idiot Nazis of the Ukraine are happy to fight for Jews, and some even holiday in Israel or are Jewish themselves (like the leader of the Free Russian Legion). In a way, they are spitting on My Fuehrer's memory by serving the Jews. But in another way, they are merely extrapolating his intellectual mistakes - Hitler viewed the USSR as the worse enemy than the West. But it has always been Capitalism and bourgeois status-seeking (of which Ukrainian 'nationalism' is a manifestation, based not on blood but on an inferiority-superiority complex) which was the true threat to Volksgemeinschaft.

By the way, the Westerners will lose their shitty nazi-jew Kiev terror state to the Russian Liberators, not because of "republicans blocking supplies". But because the entire Western economy and government is so corrupt that it allows the arms industry to be a domain of private profit, which in turn leads to an absence of strategically but unprofitable overcapacity. It's poetic justice, the very corruption of oligarchy ("democracy") is why a single nation of 140 million can stand up against the aggression of the 500 million strong combined West, defeat your invasion, and liberate the Ukraine, not just militarily but also from the nationalist-democratic brainwashing.

[BING_XI_LAO]

Also, earlier this week I had a dream in which I was part of a huge, angry, exultant mob of Trump supporters. The Big Man's glorious golden mane was flowing in the distance and we followed. He was leading us to capture and kill politicians, Republicans and Democrats alike. Judges, Journalists, Common Core educators, Lawyers, NGO workers.... the lot. I wanted to nail as many of the bastards as possible so that maybe I'd be invited to Mar-a-Lago for dinner with the Emperor. And then I woke up with an erection.

[Mjmd]

I don't even know where to start and I don't think it would matter.

Edit: I'm also very sick and this would take at least an hour to go through  the conspiracy and disinformation and other stuff and I'm going back to sleep.

[Boro]

So this is what concentrated exposure to mjmd's political work does to people...

[Charr Babies]

Mjmd
Its not like China isn't building lots of solar and other renewables, but their incentive structure if memory serves skews towards the cheaper up front coal plants. I don't want them live like rats but I do want them to do better, just like I want the US to do better.

As I have always said if we worry about what is or isn't happening in our own backyard and less about other nations, we can MAGA.
Comparing the US to China on energy issues is like comparing a bank's carbon footprint to a foundry's.

A web search listed many problems China faces to combat Climate Change.
It is important to note that it would list problems any nation faces when asked, such as the following on USA. (why search terms are important, if you want to see dirt, it will show you dirt)

The United States faces several challenges in its fight against climate change. Let’s explore some of these issues:

1 - Lack of Binding Domestic Legislation:
While the U.S. has set aspirational nationwide net neutrality goals for 2050, very few countries have binding domestic legislation to meet those goals.
Without robust legal frameworks, achieving significant emissions reductions becomes challenging.

2 - Historical Ties to Fossil Fuels:
The U.S. economy has long been closely tied to the fossil fuel industry.
Transitioning away from fossil fuels poses economic and political challenges, especially in regions heavily dependent on coal, oil, and gas.

3 - High Per Capita Energy Usage:
The U.S. has high per capita and total energy usage.
Reducing emissions while maintaining economic growth requires innovative solutions and widespread adoption of clean energy technologies.

4 - Political Polarization:
Climate change has become a partisan issue in the U.S.
Political divisions hinder comprehensive climate action and delay necessary policy reforms.

5 - Pressure from Fossil Fuel Interests:
Fossil fuel companies often resist climate reforms.
Their influence can impede progress by lobbying against regulations and funding climate denial efforts.

6 - Global Leadership Expectations:
As the world’s largest economy and second-largest greenhouse gas emitter, the U.S. plays a crucial role in global climate action.
The world looks to the U.S. for credible leadership and commitments that drive international cooperation.

In summary, addressing climate change in the U.S. requires overcoming political divisions, transitioning from fossil fuels, and implementing effective policies. The nation’s actions will (if only) significantly impact global efforts to combat climate crisis

However, the summary on China ends with a positive note.

Certainly! China has been taking significant steps to combat climate change and promote sustainable development. Here are some positive actions:

1 - Developing Low-Carbon Technology:
China is a global leader in the production of eco-friendly technologies. It dominates the world market for solar panels and experiences growing demand for wind turbines, batteries, and electric vehicles.
By investing in and scaling these technologies, China contributes to a low-carbon economy and addresses both domestic and global climate needs.

2 - Reducing Coal Use and Air Pollution:
China has made efforts to dismantle coal-fired power plants and reduce overall emission levels.
Significant progress has been achieved in improving air quality, resulting in fewer smog days in major Chinese cities.

3 - Climate Adaptation and Resilience:
China has launched major initiatives to enhance its climate adaptation and resilience.
These efforts include strategies to protect wetlands, conserve animal species, and increase the proportion of grasslands and forested areas.

4 - Paris Agreement Commitments:
China pledged to cut emissions under the Paris Agreement.
While it remains a major coal producer, China’s commitment to reducing coal use and investing in renewable energy is crucial for global climate efforts.

5 - Global Impact:
As the world’s top emitter, China’s actions significantly impact global climate change.
Its commitment to net-zero emissions by 2050 could catalyze other nations to follow a low-carbon path.

In summary, China’s efforts are essential in shaping the global response to climate change. By balancing economic growth with environmental responsibility, China contributes to a more sustainable future.

So, lets look at Carbon emissions

1 - United States:
Annual CO₂ emissions estimates:
1970: Approximately 2,482,000 kilotons of CO₂ per year.
1990: About 5,051,000 kilotons of CO₂ per year.
2005: Around 6,001,000 kilotons of CO₂ per year.
2017: Approximately 5,416,000 kilotons of CO₂ per year.
2022: Roughly 5,071,000 kilotons of CO₂ per year.
Per capita emissions in 2022: 14.44 tons of CO₂ per year.

2 - Canada:
Annual CO₂ emissions estimates:
1970: Approximately 307,000 kilotons of CO₂ per year.
1990: About 461,000 kilotons of CO₂ per year.
2005: Around 556,000 kilotons of CO₂ per year.
2017: Approximately 563,000 kilotons of CO₂ per year.
2022: Roughly 552,000 kilotons of CO₂ per year.
Per capita emissions in 2022: 15.06 tons of CO₂ per year.

3 - China:
Annual CO₂ emissions estimates:
1970: Approximately 1,184,000 kilotons of CO₂ per year.
1990: About 2,079,000 kilotons of CO₂ per year.
2005: Around 6,018,000 kilotons of CO₂ per year.
2017: Approximately 10,065,000 kilotons of CO₂ per year.
2022: Roughly 12,000,000 kilotons of CO₂ per year.
Per capita emissions in 2022: 8.85 tons of CO₂ per year.

In summary, China currently emits the highest amount of CO₂ globally, followed by the United States and Canada. However, when considering population size, the per capita emissions tell a different story. It’s essential for all nations to continue working toward sustainable practices and reducing carbon emissions to combat climate change

It would seem China only caught up to USA with carbon emissions in 2005. I am sure We have been dissing China way before. As the summary indicated that when considering per capita emissions tells a different story. Very. It would seem Canada is the biggest offender even surpassing USA; while China is only at ~50% of those who point fingers, Americans.

The biggest takeaway of this is not just China’s carbon emissions per capita. One MUST consider China is the manufacturer of the world. 
Examples 
~80% of our shoes comes from China. 
More than 50% of Tesla is made in China. 
More than 50% of all EV produced are made in China (BYD just put Tesla in second place this year, and leave it in the dust in coming years)
China’s share in all the manufacturing stages of solar panels, such as polysilicon, ingots, wafers, cells, and modules, exceeds 80%
China accounted for over 60% of the global shipbuilding tonnage
As of recent estimates, around 95% of the total iPhone supply still comes from China
(so much for some claims China can only produce cheap junk. lol)

China is doing all the DIRTY work for the rest of the world and still able to maintain such low emission.

Comparing the US to China on energy issues is like comparing a bank's carbon footprint to a foundry's.

The future is bright! - If only the rest of the world is as green as China

---

[greenline]

The world would be a better place if everyone could acknowledge that some level of global warming is just going to happen, and there's no sense in trying to alter human activity with the goal of postponing it. Mitigating and adaptive efforts would only take a fraction of the effort involved in environmentalist activism and would be much more immediately useful.

By the way, the Westerners will lose their shitty nazi-jew Kiev terror state to the Russian Liberators, not because of "republicans blocking supplies". But because the entire Western economy and government is so corrupt that it allows the arms industry to be a domain of private profit, which in turn leads to an absence of strategically but unprofitable overcapacity. It's poetic justice, the very corruption of oligarchy ("democracy") is why a single nation of 140 million can stand up against the aggression of the 500 million strong combined West, defeat your invasion, and liberate the Ukraine, not just militarily but also from the nationalist-democratic brainwashing.

Profit seeking industry alone can't explain the decline of the western military-industrial complex. The industry that was commandeered for the first and second world wars was profit seeking, yet it was by far the deadliest machine backing war in history, more so than the current one we have now. The decline instead relates to the changes in administration and social mores following the revolutions of the 60s - after that point, America and the West are no longer able to field the humans needed that could even manage such numbers of equipment. So wars are prepared on the expectation that a small cadre of elite volunteers will make or break things.

[Mjmd]

I mean we have Greenline. When we say limit rise to "x" we are saying we are accepting some amount of global warming is going to happen. Its just we are trying to limit that rise. To put it in terms you care about, how many climate refuges do you want?

Ah yes the decline in western military industrial complex where the #1 arms exporter is the US and the #2 is now France. Ukraine was only the 4th top receiver of US arms in 2022. Its actually amazingly frustrating how much more we could send and not care. But then you get headlines of "US is low on some system, everyone should panic" even though that system may be outdated or not relevant to likely future wars. Again, we have 800 older models of Abrams we are NEVER using and it would be a net benefit to the US taxpayer to get rid of. There are certain bottlenecks in things like artillery shells, because the US doesn't fight a lot of artillery wars and nor are we likely to / people forget how fast artillery shells go when you do get that type of warfare. The main thing we are lacking is the political will.