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Woebearer Desert Domination

Woot! I finally finished a game and report! Its only been what.... two years since my last one?!?

My plan for this game was to establish as many different holy cities as possible. The rules state that only holy cities can build Market/Grocers/Banks, to multiply the cash generated by their shrines. I’m not sure if putting these improvements in cities where I have no intention of building a shine is strictly in the spirit of the variant, but I need 5 banks to build Wall Street so I think that it should be fine.

My religion plans are this: Buddhism and Hinduism would be founded in the capital. After Bronze Working and a whipped settler I will found Judaism in my second city, Oracle to CoL for Conf city three, and a prophet lightbulb Christianity for city four. By the time I would get around to Divine Right or Philosophy I would have some more cities under my yolk to accept the faith. I would make one of the capital religions the one true faith and spread it as much as possible, with the second spread when convenient. In order to secure the needed GPs for this endeavor I would do the unthinkable, I would build Stonehenge in my capital. I normally HATE Stonehenge, but since this game didn’t have many Calendar resources it wasn’t too bad to hold off researching it. Along with the Oracle and some hired holy men, I got all of the early prophets I needed for lightbulbs (Theology, Civil Service, part of Divine Right, and Paper), two shrines, and half of a GA.

On the war front, Axes, Spears, and Swords would be the weapon of choice for my first opponent – Catherine. Unfortunately, as I was ready to roll a stack of about 15 units (including Archers for garrisons) into Russia, Nappy decides he wants to be first in the ass kicking parade and declares on 75AD. I start to move my stack over to oblige him, but a few turns later Cathy gets a little jealous and declares in 150AD. Some emergency whipping and a little troop diversion took care of the French situation to my south (luckily they were never able to disconnect my Iron down there) and I sent my stack back over to Russia to give Cathy the attention she craved.

The early melee units went through her outlying cities like butter, and Construction allowed me to send in some Cats to help take out her core. At the end of the first Russian War (640AD), Cathy was left with two meager cities and a permanently crippled empire. Since she declared war, I was able to make peace and had no residual diplomatic effects from the struggle. Meanwhile I was able to hold off the French until they were finally ready to make nice.

With Cathy crippled, Nappy on the other side of the map, and Washington the most advanced AI, I turned my attention to Fredrick. Thanks to a lightbulbed CS and a hasty detour to Machinery, I upgraded some key CR3 units to Macemen and headed towards Germany. I was able to steal two cities away from Freddie, but I soon began to run out of steam against his entrenched forces and had to call the war short (1270AD). Cathy had settled an annoying city right in a clear zone of her former territory and was dropping culture bombs in there to squeeze out her former holdings. Since she was still so weak I wheeled my stacks back around to finally snuff out the Russians once and for all (1535AD).

After the second Russian war, I focused on building up my economy, including spreading Bud/Hind, chopping Versailles in former Russian territory, building Markets, Grocers, and Banks in qualifying cities, and building the Spiral Minaret and Wall Street in Mecca. By the end of the game Mecca was pumping out 177g a turn, which I don’t think included the Minaret money (can anyone confirm this? It didn’t look like it was counted towards the total for the city, which means it didn’t get multiplied by the improvements… what a gyp!). Liberalism was used to grab Economics for a Great Merchant to generate some trade mission income. I built the Taj in Mecca, the golden age was then used to help accelerate to Chemistry and a second Golden Age facilitated construction of a swarm of Grenadiers.

Being backwards technologically and harboring a good chunk of land, I turned my attention to the French, and with great speed obliterated Nappy (1680AD). After a while to solidify my borders and rebuild my forces, I rolled through Germany. With the fall of Berlin my pent up border culture put me over the top for Domination victory in 1824.

Wonders built:
Mecca – Stonehenge, Oracle, Spiral Minaret, Taj Mahal, Kremlin, Statue of Liberty, Bud Shrine, Hind Shrine, Ironworks, Wall Street

Damascus – Great Library, Oxford University

Medina – Great Lighthouse, Globe Theater

Rostov – Versailles

I didn’t build either Epic, I think because I didn’t want to pollute the GP pools where they would have been most beneficial. For some reason I can’t get a total on my GPs, but I had a crap load of Prophets, about four of Scientists (one from Physics and another coming on the last turn), and an Artist and Merchant from techs.

Overall I think I did pretty well. I’m not a warmonger by nature, usually I take just enough to secure my core and develop enough of an economy to win by Space. My religion plan worked perfectly, and I only really felt the pinch financially when I started running culture to combat WW and enforce my borders. Aside from the double team in the beginning, the AIs played nice and rolled over as expected. I was able to stay just enough ahead in techs to out gun the enemy, but not so far ahead that it was uninteresting (except the French… who would of thought it :P).
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Sounds like a good game there. nod Why is it that you hate Stonehenge though? It's useful for a lot of different gameplans, especially those involving religion due to the Great Prophet points.

What was interesting was comparing your early attacks against some of the other games. Even though you defeated Catherine at a very early date, the actual Domination victory was in line with most of the other games. Comparing to haphazard's slow buildup makes for a good contrast. There's more than one way to play a good game of Civ!

Thanks for reporting! But I think I would have built at least Heroic Epic somewhere with all the warring you did. lol
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Woebearer Wrote:By the end of the game Mecca was pumping out 177g a turn, which I don’t think included the Minaret money (can anyone confirm this? It didn’t look like it was counted towards the total for the city, which means it didn’t get multiplied by the improvements… what a gyp!).

Spiral Minaret makes each building of your state religion produce 1 gold per turn in the building's city. So Spiral Minaret can give each city up to +3 gold if it has a temple, monastery, and cathedral. This shows up in the left panel of the city screen with each building - you'll see the temple listed as "+1 smile +1 (gold icon)".

Spiral Minaret has no effect (besides culture and GPP) if you don't have a state religion. Also, it expires at Computers.


Quote:For some reason I can’t get a total on my GPs

You can work out the total from the cost needed to generate the next one (which doesn't include the free ones.) If the cost for the next one was 1600 GPP, then you generated 12 naturally (ten from 100 to 1000, then 1200 and 1400.)

- T-hawk, friendly neighborhood tech expert smile
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T-hawk Wrote:You can work out the total from the cost needed to generate the next one (which doesn't include the free ones.) If the cost for the next one was 1600 GPP, then you generated 12 naturally (ten from 100 to 1000, then 1200 and 1400.)

- T-hawk, friendly neighborhood tech expert smile

Thanks for the info, T-hawk! I was wondering what the pattern was. Most of my games have not emphasized great people, so when I saw the increment had doubled I wondered what was going on. Does it continue at 200 per, or is there another step up at some point?

I got a lot more great people this game than I ever have before, and got a lot more out of them. I'll have to try Philosophical again.
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Sullla Wrote:Why is it that you hate Stonehenge though? It's useful for a lot of different gameplans, especially those involving religion due to the Great Prophet points.

I know its irrational, but I hate that it keeps you from building monuments/obelisks in your cities because the actual building doesn't expire and in fact gets better as time goes on. I'd love to see a patch that would keep monuments for the duration of the game (no one gets tired of building statues) and have Stonehenge just give a straight +1 culture to all your cities instead of replacing monuments. From a flavor perspective the SH/Monument connection doesn't even make sense after the obelisk change.

That and the fact that I never have time to build it. By the time I'm through with settlers/workers/units/rax/oracle its either already fallen to the ai or its too close to calendar to bother with. If I want a prophet I'll usually order one up with a priest or two and the oracle.

Sullla Wrote:What was interesting was comparing your early attacks against some of the other games. Even though you defeated Catherine at a very early date, the actual Domination victory was in line with most of the other games. Comparing to haphazard's slow buildup makes for a good contrast. There's more than one way to play a good game of Civ!

Reviewing my game I think I could of finished it quite a bit earlier (see the amount of time between the French falling and victory), but I was too focused on building up my forces for a final definitive attack against Fredrick and building a fun but probably useless Wall Street. I could of rallied my remaining forces from the French offensive and hit a couple of sweet spots to get me the coverage needed for the win.

Sullla Wrote:Thanks for reporting! But I think I would have built at least Heroic Epic somewhere with all the warring you did. lol

Yeah, it surprised me when I discovered that I hadn't built it, classic "builder not a fighter" kinda mistake, I also never switched to Nationalism the whole time.... what a chump wink

Thanks for the great events, I might not report on them, but I play to some extent everything that comes down the pike here. Hopefully I will get off my butt and report more of my attempts - win, lose, or ehhhhh screw it I quit.

Looking forward to unleashing some death from above in the sky gods... I hate to admit this, but I've never build an air unit in Civ4 - I'm kinda curious what they do :P
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haphazard1 Wrote:Does it continue at 200 per, or is there another step up at some point?

Yes - the increment steps up by 100 every ten great people.

GPs one through ten: 100, 200, 300, ... , 1000
GPs eleven through twenty: 1200, 1400, 1600, ... , 3000
GPs twenty-one through thirty: 3300, 3600, 3900, ... , 6000

And multiply everything by 1.5x for Epic speed.

Re Stonehenge, as Sulla said, more of the wonder's value comes from the early Great Prophet than from the actual obelisks. An early shrine, or a lightbulb of Civil Service or Theology, can be very helpful.

That said, the Oracle produces a Prophet just about as easily (only 30 hammers more) and gives a better actual payoff. I usually build Stonehenge only if Stone happens to be available, if I'm not already Creative, and if I don't have a specific plan for the first couple cheap Great People to be something other than Prophets.
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T-hawk Wrote:Spiral Minaret has no effect (besides culture and GPP) if you don't have a state religion. Also, it expires at Computers.
the wonder expires at computers. but because monasteries go obsolete at SciM, they stop getting the 1g from the spiral after SciM.
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