Gavagai in Wonderland

[Gavagai]

If you are playing in this game, look no further.

[Gavagai]

OK... Not seeing starts make snakepicking a problem. This is a Pangea map and there are two possible types of starts which would transpire into two possible types of games. We can either start inland of coastal. If inland, I want Egypt -> Rome -> Expansive -> Imperialistic. The idea is to grab lots of land and not die, preferably crashing a neighbor early to create a safe backline. If coastal, I really want financial to make use of coasts and play a longer game. However, I do not know beforehand what kind of start I would have.
With that in mind, I want to aim at getting Hannibal of Byzantium. Hannibal can be put to good use in both kinds of starts and Byzantium is just the most underpriced thing under our system. A bit risky if I get an inland start as I kind of painting a huge target on myself early. But I hope I'll manage.

[Gavagai]

Alrighty, now that ive caught up..

Locking in- Hannibal, ?
Commodore you are up

...ok, I need a plan B.

[Gavagai]

I took Ragnar. I decided that I would really really hate starting on the coast without the financial trait. It means that I have to choose between Ragnar and Elizabeth. Elizabeth is better but very slow and I would hate to start inland with Elizabeth and without at least a civ with a good early UU. Now, Liz is 5 points and the only good early UU available for 5 points is Phalanx. This is pretty meh and Greece has terrible starting techs. On the other hand, Ragnar opens up not only a potential synergy with Rome but also stuff like Egypt, Zulu, and Persia - all decent choices, especially with Mali already on the map. This is four civs and I have only 3 players choosing before me which means I am guaranteed to get one of those. Therefore, Ragnar it is.

[Gavagai]

Also, if a mod is reading this, can you, please, stick lurker thread? I was really confused for a while when I saw nine threads in an eight-player game.

[Gavagai]

Took myself Rome. I want to state on record that I think Egypt would be a better choice, despite the loss of synergy. But I have already played Egypt recently, in PB38, this is the only reason I didn't pick it.

[Gavagai]

8. RegentMan ------------------------ Peter of Ottomans
7. Donovan Zoi ----------------------- Mao of Inca
6. Alhazard ---------------------------- Zara of Mongolia
5. Gavagai ----------------------------- Ragnar of Rome
4. Chumchu --------------------------- Mehmad of Aztecs
3. Irismono & GeneralKilCavalry --- Roosevelt of Mali
2. Commodore ------------------------ Brennus of India
1. Superdeath ------------------------- Hannibal of Egypt

First thought: people really hate Lizzy, feel bad for her. Only four fin leaders available, and she did not get chosen.

[Gavagai]

1) Superdeath, Hannibal of Egypt. The absolute winner of snakepick, hands down. This is probably the strongest combo you could possibly get under our rules. Charismatic is underpriced, I do not think it is worse than Philosophical. And Egypt is arguably the best civ.
Whether SD would be able to use this combo properly is another question, of course. I have scouted his land in PB42, and what he has done with it makes my eyes bleed. He will most likely go for Stonehenge and then underexpand. I will put him at low danger despite the awesome combo because I do not trust his execution.
2) Commodore, Brennus of India. India is very strong in capable hands and Brennus is one of the best among low-priced leaders. And Commodore is a very experienced player. I think he is a bit weak as a strategist which does show itself in a lategame but he is very, very good at ancient warfare and Cha + earlier snowball give him powerful tools for an early conquest... in a field with lots of weaker players. If he takes himself enough land early, his strategic weaknesses would not matter. Very, very high danger. I will pin my hopes on Commodore starting close to someone pricky and getting caught up in a grueling duel with him (her, them).
3) Irismono, GeneralKilCavalry, Roosevelt of Mali. Now, this is interesting. These guys are new and there are two opposite ways to interpret their pick. They took Mali first which can be a sign of a frightened newb who only thinks about not getting rushed early. Or it can be a sign of people with extensive ladder / Deity background who overvalue skirmishers and don't understand how OP fin is in a no tech trading game (which means financial leader as the first pick is straight up better than Mali). Their second pick was Roosevelt which can be seen a sign of a player who does not understand what he is doing and, possibly, got tempted by a synergy between Roosevelt and Mali UB which adds no actual value. Or, it can be seen as a sign of a smart Deity player who overvalues organized and has noticed that no other ind leader has been taken. Questionable choice anyway because I still see no reason to value Roosevelt over Liz at that point. For now, I'd estimate them as experienced players with a rich but limited background. Most likely they will go Oracle-Colossus and will make themselves a desirable target for whoever starts nearby. Want them as neighbors, do not want them to start near Commodore, he will devour them. Very low danger.
4) Chumchu, Mehmed of Aztecs. This combo is very similar to the one I have played in PB16 and is very strong. It also relies on cheap altars, the difference being is that fin is swapped for exp. Very good for inland starts, OKish for coastal starts. Has a kind of long-term plan with organized, though the lack of financial would hurt. Chumchu was around for a while but I do not remember him playing solo. Maybe I am wrong. Moderate danger, mostly due to the power of the pick.
5) Gavagai, Ragnar of Rome. Moderately pleased with my pick. I did not make a mistake of not taking financial trait which is a plus. Aggressive praetorians are not nearly as good as it sounds. But I will try to make them work.
6) Alhazard, Zara of Mongolia. Another player who has chosen a good non-financial leader over a bad financial one. In contrast to Chumchu, does not have a good combo with civ, Mongolia is underwhelming without charismatic. Still, it gives an option to build mounted units with three promos which not insignificant and there are not many good civs for 0 points, so his pick can be justified. Al has been lurking the forums for forever, even though he has not played many games, it counts for something. Low to moderate danger.
7) Donovan Zoi, Mao of Inca. A variant of the combo I am playing in PB42, trades cheaper gold multipliers for more culture from terraces. I think his variant is slightly weaker than mine but this is contestable. From my observations, people here generally undervalue RB-mod exp. As a player, DZ has rather fatal mechanical flaws, akin to Superdeath, but he is creative, not afraid of trying unorthodox strategies and has a lot of experience. Moderate danger.
8) RegentMan, Peter of Ottomans. Another newcomer but someone whom DZ and T-hawk recognize. His pick is underwhelming. Not that it is bad but he easily could have taken something much better. Peter + Egypt or Elizabeth plus something for zero points. Low danger.

[BaII]

Do you think Izzy has more value than people are giving her credit for?

[Gavagai]

Do you think Izzy has more value than people are giving her credit for?

Izzy is very good but she is worse than Lizzy who has the same price. I suspect you are mixing up Izabella and Elizabeth here
I think that you need some very good arguments for not picking financial trait in an NTT game with base BTS. In that respect, Commodore and chumchu can defend their picks as they have sacrificed financial trait for really, really powerful stuff. But this is not true for RegentMan, Irismono / GKC, and Alhazard.